2MB floppy on my A3000
38 messages in this thread
I'm a little behind on this one. Has anyone tried a third party HD
Drive in their Amiga?
Bruce H.
-Via Whap!
It will not work directly. The Amiga chipset is limited to a transfer rate
that will not accomodate the data comming off a HD floppy at normal speed.
This special floppy in the amiga works by cutting the drive speed in half
when a HD diskette has been inserted.
John A. Toebes, VIII – via Whap!
Neat thing about the new HD drive:
Change the BlocksPerTrack in your DI0: mountlist for CrossDOS and
the new drive will read and write PC 1.44MB drives. This is with
the current version of CrossDOS, from a few months ago.
Very nice!
Denny:
How did you get one of those new drives? Where? How Much?
– Whapp!ng from the North Coast Michael
Micheal,
They're shipping in new A3000s and A3000Ts. Not available separately yet,
as far as I know, although I'd expect to see them before long.
Denny, it does not appear that all 3000's are shipping with the HD drives.
It looks more like a 'gee, we need some drives to put in these machines and
what is that pile of drives doing over there?' type thing. But then again,
I am only guessing.
John A. Toebes, VIII – via Whap!
I am a bit surprised at the closed door information out there regarding
improvements & changes to the Amiga line. Obviously, developers, under
non-disclosure are privy to some really neat stuff that's coming down the
pike… but just who IS CBM trying to keep this info from?
I mean, it's not like there are a bunch of AMiga clone makers out there
just waiting in the wings to steal Amiga technology…
I would think that letting the Amiga community as a whole know about what
is at least in the final stages of development would generate some
excitement for the product line among current users, and at least press
realeases that might catch they eye (envy?) of non-Amiga users.
– Whapp!ng from the North Coast Michael
It's most likely an attempt to avoid the Osborne Syndrome, where everyone
waits for your next product, and no one buys your current product. Adam
Osborne proved you could sink an entire company using the power of this
Effect.
andy
Andy:
You're right, of course, and I know better… just blowing off some
steam.
– Whapp!ng from the North Coast Michael
While the "Osborne Syndrome" is definitely a phenomenon to be avoided, I've
never beleived that is what killed Osborne's company. Sales of the Osborne
1 didn't dry up so much because everyone was waiting for the new machine
(the Osborne Executive, right?), as for the fact that the original Osborne
had that horrible little 50 column screen, while companies like Kaypro and
Actrix had portable on the market with 9", 80-column screens and more
floppy storage.
Denny,
I saw a sales chart back then….sales dropped to almost 0 pretty
much as soon as word got out on the Executive. Or so the magazine I read
(forget which one it was) printed. One would presume the figures they
printed were fairly reliable.
Don
Until the Executive was announced, Osborne was a contender. I don't
remember Actrix being around much then, and Kay was still trying to get
distribution together. Osborne recognized the threat of the Kaypro, which
is why they preannounced the Executive.
andy
Denny,
I believe you're mistaken. The Osborne's sales dropped from $100million
a year to 0 within 60 days. I own an Osborne I, and your right (but it was
40 columns…we had the 80 column option added). I don't believe that the
Kaypro and Actrix were 'serious' competition at the time.
Michael,
Think about what you're saying. IF Commodore said something like:
"We're comming out with a super neato new version of Computer X within the
next year"
What do you think would happen to current sales of Computer X?
Do you recall Osborne Computers and what happened when they
announced the Executive about 6 months before it was available? What
happened was that sales of their current model dropped to almost 0 and
literally drove them into bankruptcy.
Don
Don:
I understand that, and as I said… I know better.
However, have you noticed how car companies (who upgrade their models EVERY
YEAR advertise the new stuff while at the SAME TIME clearancing out the
old?) 🙂
Some folks don't need the 'super-neato' version, but would jump at the
opportunity to get a bargain on the old stuff. (Don't you think an A2000 at
say, $649 would attract some attention, eh?). While others, want the
lastest & greatest.
Marketing is an art, not a science. Have people stopped buying Macs &
clones because Apple & IBM created a joint venture and announced a combined
effort on hardware & software? Hardly.
Obviously, the above questions are rhetorical… just food for thought…
– Whapp!ng from the North Coast Michael
Michael,
Apples and oranges. Car companies come out with new models EVERY
year, not just now and then. They also lower prices on existing stock, and
quit making the old models in May or June and they take trade-ins.
Computer companies come out with new models every now and then,
generally already have pretty low prices and rarely take trade-ins. In
fact, they usually keep making the older model…although there certainly
are exceptions.
Don
"…and they take trade-ins."
Don:
They do not take trade-ins. The dealer takes trade-ins and then either
resells or wholesales them, much the ame way some computer stores do.
Are you saying that you haven't seen the prices on older technology
computers drop prior to the release of newer technology products? How much
was a 386/25DX a year ago? What was the cost of an AT BridgeBoard three
months ago?
Strange as it may seem, I believe the analogy is valid.
– Whapp!ng from the North Coast Michael
"Computer companies …. rarely take trade-ins…."
Except Commodore, who at least has offered a trade-up for the A1000 owners
twice now. I took advantage of it, as I'm sure many others here did as
well. Despite whatever else is said about Commodore marketing, they did
that right, and I appreciate them for it.
There's also the 'PowerUp' offer, but I see that as more of a marketing
gimmick, rather than a true trade-up. I'm sure other computer companies
have also offered trade-ups (Apple comes to mind, but their deal wasn't so
good) as well, but Commodore has consistently supported the Amiga community
in this regard, I think.
