QB 5.01 Bugs & Buglets
28 messages in this thread
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to
the third file on the tape:
Bring up QB
Select Restore (file 1 directory loads)
Select Cancel
Select Tape Options..
Select Rewind
Select Space
Select Space again
Select OK
Select Restore
>I now have the 3rd file directory
5. This is the other ritual that works:
Bring up QB
Select Restore (file 1 direcotry loads)
Select Cancel
Select Tape Options..
Select Rewind
Select Space
Select Rstore (shows directory of file 2)
Select Cancel
Select Restore again
>QB now finds the file 3 directory even though the tape was not
specifically "spaced" from file 2 to file 3. The Restore works.
6. After seeing that the restore automatically started reading file 3
without
spacing forward from file 2, I tried doing the same after restore on
file 1. Here are the results of one try:
Bring up QB
Select Restore (shows directory of file 1)
Select Cancel
Select Restore again
get requester: "unable to read catalog from tape"
Select Cancel
>QB then rewinds the tape, spaces forward, stops and rewinds again
7. Another attempt at doing #5:
Bring up QB
Select Restore (shows directory of file 1)
Select Cancel
Select Restore again
>tape rewinds and directory of file 1 is reloaded. This sequence
happened
most times. #6 only happened twice.
Hopefully there is enough information here for you to get this silliness
straightened out. #1 is especially bad and most of the rest are puzzling at
best. I'm thankful that I haven't lost any data. Other than these
problems, QB 5.0 is a great product in the tradition of 4.3 and the rest.
If you need further info, give me a shout – you are welcome to call, (609)
228-8088.
Thanks
– Don
– via Whap!
Don,
I appreciate the report. I'm sorting through it now. I'll get back to you
on this.
Mark Thomas
Central Coast Software
A divison of New Horizons Software, Inc.
I've come across a problem which my earlier version of QuarterBack seemed
to handle better than the new one: If I accidentally (oops..) pop out the
floppy that is currently being written to, the error pop-up it gives me
suggests that there is a problem with the disk, and that I should
substitute a different one. If I just try to replace the disk, it complains
that that disk is a backup disk, and I can't use it. I have to substitute a
different disk. My backup disks are numbered from 1 to 110, so substituting
a different disk for the one I have labeled "43" is somewhat of a pain, as
that means that number 43 isn't number 43 anymore. I realize that this is a
problem that is my own fault, but like it or not it seems like a common
error to pop out the wrong floppy during a backup. I think my old QB yelled
at me to put the darn disk back in. That would be much preferable to the
way the new one is reacting.
Steve Anderson P.S. This is the first time
I've been over here in AmigaVend for a long while, so forgive me if this
problem has already been beat to death.
And although that may seem like a "user error–not really our
responsibility to fix" problem, I've done the EXACT same thing a couple of
times, Stephen. I'd love to see that somehow remedied.
Sigh… I have another one, much more serious than the previous problem: I
was 19 disks into a backup, when I decided to open a WShell to look at
something. I double-clicked on the WShell icon and immediately got a
recoverable alert. I thought "OK, recoverable" so I hit the mouse button.
The screen never even went back to the workbench, it just went straight to
the "Software Error" screen. Sorry, I was to horrified to note the error
number. And no, I didn't have anything else running except ARexx and QB
5.0.1.
I know that the CCS folks are taking alot of heat about problems with QB,
and I have to say I think it could have gone through a little more testing
before it was released. However, I've been using QB since who knows when,
and I've found each upgrade a big improvement. I think alot of both New
Horizons and CCS, and now that they are together I have to believe things
are good. Mark is a big help here, and I'm sure that this stuff will all
get fixed. (are you listening Mark?)
BTW, I do like the new look alot better, and the ARexx interface is super.
I like being able to customize the scripts to just what I want.
Steve Anderson
Steve,
Just a bit of trivia, but …
CCS and New Horizons aren't really "together". CCS's primary programmer
and president was George Chamberlain. For various reasons, George decided
to sell the company. He was lucky enough to find an interested buyer in
New Horizons — a long time Amiga company with an excellent reputation for
quality products and support. George is now living in Germany.
-sja
Ooops… Hmmm. So who *IS* CSS with Chamberlain gone? Well, I'm now on my
third GURU (err, I mean "Software Error") in trying to back up one of my
partitions. No matter how much faith I have in CSS or New Horizons, I need
to back up this disk. If something doesn't get fixed soon, I guess I'll
have to look into one of the other backup programs…
Steve
Stephen,
You are running across a problem for which there is no solution. In order
to protect you against the problem that existed in previous versions of
Quarterback, where if you attempted to eject a disk, but only slightly hit
the button, the drive might register a diskchange and Quarterback would
write over that disk with the next disk image. This is horrible if you are
on disk 60 in a 100 disk backup. You have to start all over. The solution
was to detect if you inserted a disk in the drive that belongs to the
current backup set being written and not allow you to damage your backup.
