#How many GIG's per minut
20 messages in this thread
IBM is making a new series of drives both a 5 gig and a 8.7 gig 3.5" form
factor that are rated AV and will deliver above 5 megs sustained throughput.
The Seafgate Elites will not do this and as far as I know, there is no drive on
the market yet that has broken the 5 meg barrier.
I'm testing 4 IBM Ultarstar XPs that are the forerunners of the new IBM AV
drives. They spin at 7200 RPM and are actually faster than the AV dirves IBM
will produce. I get a minimum op 5.2 megs per second sustained date
throughput, 6.5 – 7.0 most of the time. The Flyer needs 5.0 megs sustained to
record lossless MII or Betacam SP on all shots. It needs less for a
closeup/medium shot etc since there is less detail. The quality is the
equivalent of other systems that use arrayed drives to get 4 to 1 JPEG
compression rates if you use Flyer HQ5 continuously as I do.
The IBM drives will be released this summer and faster drives are on the
horizon. Flyer D2 lossless needs 8 megs sustained throughput. These drives
probably won't surface until next year, but the Flyer is processing at that
res. Problem is now you can't record or play it back so D2 will not be a
reality unless Newtek can figure a way to use arrayed drives. If you arrayed
two of these IBMs you could get well ove 10 megs sustained throughput which
would utilize Flyer D2 capapbilities.
I must say that having these drives greatly enhance the utility of the Flyer as
you can lay down exactly what you put in (to the eye at least, and for the
veiwer what else matters?). These type of drives will probablly sell for $1750
wholesale for the 5 gig form factor and I'm getting about about 21 minutes on
each drive in HQ5 mode.
I must reiterate my previous post that I wish to hell people would stop blaming
Newtek for laggardly drive technology. IBM has told me these fast drives are
overkill for 99% of their market so they have not been motivated to make them.
Hence we're victims of supply and demand, not Newtek's folly.
Kevin Elders
"Flyer D2 lossless needs 8 megs sustained throughput."
"I must reiterate my previous post that I wish to hell people would stop
blaming Newtek for laggardly drive technology."
"Hence we're victims of supply and demand, not Newtek's folly."
Funny. NewTek didn't say anything resembling any of these things as they were
promoting and hyping the Flyer to their existing customer base.
Gee, I wonder why . . .
Jerry
>> Funny. NewTek didn't say anything resembling any of these things as
>>they were promoting and hyping the Flyer to their existing customer base.
and taking the money… Lets not forget that minor detail ;^}
wmc – via Autopilot!
"Lets not forget that minor detail"
What's a few thousand between friends, eh? <G>
Jerry
Thanks for the insight. I believe at one time NewTek understood that IBM would
have these drives out earlier and they based their D2 claim on that. Now
they're trying to explain why you can't do D2 now, when people felt they said
you would be able to with the Flyer.
Hank
Videology, Inc Where you always get P.O.M.P. and
Service under all circumstances
"I believe at one time NewTek understood that IBM would have these drives out
earlier and they based their D2 claim on that. Now they're trying to explain
why you can't do D2 now, when people felt they said you would be able to with
the Flyer."
I think the realities go against that theory, Hank, what with NewTek's
"certification" program and all that razzle-dazzle. They didn't change their D2
claims and raise the drive issue until they had shipped all their Flyer back
orders. And of course not a word has been said of how all the people who bought
NewTek "certified" drives would be compensated.
Jerry
I think Nt made the worst marketing error with the drive problem. They
overstated the potential, based on futures from IBM, and then continued the
claims, hoping that the certified drives might work with software improvements
in the future. The Flyer mess has hurt their credibility and can only be
recovered with an acceptable 4.1 and an equitable hard drive resolution. My
jury is still out, but milling impatiently.
Hank
Videology, Inc Where you always get P.O.M.P. and
Service under all circumstances
Hank,
Of all the issue that have bugged me about NewTek's behaviour, everything else
I can accomodate myself to (grudgingly) except the hard drive situation. I like
others overspent $2-3k on drives that don't work.
