#GIF and ADPro
31 messages in this thread
I have a slight problem that I don't know if it is really a problem. I
want to thank those of you that have helped me with my desktop video
problems thus far. I have found a copy of jpeg2dctv and mv. No my problem
lies with printing out the GIF's found in CORNER. They are rather large.
I have a copy of ADPro I was going to load some of these images into ADP
and then transfer them into HAM in order to print them and use POSTER maker
and other programs. I though that this would be a rather easy task.
Except that when I attempted to load the GIF into the program, it said that
the image was too large. Is this because I don't have enough RAM or
because ADPro doesn't handle images that large? I have never understood
this feature. I thought that ADPro can handle images of up to 3000×3000 or
something very large like that. Right? Anyone know?
You don't have enough RAM. ADPro can indeed handle pretty big images, but
you need a boatload of RAM to handle them. For any image A x B pixels in
size, the amount of memory you need is A times B times 4 bytes, of
contiguous FAST ram. In addition, ADPro itself is running in fast RAM, so
practically speaking, with 2MB of Fast RAM, you can usually just barely
load a 640 x 400 image. (Or possibly not quite be able to load an image of
that size, since ADPro may have grown since I upgraded from 2MB Fast to 4MB
Fast, back in the days of ADPro 1.x…)
There are a lot of possible solutions to this. There are several PD
programs which can scale images down a bit: This may be necessary to load
into ADPro. Or you could add more RAM. Or, if you have enough RAM but
have a lot of other programs running, close them.
In the long run, I recommend more RAM. With 4MB of FAST ram, I've had no
trouble loading most images which fall my way, although I rarely see
anything over 800 x 600. A 1024 x 768 GIF might push it a bit, though.
–>Steve Bennett
P.S. To ASDG, if you're reading this, a wonderful feature to add to ADPro
which I always wanted before I bought more memory would be a Scale on Load
so one could shrink an image to fit available memory at load time…
P.P.S To Black Belt Systems, I always wanted this feature in
IP/Imagemaster, too… <grin>
I agree with your suggestions about ADPro. I always thought that was
stupid not to be able to scale upon a load. I'll be getting that
additional 2 megs of RAM soon I hope! Thanks for clearing that up!
Jonathan,
Graphics eat memory for breakfast.
Your problem is you are short of contiguous fast memory. As I recall,
3mb of memory allows loading images up to 620×480 (color), 5mb for 800×600
(color), more for higher resolutions. The formula is MinimumBytes = Width
x Height x 4 for color images. (The multipication factor is 2 for
grayscale images.) This all has to be a contiguous block of fast memory,
CHIP Ram does not count. 🙂 ((My rule of thumb figures are for total
memory in a system using standard 2mb increments.))
Bill, K3OZM
Thanks! Hopefully 4 megs of fast will be enough. I should be getting them
in the mail soon, I hope!
You Don't have enuff RAM it seems mate I had that happen on occasion as
Well with LARGE Rez pictures
just have to wait for the addtl. RAM, then!
Johnathan,
Memory requirements are Width pixels X height pixels X (32 bits per Pixel/8
bits per byte) = required memory to h old picture. Then you have to allow
extra for the memory to hold the Adpro program, filesystem, disk icons,
workbench and other normally active stuff.
Not that the 32 bits per pixel I believe is 24 bits color and 8 bits of
brightness info that ADPro uses in its "raw" format processing. I just
read that section of the manual yesterday (page 25) and they don't say what
the 32 bits is used for but that usage is what I've heard "32 bit color" is
to some programs on other platforms.
wmc
oh, yeah! That makes sense. Thanks!
The Extra 8 bits of the 32 bit rez for ADpro is for Alpha Compositing I
Believe
Peter,
Thanks for the info – now all I need to know is what in the ____ is Alpha
Compositing?! I've run into that term before and everytime I see it it is
used as if I know what it means and I don't! If you could help me with a
defintion of that I would be most grateful.
wmc
Hmmmm I'll get back to ya so I can give ya the "CORRECT" purpose of Alpha
Compositing instead of telling you what I think it is hahahahaha MIDGARD
GRAPHICS 1736 W 9 ST BROOKLYN NY 11223
Peter,
It would be muchly appreciate as it is a buzz term I see from time to time
but haven't really a clue as to what it means technically.
wmc
Hi Peter,
Alpha Channel is an extra 8 bits (24 + 8 = 32) that defines the
transparancy of an image. The transparancy is controlled by an 8-bit
grayscale image where all white means 100 percent of the image will appear,
and all black means zero percent. So, as a simple example in ADPro, create
a nicely colored backdrop and save it as oh, 320×400. Now create a black
backdrop, in the same resolution, and type (TEXT_VISUAL) some text. Use the
BLUR operator and make it real fuzzy, then convert it into an 8-bit
grayscale. Save it. Load a nice 320×400 picture into ADPro, switch to COMP
(rather than REPL) then select the ALPHA Loader. It will ask for your color
image first; select your color backdrop. It will now ask for your ALPHA
image, load the 8-bit text image. The compositing controls are disabled (I
haven't found they make a difference, at least.) When ADPro finishes
compositing, you should see your text in your picture with a nice gradation
and soft edges nicely blending into the base picture. Have fun …
– viola Whap!