–jp–seattle–
Well, I wouldn't call what the dealer does taking a trade-in (having just
bought a new car yesterday) more like offering to take a vehicle off your
hands for a discount on a new vehicle. The second you drive a new car off
the lot, it loses about a 1/3 of its value. If computer dealers took
tradeins like car dealers (and my local computer dealer does), people would
complain that they are being ripped off for the old machine. In
comparison, Commodore has been extremely generous over the years.
John A. Toebes, VIII – via Whap!
Michael,
Read the history of Osborne Computer.
from The Home Computer Wars Mike Tomcyzk (c) 1984 Compute! Books
"Unfortunately, after the Osborne I was introduced, Adam Osborne couldn't
follow his opening act fast enough with next-generation products, and his
company went under due to a combination of industry attrition, financial
problems, and competition from more sophisticated portables like the
IBM-compatible Compaq, which appealed to the same market as the Osborne. As
fortunes tumbled, the company went from 1000 employess to 80 employees in
five months and filed Chapter 11 bankruptcy in September 1983."
Vic:
Osborne lost out to the competition. The poor marketing decisions were a
last ditch effort to forestall the decline of the company; an attempt to
buy time. Announcing the Executive was a marketing decision made as a
REACTION to the decline of Osborne and the rise of competition, not just a
stupid mistake that killed the sales of the Osborne I. That is the history
as I read it.
– Whapp!ng from the North Coast Michael
Michael, That may be "history" as Tomcyzk wrote it, but it's not the
history as Vic (and I) lived it. During that time I was working in the Bay
area for a company that was seriously considering leasing the Osborne
offices/production space. I knew a lot of the Osborne employees and what
really happened was the total drop off of sales due to the preannouncement
a future machine.
-sja
Steve:
I guess that we're looking at the same events and interpreting them
differently. I'm just guessing when I say the REASON the Exec was pre
announced so early was due to _market factors_, not just a stupid mistake,
but if that is true (and I do believe it is) then the drop off in sales
would have occured anyway (even if at a slower rate, it would have still
sounded the death toll for the company).
I understand your perspective, and you may be 100% correct… I just tend
to believe that marketing decisions that appear to be stupid to outsiders,
(even non-marketers on the inside ala CBM), have their roots in the
not-so-obvious (and therefore appear to be stupid blunders).
Michael:
Another thing that killed Osborne (as far as I'm concerned) was their lack
of upgradability. I bought an O-1 back in 1982 when I moved to FL (I bought
it in NY and brought all my files down on O-1 floppies as my Northstar was
going to be packed up for a while), and 1 week after I bought it they went
over to the newer style case that gave better ventilation than the original
vaccuum molded case did, and in FL here (my original apt was NOT air
conditioned) I had lots of trouble running my O-1 (it was overheating), but
they refused to let me upgrade it to the newer style, their answer was
"sell your old one, and buy a new one" well, I packed it up, and forgot
about it, and finally sold it for $300.00 in 1988. Never had anything more
to do with Osborne computers.
-Mike Schiller
In sunny Fort Lauderdale
John,
I love that scenario… I can really get a good visual image of the
assembly-type-person scanning piles of Amiga guts and spotting those
drives. :>
– Lorenz K. Sievers –
"…I'd expect to see them before long."
Denny:
That's good news. I get tired of having to transfer stuff from MSDOS HD
floppies to 720" floppies.
BTW, hope your first New Years in wedded bliss is a blast!
– Whapp!ng from the North Coast Michael
"to 720" floppies."
uh… if you think those are big, you should see the drive.
– Whapp!ng from the North Coast Michael
Thanks, Michael! 😉 This New Years should be fun. Next New Years, when
she's finally 21, should be even better. (Grin)
Denny:
> They're shipping in new A3000s and A3000Ts. Not available separately yet,
> as far as I know, although I'd expect to see them before long.
Must be in US made 3000T. My 3000T, which appears to come from Germany via
KLM) did not have the HD drives
Here is my Crossdos Mountlist, how should I modify it to make my 2MB floppy
drive work as a 1.44 MB IBM drive with CrossDos and IBEM??
DI0:
Device = mfm.device
Unit = 0
Flags = 1 /* Allow 5 1/4" drives */
Surfaces = 2
BlocksPerTrack = 9
Reserved = 1
Interleave = 0 * SecOrg = 1 */
LowCyl = 0; HighCyl = 79 /* 80 track drive */
FileSystem = L:MSDOSFileSystem
Buffers = 5
BufMemType = 0
Stacksize = 4000
Priority = 5
GlobVec = -1
DosType = 0x4D534400
Mount = 0; #
Thanks
– via Whap!
Pat,
Just change the BlocksPerTrack entry to 18.
John, at this point does it look like a 2000 can handle this new HD floppy?
Ron
Yes, because of the technology involved, the 2000 will be able to handle
the HD floppy. Now actually getting one of these floppys is a completely
different story.
John A. Toebes, VIII – via Whap!
Ron,
It sure will. I tried the 3000 in my 2000–didn't quite fit physically, but
worked well.
Wierd!?! Oh well until C= admits to it I guess we'll have to wait.
A wise move to wait, but I wouldn't hold your breath expecting something
soon.
You mean I have an option? Since it is a specific drive and C= isn't
talking what other options do we have?