A Proposition…
29 messages in this thread
Chris:
I was curious. You were mentioning that you were having to convert all your
Mac Type 1's to IBM format (for PageStream use, presumedly). I'm not clear
about what PageStream expects from a font or how it uses the Type 1's but
I've heard from other people that their Mac-to-IBM utility isn't all that
great (lost characters and the like). It occurred to me that a sizeable
chunk of our new MIoutline program could be used to write a real whiz-bang
Mac-to-IBM Type 1 font conversion thing which I would have no trouble with
dumping into the PD realm as shareware. Would you be interested in helping
me out with this? If everything is as I suspect, I doubt it would take more
than a week or two to put together (and think of the PR value!). Let me
know what you think.
Gary.
– Mirror Image Prod. (416) 495-7469, via WHAP!
Gary, PageStream uses normal IBM Type 1 fonts. The utility written by
Soft-Logik really does work (the first versions were crappy). It was used
to convert all 600 Type 1 fonts which Soft-Logik licensed. The utility is
also PD. It's not easy to use though, not something for a beginner. Instead
of writing one from scratch you might want to talk to Soft-Logik and see if
you can build on theirs. It was written by Gary Knight, the guy who has
been writing all those import modules for PageStream (PCX, Adobe
Illustrator, TIFF, GIF, ProDraw…) BTW, Soft-Logik only provides this
utility for the Amiga. On the Atari there is another PD program to do the
same thing written by Don Turnock, plus there is a Type 1/ PageStream
font/Calamus font editor called Font Designer which is fantastic compared
to some of the Mac font editors.
Michael Loader
Michael:
What I've heard about the conversion utility from Soft Logik is that a) the
interface sucks (I know, I downloaded it and find it lacking) b) I tried to
process an Adobe Mac Type 1 font that I have and it told me it wasn't a Mac
font! (which is odd, since my software has no trouble with it) and c) it
doesn't (according to some PageStream users I've talked to) convert the
font so that you can access ALL the characters in the font. The machinery
that I've written into my Type 1 – PDraw font program extracts every
character that the font contains, and it's already written. That's pretty
much why I suggested adapting it, although perhaps you're right in saying
that I should possibly contact Soft-Logik. The trouble is I don't have an
example of what sort of IBM font you get with their utility. Maybe I can
convince one of you kind souls to send one up to me (PD of course).
Gary.
– Mirror Image Prod. (416) 495-7469, via WHAP!
I don't know what Chirs might think. *I* would be doing cartwheels for
joy!
Go for it.
Jim:
That's one vote. Let me write that down… One vote for a decent Mac to IBM
program… Anybody else?
Gary
– Mirror Image Prod. (416) 495-7469, via WHAP!
Gary…
Please do it… (MAC type I to IBM type I f/PageStream).
– Whapping from the North Coast Michael
Michael:
I think it's unanimous (actually, I was going to do it anyway). Now all I
need is a sample Type font converted into IBM format from the Mac using
SoftLogik's convertor. Anybody got any?
Gary.
– Mirror Image Prod. (416) 495-7469, via WHAP!
Gary, I'd be real pleased to give you a hand with your whiz-bang Mac-to-IBM
Type 1 font conversion thingie. Just put it in the E-mail or better upload
it here (if you'd like others to have it while its being tweaked) and let's
get it going. I've gotten A-thru-H (most of it anyway) completed and have
been examining the files for errors. Oh yeah, I've got some .AFM files that
are fragged AND some .PFB files too! Looks like the MAC OS causes those
problems if you use multi-finder (what a joke). You got to leave complex
tasks alone with the cpu or any other task screws it up! Give me a fully
equipped Amiga, with similar software to complete my tasks and I'd never
touch a MACinSlosh again!
Upload that converter and I'll taker thru the corners!
Chris
ACCU-TYPE & GRAPHICS
(a service bureau in Delaware)
Chris:
Whooaaa! I said I was THINKING of putting that baby together: it's still a
gleam in my eye. I think I could slam it together in pretty short order
but, as I don't have any idea what you guys are actually looking for
(features, results, etc.) I think I should get a little input first. I
should also get my hands on a sample font converted with SoftLogik's
converter, which I've tried to use and failed, before I do anything. If you
could let me know a little bit about how PageStream uses Type 1's too, that
would be a big help. And if all goes well and I don't turn my brain into
stir-fry from trying to win the coveted "Created More Font Conversion
Programs in One Week than Anyone Alive" award, I should be able to hammer
something together for your purusal by early next week. I guess you need
the AFMs for PageStream too, hmm? I should find the SoftLogik thing and put
it through the wringer… I'll get back to you.
