Instructor Certification
4 messages in this thread
Pat,
>>> There is NO WAY for Non Degree personell to teach at the Comm. College or
public school level here in PA <<< That's their loss!!
This sounds like a load if you've come by your knowledge in a Practical manner
as opposed to the above paper trail.
Remind me never to move to PA.
Of course If I move my dealership there then I'm qualified to teach from the
storefront with 5 days of AutoDesk training in Sausilito…Go Figure!!!!
>>> Personally, I say Big Deal to all this because we all Know of great, and
talented people who may be wonderful instructors who do not have degree ONE.
Actually this is what scares me about the entire bugaboo of
C_E_R_T_I_F_I_C_A_T_I_I_N_G ATC INSTRUCTORS. Are we locking out those
potentially great people? FWIW <<<
I agree with this of course in my own best interests being a non-degree'd
fellow.<g> But this is what all this instructor certification Talk is all
about isn't it?
After all… we want to be "Fair".
Personally I never beleived in all these over-degreed requirements myself.
I've got a total of 2 years College. My last year was 1973 and I was involved
in something personally that our Biology Professor told me was not possible.
Something new for that time called Bio-Feedback.
You might remember Berkley had a little Lab Department that was Using the
AutoGenic Systems Bio-Feedback devices.
I was Attending the Univertisy of Wisconsin and Flew out to Berkley to find out
about it. Bought my own AutoGen 120 and learned to control blood flow and
Brain Wave Amplitude and Frequency. On my own thank you without any degrees. I
went to Open meetings at my own expense and was responsible for a local
Psychologist's "Discovering" the World of Bio-feedback to the point that he
opened a clinic and pioneered working with Brain damaged and otherwise
"supposed" "Damaged" Persons.
He's doing fine right now too 15 years after his hospital told him to take a
walk for going against the system. Now he's helping people walk that we're told
they never would and I feel absolutly wonderful knowing I had something to do
with it.
BTW my Biology Professor Called my Bluff and brought in a $40,000.00 Doller
(1973 dollars)<g> Bioencephalagraph/WhatEVER to test my actual Brainwave output
frequency and Amplitude as well as heartbeat…needless to say I proved you
could beat a lie-detector as well as slow down your heart while putting out
perfect Alpha wave's, Carry on a conversation Drop into Theta and
increase/decrease the amplitude on demand.
That January I received 2 extra University Of Wisconsin College credits for
showing everybody how it was done. Degrees Don't Impress me….the only person
I have to impress is myself and so far I haven't.<g> But I'll never give up
trying. Its the trying, the road to understanding thats important! LaTER.<BG>
James M. Murphy
Dear James:
Not to jump in, but I'm on your side.
As most people know I get almost violent when it comes to a discussion of
certification. I'm not even sure I'm too happy with the Certification for
Users since I'm not sure I'm qualified, nor do I know anyone qualified enough
to make such a judgement.
For example, YOU make think layers are important, and I might think layers are
important – but the guy at Hughes who wrote an entire NC application which cut
parts using a variety of NC machines from inside AutoCAD never seemed to miss
them. Now you tell me whose a better User of AutoCAD? If he were to judge you
and I
Well . . . I just don't know where we'd be.
And instructor certification seems just as insidious.
And I HAVE all the qualifications – a degree, publications, previous
experience. So I'm in by all the usual measurements.
I have attended universities and had instructors (qualified and everything) who
couldn't teach, who hated students, and whose understanding of how to apply the
information they provided was dubious at best.
So – how is Autodesk going to license/credential trainers in such a fashion as
to avoid this problem?
And, even if I'm TECHNICALLY competent – does that mean I can teach AutoCAD any
old way I want to?
Seems like it would make lots more sense to accredit or license a curriculum,
and then have tests for the students that measure understanding of the
curriculum presented. After all, its easier to get the quality of training
Instructor Certification is supposed to give you if you focus on the results.
Trained Students.
In fact, I would rabidly support a 'standard curriculum' with tests measuring
delivery of that curriculum – i.e. what the students absorbed. And developing
that curriculum would take a hell of a lot less work for everyone than
developing a fair/standard/uniform test to accredit instructors.
ATC instructors would turn in the tests with the 'Performance Evaluation'
sheets.
And people could petition to have documents/training manuals certified by
Autodesk. This means the curriculum would grow.
I'm not against accountability, just arbitrary standards.
Not that I'm not a team player and all. I figure a poor qualification
procedure would alienate so many people (trainers, students, ATCs, dealers,
Universities, Community Colleges) that Autodesk isn't going to let it happen.
So I guess I'll go along with whatever they say. Maybe they know better.
'Sides
My Daddy (who hired engineers for the China Lake Naval Weapons Laboratory as
Technical Director) says "Engineers are born, not made." And he was always
smart enough to hire someone based on performance – not credentials.
Most people are that smart.
ADVANSTAR,
I disagree with a common cirriculum as it sets a minimum standard which many
will only match. It also promotes an assembly line mentality towards processing
students. I DO believe that a technically competent individual should be
allowed to teach any way they feel comfortable as long as desired course
objectives are met.
Dennis
Wow,
Great reply. You woke up my mail for the night here. Actually I agree with your
thoughts on degrees. Its what you can do not what the paper says you can do. I
have learned this many times with students at a national contest that had tough
competetion. The competetors resume kicked butt but they couldn't get out the
work to win.
I hope I didn't scare you off from PA we need more innovative people like you.
The Bio-feedback stuff has always interested me and someday I will have a
complete system integrated with VR<g> When I die and gho to Nirvana.
I think as we get more into technology and online learning we will see the
importance of the degree and the Instituion go away. What say you?
Share more of your bio learning adventures with us PLEASE.
By all means keep up the lively dialog here on instructor cert. PAT