CompuServe Thread

#Multiple "Parent" Links?

11 messages in this thread
#18340From: Mike MorrisonJul 2, 1992 4:22 PM
Has anyone come up with any tricks to link one "child" object to two independant "parent" objects? I realize that 3DS can only link a child object in the keyframer to one parent object. But how do you handle situations like, an animated person swinging something with both hands. If you start linking the body joints from the pelvis up through to the arms, lower arms, to the hands it works fine if the person is swinging the arms independantly of each other. But if he is holding an object with both hands, it can be _VERY_ difficult to animate the second hand to match the movement of the first hand since you can't link them together without loosing the existing links to the body. Creating a "dummy" (third) arm and linking the left and right arms to it can still create gaps between the joints (due to the pivot points). Anyone have any ideas? Thanks in advance. My characters just can't seem to get a grip on this situation… -MM
#18373From: Yost GroupJul 2, 1992 9:57 PM
Mike, there is no way to animate the hierarchy or otherwise manipulate the links over time. However… we simulate this effect frequently by splitting the final animation up into different shots, in which each shot uses its own hierarchy. You just put them together in Video Post and voila! There's an amazing walking robot we're working on now that uses that technique… you'll see it on the Siggraph tape. If you'd like more info about the technique, let me know. – G
#18407From: Mike MorrisonJul 3, 1992 9:23 AM
I'm not sure if you understood my question correctly. My problem is a person with both arms linked to a sword, and both arms linked to the body. If I link the sword to the right hand/forearm/upperarm/body that works great for one handed swings. But for two handed swings, I can't link the left arm to the sword or vise versa because the left arm has to stay linked to the body. This leaves me with the difficult (but not impossible) task of animating the right arm to follow the left through very complex hierchical based rotations of swinging the sword. As you can imagine the TCB compounds the problem since the movement has to be very fluid. Clear as mud? -MM
#18435From: alec jasonJul 3, 1992 5:11 PM
Mike, How about this: At the frame before the arms need to move in a linked fashion, scale down the left arm to one percent and then scale up a copy of the arm which has been linked to the sword (or other arm. Then, after the swordfight, you can reverse the scaling of the real arm and the copy and you're back to normal hierarchal operation. Alec Jason
#18437From: Mike MorrisonJul 3, 1992 6:08 PM
I guess I don't understand. The "scaled copy" of the arm would still need to be linked to the sword as well as the body. How does this help me? -MM
#18453From: alec jasonJul 3, 1992 11:33 PM
Mike, I forgot to mention: When you make a copy of the arm, use tracks/copy/relative thereby duplicating the relative movements of the sword arm "into" the opposite arm. I'm not sure it will work but its what I would try. It's an interesting problem. Alec Jason
#18648From: Mike MorrisonJul 7, 1992 9:59 AM
Interesting idea, but since the arms are separated at the shoulders and joined at the hands, the whole movement of each arm is at different angles. For instance, take swinging a baseball bat, the right arm is cocked and the left arm is extended during the back swing. -MM
#18687From: alec jasonJul 7, 1992 5:07 PM
Mike, Yeah, I see what you mean about the two arms not always moving in the same manner . . . hmmm . . . I'm getting mentally fuzzy about the problem so this may be dumb but how about scaling the arm down and then scaling a new one up as I first suggested and then creating a new hierarchy (just for the new arm) in which the hand was the parent to the lower arm and the lower arm the parent to the upper arm. Then link the new arm's hand to the other hand. At this point you could copy tracks/relative from the master hand to the new hand. Then see what happens. You'll have to go through and fix each frame and by moving the upper-arm so that it appears to connect to the shoulder. I do this kind of down and dirty, baling wire, and duct tape stuff pretty often and there is usually a way to make it work. Or you could get rid of that two handed sword and give the guy a nice one-handed Glock 19, 9mm pistol. Alec Jason
#18743From: Mike MorrisonJul 8, 1992 11:30 AM
Believe me… I'm VERY tempted to go with the one-handed thing! Thanks for the ideas. I've got to re-read those comments about scaling though, I'll let you know how it works. -Mike DT (duct tape) Morrison
#18470From: Yost GroupJul 4, 1992 11:32 AM
I've got a better idea of what you're doing now — hmm… Alec's suggestion is pretty interesting, and besides that, you'll just have to keyframe the other arm manually. – G
#18651From: Mike MorrisonJul 7, 1992 10:01 AM
Yep, that's what I figured and so did. Not much fun though… it seems like the best suggestion is to keep the number of keyframes down to a minimum, and tuning down the TCB to remove as much arcing as possible. -MM