Gary
– Mirror Image Prod. (416) 495-7469, via WHAP!
Gary, OK, I'll Whooaaa! Just wanted you to know that I'm ready to help. I
know there are plenty of other forum members who also would lend a hand.
Just put it in the library when it's ready.
Now my favorite Type1 font I'd like to convert to PDRAW
is…….[reaching for my Font & Function Catalog]
Sheesh, I didn't know I had so many favorites, well heck how about Cooper
Black Italic? That is one I think a lot of folks might have in their
collections. Another is Bodoni Poster.
I'm thinking Display faces here.
Chris
ACCU-TYPE & GRAPHICS
(a service bureau in Delaware)
Chris:
I've noted your requests and since I haven't recieved any other specific
Type 1 font titles, I guess your's make the list! Congratulations! You can
pick up your prize at the door…
About the Mac to IBM thing: It's going along alot faster than I thought.
I've actually got the conversion part working (takes about 1 or 2 seconds)
and I'm just sprucing up the interface. I'm trying to get a configurable
Source/Destination path system set up that would be far more flexible than
typing in "Okay, where's your source files…" etc. I'm also going to have
an option for gang-converting everything in the source directory with one
click. BTW, does anything have to be done to the AFM's other than re-naming
them to follow the printer font's names? Does PageStream care what the
files are called? If not, then I'm going to use MIfont's naming algorithm
and call the printer fonts <fontname>.PFB and the AFMs <fontname>.AFM. If
you see any problem with this, let me know. Also, you won't have to worry
about all this resource and data fork nonsense. If it's a Mac Type 1 font,
this baby'll figure it out, fork or no fork. Later.
Gary.
– Mirror Image Prod. (416) 495-7469, via WHAP!
Gary, No, it appears that PageStream does not care what the files are
called. I've left them in the IBM naming format and PgSt converts them in
the font manager. I've only renamed them when there is a conflict. Boy I
HATE the IBM naming convention for those fonts! It stinks! Try this one
out.
CATFBOI_.PFB
That for anyone else to know is Caslon Two Two Four Bold Italic! The gang
conversion feature is a must! Anything that allows easy multiple
conversions should be implemented, and the MIFont naming algorithm sounds
great! This will keep things consistent with your other stuff.Hurrah,
Hurrah, no more worrying about which fork to use first! I was never very
good when it came to table etiquette B^) .
Sounds good to me, when your ready, so are we!
Chris Tolmie
ACCU-TYPE & GRAPHICS, INC.
(a service bureau in Delaware)
No, I won't be using the IBM naming convention (GHIYUTG.PFB ??!?!?);
what a mess! How can you come up with 15,000 (the number of
PostScript fonts that I've heard of) unique names with 8 chars?!!
Impossible! I'll just be using to the .PFB extensions. That's about
it. It's coming along nicely and I'll let you know what's what in a
day or two.
Actually you can come up with 17576 with only THREE (3)!!!!. I think
what you meant was 'meaningful' names.
Gary–
This is a bit off of the subject, but since you are such a font head,
who better to ask?
I'm trying to get fonts working with POST1.6; how do I get the AFM files
for fonts off of the Adobe ATM disk for Windows? Do I have to use their
generation software (fount foundery, I think?)
A font head I may be, but unfortunately, I don't use POST and I'm a Mac
font man myself, so I can't really help you with Window's ATM stuff.
Anybody else?
Yes, Adrian Aylward has released a pd program to convert make type 1
fonts useable in ProPage. Makes the files you need, I believe. Never
used it myself. I THINK it is in listings–you want version 2, the
latest. If it is not here, holler and I will upload it for you. PS
do you still need Mac fonts converted with the PageStream converter?
Sound like you are all done and don't, but if so let me know and I
will make and email for you.
Which program are you talking about (the Adrian Aylward thing)? I can't
find any file in the Amiga area that seems to fit what you're describing.
No, I don't have any fonts from the PageStream thing. I've got tons of Mac
fonts, but what I was looking for was something that had successfully been
converted with SoftLogik's utility, so I could compare what my program
generates with what that utility creates. If you could upload one of these
(make sure it's a PD font; I don't beleive in passing around commercial
fonts), I'd e very appreciative.
OK Gary, I will get on it. I tried to convert a PD font, but it is a big
one and I got an out of memory message from SL's utility. I will go grab a
smaller one from a local BBS and I hope I can upload it. I will also upload
Adrian's program. Fmdtp2.lzh is what he called it, so I will try to use
that name. BTW–when you unarc it, you get an error at the MAKE in the
source (yes, source is included!!) but everything else is there.