In your case, Quarterback has already written the header information on the
disk so that the disk can be identified as a backup disk, but the disk was
ejected accidentally. When the disk is reinserted, Quarterback checks to
see if the disk is of the current backup. The disk is, so it refuses to
write to it.
This is just a protection mechanism.
Mark Thomas
Central Coast Software
A division of New Horizons Software, Inc.
Mark: Sounds as though someone has tried to over-solve a non-existent
problem. I think the problem I had has got to be far more likely than the
example you gave. It sounds as though the right thing to do is to ask me…
Just as simple requester: "This disk is marked as part of the current
backup.. Use it anyway?" Seems like the problem you say has no solution
probably has a relatively simple one. In my work we develop relatively
large distributed processing systems for data collection and analysis. It
is always hard to convince young programmers that in an interactive system
you should never make some automated fail-over decision when a user is
available to "vote" on the answer. Programmers always like to think their
program can make the right decision for the person that is running the
program. Not true. If there is any doubt about what to do in a error
condition – "ask me"…
Steve
Stephen,
I wouldn't say that it's a non-existant problem (I've partially ejected a
disk at least once, though I pop the wrong disk a LOT more often than
that), but you definitely have the right solution. ALWAYS ask the user if
you are in doubt as to what happened.
Peter
As I was saying, I spend alot of my time trying to convince the programmers
that work for me of that very fact: Don't do something automatic if (a)
It's not a time-critical operation; (b) There is *ANY* chance that the
automatic decision is wrong, and (c) the user is sitting right there. In
this case, *I* popped the disk out, so I certainly am available to ask.
It's not a time critical operation (QB can't continue until I put in a disk
anyway), and the decision it makes automatically is most certainly wrong in
my view.
I started my contributions to this thread saying I had faith in CCS getting
the problem fixed. However, I read a note about the AmiBack folks offering
a competitive upgrade for $25. I still hope the QB folks get the thing
fixed (there are ALOT of bugs in this thing right now), but for $25 I
almost can't afford to not try AmiBack…
Steve
Stephen,
We have thought of another way around the problem. The disk will only be
rejected if it is part of the current backup AND the disk number is less
than the current disk number needed. I'm sure this solution can be coded
into the next version.
Trust me, we save headaches by keeping the user (you and me included) from
damaging a backup set.
Mark Thomas
Central Coast Software
A division of New Horizons Software, Inc.
OK, I'll buy that. That seems like a perfectly reasonable way to do it.
However, I still am of the belief that you *SHOULD* offer the user an
opportunity to make the choice. Still, your proposed solution seems OK in
this case. Any idea when a new patch will be available? I'm less concerned
about the disk-pop-out problem as I am with the machine crashes. Has there
been any progress in that area?
Steve
Stephen,
I believe that the next release will come fairly soon and will address all
the problems reported to us.
Mark Thomas
Central Coast Software
A division of New Horizons Software, Inc.
Will the next version address the Nexus/Tape streamer config problem ?
QB4.0 worked as does Amiback ?
As for the Nexus controller, the last I heard was that we sent
Advanced Storage Systems the list of SCSI command we use and they
were going to make sure they work. I have not heard back from them.
The person handling this situation is out of the office for the rest
of the week.
>> This is just a protection mechanism.
Wouldn't a better solution be to inform the user of the potential problem,
and then let him make the final decision? Also, in this case, the disk is
not a part of the current backup. It is disk 16 of a backup set of _15_
correct disks, and a problem was incountered with the current disk.
Therefore, it is not a correct disk in the current set. Had disk 14 or 15,
which are correct, been inserted, then there is a problem. I realize that
this is quite a bit of logic to put in the program, but it does seem to
protect against a very possible problem. Finally, the word of the operator
should be final. If he says "D–n it, use the disk!", the program should
use the disk.
Bill Roberts in Ellettsville In. via Whap!
> In your case, Quarterback has already written the header information on
> the disk so that the disk can be identified as a backup disk, but the
disk
> was ejected accidentally. When the disk is reinserted, Quarterback
checks
> to see if the disk is of the current backup. The disk is, so it refuses
> to write to it.
OK, so include in the header written on each disk its number in the backup
series, as well as "if the disk is of the current backup". Then it will
know whether or not it can write on that one. If it wants to write disk
60, and it just registered a diskchange, and the NEW disk is 60, then it
writes the WHOLE disk 60 image to it, even if it had already done some of
that previously.
