#Output to VHS
11 messages in this thread
John:
>I thought you had some experience with Studio Magic? From what I've read its titling, grahics,
sfx, etc are wonderful for the low price. <
I do–and, *given its price*, it does do a lot reasonably well. OTOH, it only
does all those wunnerful things in composite formats (VHS, 8mm) which, if
you're looking to work in Hi8, may be disappointing to you…
>Well, yes VD 1.5 and 2.0 handle RCTC directly. That maybe the short term
solution. Cost $100 then throw away soon.<
Could be–especially if your camcorders can read/generate RCTC.
I recollect that a lot of newer Sony high-end camcorders can do that…
>If I just do cuts only without titles, etc. I'm probably worse off with that
master than if I manually construced the EDL
and cued the decks so that I could use Studio Magic today.<
I see your problem–and, sadly, can't suggest a one-size-fits-all solution to
it. I *can* advise you what certain stuff can and can't do, and let you take it
from there, depending on your needs, tho… f'instance, letting you know the
Studio Magic only works in composite formats would be, IMHO, a big factor to
consider (are you willing to accept the tradeoff in quality in exchange for the
effects, titling capability, etc.?).
Also, didn't some other folks on this forum mention that the Video Machine Lite
can be upgraded to NLE for a couple thousand dollars? That *might* make it a
viable solution, despite the cost–purchase it and use it now as a
controller/SEG/titler and, when you're ready to plunge for the NLE upgrade, you
can get it for less than if you bought the whole shebang…
As for your controller problem, why not simply get a low-end edit controller
like the Video Director (as I recollect, your record deck to date's a
Mitsubishi, which doesn't accept any protocol other than its own proprietary
form of synchro-edit) or some stand-alone solution?
Just a few thoughts,
Tim
About Studio Magic …
> in composite formats (VHS, 8mm) which, if you're looking to work in Hi8,
> may be disappointing
What is composite formats? I'm not sure I understand the video resolution
issue. SM works by overlaying computer graphics onto the video stream. Are
you saying their overlay board will degrade the hi band video in some way or
that the overlays will be lower resolution than hi band?
Anyway, SM looks like it's gone. They've filed for bankruptcy from what
I've been told.
> NLE
Two folks on MULTIMED forum are reporting success using Miro DC1 ($600) for
full NLE. Output to tape is better than VHS but slightly less than SVHS.
This requires a big hard drive but that's no more than a tape deck. I think
this is the way to go. I'm going to call Miro tomorrow and find out about
the new DC2 that is said to include a job/shuttle deck controller and better
resolution. But not bundled with Premiere anymore, rather the Ulead editor.
Price is said to be $1000.
Thanks.
-jts
John:
>What is composite formats? I'm not sure I understand the video resolution
issue.<
Sorry–tend to forget who knows what, sometimes. Regular VHS and 8mm are what's
called "composite" video formats–that means that the video signal they record
mixes both the chrominance (color) information and luminance (light)
information, so that they're not as precise and not as much info can be stored
for either (at least, I *believe* that why composite video has lower resolution
in addition to not as good control over chrominance and luminance). S-VHS and
Hi8, by contrast, are "component" formats, which simply means that they record
chrominance and luminance information separately for a better picture (kind of
like why 2 or 3 imaging chips in your camcorder gives you a better picture than
just one)…
The luminance level on component formats is also recorded higher than on
composite formats, which is why if you try playing an S-VHS tape on a regular
VHS machine, you get an unwatchably bright picture. (Some composite VCRs have a
feature called "SQPB" which adjusts for the brighter luminance signal of S-VHS
or Hi8 so, even though they play it back at the lower composite resolutions,
you can at least *watch* it…)
>SM works by overlaying computer graphics onto the videostream. Are you saying
their overlay board will degrade the hi band video in some way or that the
overlays will be lower resolution than hi band?<
No, the overlays will simply be lower resolution (so, for that matter, will be
*any* video that goes through the Studio Magic). I mean, you can use it for the
"super" formats, but don't expect to get the same high resolution as you'd get
if you didn't put it through the Studio Magic–no matter *what* format you put
in, it all comes out at VHS quality (which is okay if you don't mind that, but
if you're shooting in a component format, I assume you'd like your final to
come out w/a *bit* higher resolution…).
>Anyway, SM looks like it's gone. They've filed for bankruptcy from what I've
been told.<
Look at the bright side–NOW you can probably pick up a Studio Magic board for
a song & a dance! <g>
>Two folks on MULTIMED forum are reporting success using Miro DC1 ($600) for
full NLE. Output to tape is better than VHS but slightly less than SVHS.<
Sounds good–but better make sure your computer's configuration is up to doing
what you'd like to. (See my earlier post to you on "rendering"…)
>I'm going to call Miro tomorrow and find out about
the new DC2 that is said to include a job/shuttle deck controller and better
resolution.<
Just a question, John–*why* would a nonlinear editor need a jog/shuttle deck
controller? NLE simply allows you to "dump" video footage into your computer,
play w/it inside your computer, and then output it back to videotape. There's
be no need, IMHO, for a deck controller (used for traditional linear editing).
When you find out *if* the DC2 has it, could you also find out *why*?
Thanks,
Tim
> the overlays will simply be lower resolution (so, for that matter, will
> be *any* video that goes through the Studio Magic). I mean, you can use
> it for the "super" formats, but don't expect to get the same high
> resolution as you'd get if you didn't put it through the Studio Magic
Ok, how about GVP (now defunct) G-Lock VGA+ card that has S-Video in and out
connectors. Uses the ET4000 video chip and replaces your video card. Will
this also lower resolution to composite? It uses Curtain Call and PrimeTime
for titles, transitions and effects.