I am also uploading a brand new HP DJ500 driver that is designed to work
only with PROPAGE and to fix the offset problem as well as the page
drifting down problem. In short, if it works dj5000 users will finally get
what they see on screen. Let's hope.
that one is called dj500v2.lzh
I just checked out Adrian's font conversion stuff for use with PPage: What
a mess! I can't believe this guy wrote POST! All those little utilities and
pathnames and file names and different encoding schemes… yeeeesh! Oh,
well, at least he tried (and he does create bitmap fonts from Type 1's,
something MIfont doesn't do (yet!)), so I'll give him credit for that. But
it's so confusing; I can't imagine how even the most stalwart font hound
could wade through that stuff without going bonkers! Anyway…
I think I left you a different message about the new thing I'm doing (Mac
to IBM Type 1 thingie); basically, I'm at the point where it converts the
fonts; I just have to clean up the interface and work in a feature for
gang-converting an entire directory. I think I'll just finish it up and
upload it and let you guys rip it apart and then write a new version when I
get some feedback. Adios!
OK–I am having a lot of trouble getting a converted mac font for you
anyway. The problem seems to be with UNSIT. I never end up with the same
filename with a .D and another with a .R suffix. Instead, the .D and the
.R files have different names. Is this normal?
I just thought of something: Are you talking about those pesky .PFM
files that alot of IBM Type 1's seem to circulate with? I've looked
at them and I don't think they contain all the font's metric
information (I KNOW there's no kerning information in them). Anybody
know what I'm talking about? Do I know what I'm talking about?
Nope, not what I'm looking for. It seems that some fonts come with .AFM
files, which (I believe) are necessary with POST; others must be generated
using software that comes with Rev.3 fonts. Seems like a job for IBeM!!
Post itself does not use the .AFM files all it uses are the actual
font files, the PFB files from the windows ATM package. I purchased
ATM for windows and moved all the .PFB files over to my Amiga. They
work great with Post 1.6.
What you might need the .AFM files for is generating .metric files for use
with programs such as ProWrite and ProPage. There is a postscript program
called getafm.ps that will generate a .AFM from the .PFB. The .AFM can the
be used with the MkMetric program to generate the .metric files.
I use the MkBmap program to generate bitmap fonts from postscript fonts and
the MkMetric program to generate the .metric files. I use these with
ProWrite/ProScript and print with PostDJ. Throw together an ARexx exec or
two and you have a fairly integrated system. The quality of the output on
my DJ500 is amazing, to me at least.
Martin–
Thanks for the tips. Where can I get these programs? Sounds like
they'd be very useful.
Other questions: I can't get all of the Adobe Plus Pack fonts to work,
although I renamed them. (I found the proper names in a ProPage postscript
prologue that called them). Can you e-mail me a text file of your font
directory, especially if you have these fonts? Lastly, do you know of any
good way to convert type 1 fonts to objects for use in 3-d packages?
Thanks,
JOnathan
Jonathan – from Albany, NY, via whap!
This was a message just posted by Jim Ventola, it appears he just uploaded
the utilities I was talking about. Check for a file called fmdtp2.lzh.
As for renaming the Adobe fonts, just edit the .PFB files, you'll find the
real font name at the top of the file. As I recall POST does require that
the external name of the font is the same as the internal name, so just
make sure you rename the font files the same as the internal name in the
.PFB.
I have converted all the fonts that came from the Windows ATM package. I
don't have the plus pack yet.
I have also converted a whole bunch of PD fonts. Occasionaly I find one
that doesn't want to convert. I haven't really looked into why, I normally
just forget that one. The vast majority came over without a hitch.
Sorry but I know nothing about any of the 3D packages.
Martin–
Thanks for the info – very useful.
Jonathan
Jonathan – from Albany, NY, via whap!
PageStream doesn't care about font file names … when you use the
font manager it reads each file carefully looking for the real font
name. However, my only plea is that, if you do name them .PFB and
.AFM then _please_ ensure that they conform 100% to the proper file
formats otherwise life is going to get ever so confusing.
Mike:
You seem to know Type 1's pretty good. Are the IBM fonts you convert with
SoftLogik's utility simply packed into IBM format or is the encoding vector
screwed around with? Right now my little utility just reads in the complete
Mac font and packs it straight into IBM format; no translation of encoding
information. How does PageStream do it? Does it look into the font and just
read in all available characters from the actual character list (that is,
where the outline information is stored) or does it reference the encoding
vector ONLY? Or both?!? If the encoding array had to be re-written, I could
do that no problem, but I don't actually want to do that if I don't have
to: decryption takes too much time if it isn't necessary and if
PageStream's going to do it anyway. Let me know what you think.
– Mirror Image Prod. (416) 495-7469, via WHAP!