I am sort of optimistic they will work out most of the other stuff. But I sure
hope they figure out how to get those Seagates to be more functional. And still
I paid 2-3k extra – but that would be easier to take f they worked at least.
Michael
Michael,
See my message to Jerry on a possible compromise I believe could be painless to
NewTek and reduce the pain considerably to the users regarding an HD "upgrade"
program.
wmc – via Autopilot!
"I think Nt made the worst marketing error with the drive problem."
I'm not convinced there is a drive problem, per se. But you are correct: the
worst error they've made to date is saying that it is without offering some
kind of buy-back, refund, credit or trade-in program for drives purchased on
their recommendation. From a legal standpoint, if there's a liability issue at
all, this one sticks out like a sore thumb.
"They overstated the potential, based on futures from IBM, and then continued
the claims, hoping that the certified drives might work with software
improvements in the future."
I don't buy into the IBM scenario, particularly considering the source I know
of.
NewTek made a major issue of "certifying" the drives – and said not one word
about a problem until reports of stuttering started cropping up here and
elsewhere.
If indeed it is a drive problem, then NewTek is probably going to wind up
owning a lot of slightly used drives, I think.
Jerry
Maybe they'll have a great sale on audio drives.
As far as what really happened, the facts are that Nt certified the drives and
indicated D2 quality. Now they are expected to deliver or negotiated a
compromise. Let's see what happens.
Hank
Videology, Inc Where you always get P.O.M.P. and
Service under all circumstances
"the facts are that Nt certified the drives and indicated D2 quality"
No argument from me on that. But where's the sound of the other shoe
dropping? What, if anything, does NewTek plan to do for people who bought into
its promises?
Jerry
That's the other main issue, along with the 4.1 specs, that seem to be floating
with no current comments from Nt. Let's hope they have answers to both soon.,
Hank
Videology, Inc Where you always get P.O.M.P. and
Service under all circumstances
Good news ….. Just put two 9 gig elites together with an array card form JAS
Engineering . Recorded great video maybe d-2 got to get my vector wave on it.
But I believe I just pulled my investment out of the fire. Maybe this is the
beggining of the turn on this thing. So don't count your investment in HD out
yet. I will have more as I am now trying to file the 18 gig drive with betacam
sp sourced video and see how it looks and edits. So far no stutters. To
circumvent misunderstandings the array I am using takes two drives and treats
them as one increasing memory capacity and speed. It so far is working great.
Joe Jensen Sharon Marzano
Nightscape Productions
Sharon,
I don't know too much about what you are doing but it sounds promising. I have
some questions that I hope you might be able to answer.
How much does an array card cost? Can you connect more than 2 drives? Do the
drives have to be the same type and size? Does it take a lot of technical
wizardry to install this.
Thanks in advance.
Michael
It costs around $600. Setup was transparent. Attach the two drives which had to
be the same model seagates and it goes. More test today.
Joe Jensen / Sharon Marzano
Nightscape
Joe/Sharon,
(Is this a case for s/he, or what – ;^}
Does the set-up and card you are testing require drives that support spindle
sync?
wmc – via Autopilot!
If it does it is invisiable to the user. The issue of that is speed I suppose
and we are doing a speed check today. Also checking if the drives bog down at
the inner rings. Eleborate on the importance of the spindle speed. Thanks
Joe Jensen / Sharon Marzano
Nightscape
Read your message again. Heres another take . The RAID accepts only seagate
drives of the same kind. Pair of Elites, barracudas etc. I don't know if
different revisions create problems. We personally have checked out barracudas
and elites.
Nightscape
Thanks Sharon –
I'm sure you'll get thanks all around if this setup continues to work well. For
big hard drive users, it also lets them use the bigger drives and still get the
quality.
Waiting to hear all the nitty gritty. (vendors, costs, speed, quality,
capacity, etc)
Thanks again for the good news –
Hank
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Service under all circumstances