Thanks.
-jts
John:
>Ok, how about GVP (now defunct) G-Lock VGA+ card that has S-Video in and out
connectors. Uses the ET4000 video chip and replaces your video card. Will
this also lower resolution to composite? It uses Curtain Call and PrimeTime
for titles, transitions and effects.<
Don't know it offhand–but, since it has S-Video outputs as well as inputs,
it'll dump as component video to your videotape. Of course, I'm not sure how
high the resolution the software or the card generates…
Tim
I'm putting it on to see. I think the resolution will be hi band quality
from what little I've seen so far.
-jts
> When you find out *if* the DC2 has it, could you also find out *why*?
Tim, as per your request …
*** FLASH ***
Just got a call back from Miro tech support. We discussed the various rumors
posted here. With that information what he told me was consistent with what
BS has stated. The DC1 will continue as a separate product. Very shortly
they are introducing the Video Mouse. This has been advertised with a coupon
in the DC1 shipments. It is a linear edit controller with hardware
jog/shuttle control. It does RCTC and has LANC connections (maybe more, I
didn't ask). It will construct an EDL essentially allowing you to have a
hybrid linear/non-linear edit system (THERE BS! <g>).
The really interesting new is that they are introducing a separate product,
the DC20. It will capture 640×480 and said to be 'broadcast quality'. It
will be a PCI board and will have the same design philosophy of output to
NTSC rather than VGA. It will also work with the Video Mouse. Bundled
software is not known but elsewhere I've seen Ulead mentioned. Est. to ship
about June. Price unknown but, again elsewhere, I've seen $1,000 posted.
Now the decision what to do becomes a bit more complicated. What I need to
do is get in on the Video Toolkit for Windows beta. <g>
One more point. We talked about supporting hardware. Min. recommended
system is 486DX33. 16mb RAM (more than 16mb is not beneficial for
Miro/Premiere) and 1MB Western Digital IDE (E-IDE drive actually) are
sufficient. This drive will give about 20-25 minutes of video capture with
sufficient room to edit. 2GB drives should give about 45 minutes worth of
video. The Seagate Barracuda with Adaptec PCI 2940W SCSI adapter makes a
good combo.
I think maybe VD 2.0 for $100 to milk things until June and wait for the
broadcast quailty card?
Thanks.
-jts
Hi John,
I'm going to wait to see whether Miro DC20 is optimized for SCSI!!
DC1tv with SCSI is a real pain, though those with EIDE really get good results
and setup is simple.. Are you SCSI or EIDE??
Best,
Tom
Tom:
>I'm going to wait to see whether Miro DC20 is optimized for SCSI!! DC1tv with
SCSI is a real pain, though those with EIDE really get good results and setup
is simple.. Are you SCSI or EIDE??<
I'm having one of those "I could kick myself" moments–when I bought my current
computer November before last, I specifically asked for a SCSI drive because
they were faster than IDE and you could get larger hard drives that way! If I'd
have known they'd come up w/enhanced IDE a few months later…
Tim Liebe
> Are you SCSI or EIDE??
Neither. My two towers are 386DX33 and 486SX40, both ISA/IDE. I've started
to 'roll' and P-something with PCI bus. I plan to go E-IDE but I think
Western Digital's largest right now is 1GB. That's about to change over the
next couple of months and Pentium prices will come down too. For this
reason the timing of the DC20 and Pentium workstation are about right.
In the meantime I've decided to put the GVP Personal Suite Plus on the
486SX40 and see how it works. I want to get going and it looks like another
3 months best case, out to 6 months now for NLE. As has been pointed out a
number of capture cards haven't worked out and the ///FAST has buggy
drivers. I think the only thing on the low end for video output that makes
sense is the DC1. But since I've got to wait a bit on the workstation to
get the most bang for the buck, might as well drag it out and see what's
standing when the dust settles a few months after NAB.
-jts
John:
Thanks for letting me know what Miro says! Frankly, after reading what they
said, I'm sorta going "Er?". <g>
>The really interesting new is that they are introducing a separate product,
the DC20. It will capture 640×480 and said to be 'broadcast quality'. It will
be a PCI board and will have the same design philosophy of output to NTSC
rather than VGA. It will also work with the Video Mouse. Bundled software is
not known but elsewhere I've seen Ulead mentioned. Est. to ship about June.
Price unknown but, again elsewhere, I've seen $1,000 posted.<
I'd be interested to know more myself. (Jeez, see what happens when you toil in
the vineyards of low-end consumer stuff for a year? All this is happening, and
*I* was being assigned reviews of $300 consumer VCRs! <g>)
>One more point. We talked about supporting hardware. Min. recommended system
is 486DX33. 16mb RAM (more than 16mb is not beneficial for Miro/Premiere) and
1MB Western Digital IDE (E-IDE drive actually) are sufficient. This drive will
give about 20-25 minutes of video capture with sufficient room to edit. 2GB
drives should give about 45 minutes worth of video. The Seagate Barracuda with
Adaptec PCI 2940W SCSI adapter makes a good combo.<
Really–more than 16 megs is NOT beneficial? As for processor speed, then you
should be in pretty good shape w/your Pentium!
Thanks for all the info,
Tim