. . . . . JimDoc
Don, From the brief scan of your trouble report, I think I'll sit back for
a while before I bother updating my QB 4.3 to 5.xx. Guess I'll keep using
AmiBack with my Wangtek 150MB tape unit.
Chris
Chris,
If Central Coast is true to form, fixes will be forthcoming very soon and
a patch file made available here. At least judging the amount of time it
took between a previous problem report and the 5.0.1 patch.
– Don
– via Whap!
Don,
Why wait for more QB patches, upgrade to Ami-Back 2.0.
Upgrade to Ami-Back 2.0 and get more features than QB has offered in the
past or supplies right now. It can backup to any device, tape, DAT, etc,
and doesn't need any special device drivers. Ami-Back also has a a
scheduler that will backup at preset time(s). Its packed with features and
there has been a product announcement just put in this forum in the Hot
News and Rumors section.
Chris
Chris,
I may pick up a copy of ami-back and check it out. I've heard good
things about it.
When I bought QB, I found that it fit right in with my way of doing
things. Other backup programs, mostly PD utilities at the time, required
that I change and do things their way. QB just slipped into my daily
operations like it had always been there.
I've used Quarterback since a 1.? version and think that having a solid
company standing behind a product may be the most valuable feature for any
program. Central Coast has certainly done a marvelous job of supporting
its product over the years and, I would hope, the future promises more of
the same.
Do you remember the 4.3 upgrade? They found a bug in handling something
(don't remember what now) in 2.04 and made a free upgrade available. How
many companies would go to the expense of doing that just to protect their
customers, especially with the new 5.0 upgrade in the wings getting ready
to earn them more revenu?
So many companies have come into the Amiga market to make a quick buck
and disappeared when the going got rough. Central Coast has stuck by us;
New Horizons has stuck by us; all of the vendors in this forum have stuck
by us. I think a little bit of patience is in order.
– Don
– via Whap!
Don,
I'm not saying that Central Coast or New Horizons aren't supportive
of the Amgia community. QB has been a main staple of my computer diet for
many years. However, when I switched to a streaming tape unit, QB wasn't
there to help me. I didn't care too much for GVP's TapeStore and when I got
tired of it I looked for a replacement. QB still wasn't there with support.
There was plenty of time in-between for them to add the support. I found
Ami-Back, it supported ALL devices + had a Scheduler. Now of course since
QB only worked with floppies for backup media what would it need with a
scheduler? I liked changing my daily routine of flipping umpteen floppies
into my drives to inserting one 150mb tape. Why should I wait around for it
to back up when I can automate the process? By the time the 4.3 upgrade
came out of QB to fix the 2.04 bug I've been streaming tape for a couple a
two years, so no I guess I missed the impact of the swift actions of CC,
but they've always been fair in their policies of upgrading their products.
Now I don't know if Ami-Back is really here for the long run or if
the company that wrote it has the strength needed to stay in the Amiga
market. I've talked to the author, (call him up and talk to him yourself)
he talked to me for a while about Ami-Back and Amigas and was very
enthusiastic and seemed quite capable to me.
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Don,
I have patience (lord knows I've been with the Amiga since 1985), but
I wanted to use an easier form of backup and it wasn't there. Maybe we
should give this new(?) author a chance too, just like we've done with many
others? Heck, his products aren't too $$$$ and there is a nice upgrade
path. Even without using the upgrade path the program isn't that costly
that you couldn't own it and QB.
I just want more for our Amigas, more competition, more hardware, more
exposure. I applaud all the vendors in this forum for staying in the Amiga
market and I intend to continue to use or purchase their products.
But I am just as anxious to assist other companies if their product IMHO is
worthy of it. Besides, I want to hear another user's opinions about
Ami-Back.
I might be ALL wrong. B^)
Chris
Since you asked…
I have never used Quarterback. (I DO have Quarterback Tools and like it).
I bought AmiBack about a year ago after talking to the author at AmiExpo
(?) in Orlando. He had the same type of Teac tape drive that I already had
and said that it worked fine using the direct SCSI commands. He seemed to
know what he was talking about (we discussed accessing SCSI devices at
great length) so I bought the program.
It has always worked just fine for me. I especially like being able to put
more than one partition on a tape during a backup.
They have been prompt about notifing users of bug fixes and updates.
Version 2 (with data compression among other new features) is now available
and I hope to have it by the beginning of next week.
-J
Jay,
I just called MoonLighter Software Tuesday the 9th, and was told that
Ami-Back 2.0 is now shipping. Users of older versions can update by sending
$18.00 (includes $3 S&H) and the original master disk back and you can
update to 2.0. I hate sending back the disk but it always has worked for me
in the past with other companys so NO WORRY, eh? B')
Chris