Steve
Thanks for the definition of Alpha channel.
wmc
Like a lot of things I do (backwards). After I wrote the simple example, I
tested it. When making the Alpha image, the Backline or Backdrop offers
creating an 8-bit image. When using Text-Visual, set the RGB values to 255
each, and you can use the blur function. I went further and created two
images of text, one really sharp and one really blurry. I also created a
plain black image. I loaded the blurry text image and rolled it a few
pixels diagonally, reduced its dynamic range to 128 (which I should've done
while creating it) and resaved it. After loading a 24bit colorful picture
(actually a VistaPro image), I selected composite mode and the Alpha
Loader. I loaded the black image and then the blurry text. It shaded the
text into the picture 50% but using the colors of the picture directly
underneath. I next loaded the colored backdrop image, then the sharp text
Alpha image. The end result is colored text with a nice soft drop shadow.
I'm going to convert this scenario to an Arexx script… someday.
– viola Whap!
Steve,
Sounds like a very interesting tutorial. Maybe you could compile them into
an image processing "hints and tricks" book. Or at least a series of
articles.
I'm saveing your message and will try your recipe out…
Thanks.
wmc
Well… Thanks, but I've just barely started with ADPro (and lost a lot
of what I've done with a hard disk crash, but recovering slowly). I'm
taking what I've learned about the Alpha Compositor and using it with FRED
to make scrolling, drop-shadowed titles over a 24 bit animation… ran out
of room on my tiny 80 meg hard-drive. (bummer)
– viola Whap!
Time for that removable cartridge MO 650 Meg!
wmc
Gotta make some money, first!
– viola Whap!
Thanx for giving Wayne the Explanation,I kept forgetting to look in the
Adpro for the Alpha Comp info for him
The instructions for the Alpha Loader are not in the ADPro manual, its in a
text file on disk (at least 2.1.5). Something I should mention… Alpha
channel truly exists on a few 24 bit display boards. The idea is to send a
24 bit image and an 8 bit image to a video switcher which does the
compositing using the 8 bit info as the template or frisket and composite
the image over another video source. Again, this technology was brought
about to smoothly anti-alias a graphic over video that may have complex and
unknown colors (to the computer generating the graphic). This is what
realisticly (?) puts the Enterprise orbiting above a planet.
– viola Whap!
Thanx Steve,I appreciate the info.My latest fiddlings have been with Tim
Wilson's Cycleman object(by studying it I FINALLY figured out how to use
Setups in the Detail editor as Poses in the Cycle Editor) I am about to
Upload a HUGE Battloid Mecha object for Imagine give it a look.75k Lharced
200K+ uncompressed
Peter,
Care to share your knowledge of using "setups in the Detail editor as
Poses in the Cycle editor"? When I position limbs in the detail editor, I
have to rejoin the joints. Something tells me I don't really need to do
that if I get the right method.
Karl
– via Whap!
Try using the Cycle Shuffle Command to rejoin the joints mate
Peter,
You mean do all the joint positioning in the Cycle editor instead of the
detail? I guess I pictured the Cycle editor just being used to set up
things to, well, cycle. I hadn't thought of it as useful in positioning
things for still images. Hmmm!
Karl
– via Whap!
If I had Imagine, I would. I don't have a use for it, right now. After I
get some new income flowing, perhaps I will buy Imagine. I'm venturing into
new avenues of the video production arena. Next week, I'll be at USC
learning about the Avid non-linear editing system. I have another
opportunity to do a morph sequence (using Imagemasterblaster, if the
lightbulb will ever turn on figuring it out!) I wouldn't upload any of my
stuff (made on SA4D), too industrial (boring).
– viola Whap!
Have fun at USC matey
What hardware products support Alpha channel now?
–Paul
Whappin' from the Wine Country
Paul,
I haven't done a major study of it, I know I saw an ad that said
FireCracker did, now that I have one, I don't see any evidence of it. It
isn't mentioned anywhere in the documentation. The July Amigaworld has a
small blurb about he Harlequin board having an Alpha Channel, and I believe
that the new DMI Resolver also has it, but I don't think it is released
yet.
I was given a demonstration of PhotoShop with a (I think) RasterOps
display board on a Mac. The two make quite a pair. He had made a horizontal
bar chart and, together with various Alpha masks and background images, he
could change the fill of the bars, the softness of the edges, etc. The
amazing thing was, because of a true Alpha channel, he could load different
masks (which Photoshop supports) and do different things, all without
changing the original graph in memory. I don't know if that made sense,
but, in contrast, with ADPro, if you don't like the results of an Alpha
composite, you have to load the picture again to try a new alpha mask.
– viola Whap!