CompuServe Thread

#"Exploring LW 3D!?"

4 messages in this thread
#122135From: Todd PayneSep 11, 1995 11:28 PM
Sean, As you are the person who started this thread with your views on my work, I'll address this to you, but write it to anyone interested in my thoughts on "Exploring LightWave 3D". First of all, I am not one to hide my head just because someone has posed negative views on my work, so to your surprise I'll comment on points you've mentioned. In your "unsolicited review" as you call it, you have laced 4 or 5 very positive comments about the book amongst some very negative views. They are generally attached to expressions of the book being a viable source of information for newer users of LW. What seemed to trouble you was the fact that the book was advertised as an "Advanced Users Guide". I too reviewed the ads placed by New Era Press. I'm not sure exactly where you get the impression that NEP misrepresented the content of the book. However, I do believe these are honest assessments of your views of the marketing methods used to promote the book. For this misunderstanding, I apologize. Advertising and marketing are quite often abstract and ambiguous by nature. As end users we would prefer that this was not true, but it is! Every ad I can recall from the marketing campaign stated verbiage akin to "from beginner to advanced…" I do believe there is material that qualifies as advanced. I dont know if there is enough of it to satisfy most advanced users. Obviously not all of them, but than again there are always people whose skills rate well above the authors of the text which is available in thier industry. The point here is that NEP would like to allow users to make that decision on their own. This brings me to the next important point…. If anyone is not completely satisfied with the book they can return it. The phone call does not have to be accompanied by any reason whatsoever. Other persons who have joined this thread have changed the flow of the thread to make people believe that because we were late on shipping the book they could probably never get a refund. This is not only untrue, but very unfair as well. What is most unfair is that one of the persons who has joined this thread has already received a refund but fails to praise NEP for fast response. Not only will a refund be issued to whoever so desires, but it will be sent out Priority the same day the request is made. Feel free to hold me and NEP to that promise. One other point. It is far more likely to see negative responses to any book, software, etc. in a forum like this than positive ones from persons who are pleased with the products. For those of you who are considering purchasing the book, please remember that there are opposing views on any and all work. The choice is, and always has been the consumers, as to whether the material is useful or not. The response to the book has been overwhelmingly positive! It has been adopted as text at 22 colleges. It has been shipped to 21 different countries. A Japanese translation is currently in the works. This is not to say that all of the hoopla is because this is the best "Advanced Guide" on LW, but because this is a resource on LightWave that was a serious undertaking. A serious undertaking which will now spur other book companies to create text on LW. For that, and this book, I am very proud!!! Todd Payne – New Era Press If it is a deciding factor, I do have available a list of VERY POSITIVE reviews from well respected industry leaders such as Tom Patrick – Editor in Chief,Video Toaster User Frank Kelly – Industry Contributing Computer Graphics Author R. Shamms Mortier Ph.D – College Professor as well as 5 other college professors, dozens of positive testimonials etc….. Because these tend to be self gratuitous, I will not post them unless requested!!
#122163From: michael mcbrideSep 12, 1995 9:03 AM
PMFJI Todd, <<For that, and this book, I am very proud!!!>> Concerning you rebuttal of the comments on your book in this thread – well spoken, well said. We who may be considered "Power Users" of LightWave should remember that many of our techniques were discovered through hours of trial and error. However,a user companion of this magnitude during the "learning" process would have been a welcomed asset. I encourage everyone who still wonders where the merge points tool is (for example) to place an order for this book immediately. It'll be an invaluable tool for you. As to blaming the advertiser's marketing methods for our misunderstandings, Horse Hockey Pucks! Do you honestly expect us to believe that you didn't review the ads before they were placed, that you didn't notice the implied meaning (that "even an advanced user would find the refernce a valuable tool.")? Yah, right! I don't blame Sean for his review, as I've purchased the book also, and believe his mixture of positive comments with negative ones to be appropriate. 100% of this book will be extremely useful to beginners, 50% (or less) of this book will be useful to intermediate users, but only about 5% of the book is useful (IMHO) to expert or "advanced" users. A ratio that makes me wish I'd spent my $60.00 on a HD floppy drive for my A2000, or something. I do appreciate your making New Era's refund policy clear. Unconditional Refund is about as good as it gets. I however, like Sean, will probobly hang onto my copy. We are starting a LW/Toaster user group this week, and Exploring LightWave 3D will no doubt come in handy during these meetings. Thank you for not "hiding your head"! ;^) PS-In case you haven't already notice, there is still a need for a concise reference book directed toward advanced/expert users. Your next project, perhaps? ;^) Take care, Michael,CyberGrafx.3D
#122171From: Sean HannonSep 12, 1995 10:30 AM
Todd, Thank you for your graciousness under fire. I also appreciate that you heard all of my points fairly, no mean feat when one's work is being harshly criticized. I share responsibility for my dissatisfaction with the book. I wanted the book to be what I wanted it to be. 500 pages of tips, techniques and tutorials designed to wrestle LW to the ground. I wanted every page to burst with LW legerdemain that would make even Boucher smile and say, "Now THAT's nasty!". In other words, I wanted the definitive LW Bible. Does such a thing exist? Probably not. (Unless you bound every issue of LWPro together, which I have) Was such a thing actually promised? Again, probably not. But it is, IMO, legitimately debatable. In the March `95 issue of VTU there is an ad for the book when it was called "Lightwave on Location!". And while it does indeed clearly state that it is a manual geared for all Lightwave enthusiasts from beginner to advanced, there are other claims within the ad refering to the advanced aspects that are just not borne out by the final product. One bulleted line that appeared was this: * Exploring Lightwave! – an advanced section including complete explanations and tutorials on all of Lightwave's functions. That alone teased me with the hope that I would not only get to look under the hood, but I'd get underneath and get good and greasy. Then there were the references to "mastering" this and that in the ad. And again, it can be argued that the info contained in your book combined with a many hours of hands-on work would eventually lead one to master a difficult feature. But to claim as you did that the Spline and Patches tutorial would show how to master this powerful tool… well, we have different definitions of what it means to master something as opposed to giving a usable introduction. Finally, the suspense built over a year as publication was delayed (so that the latest info on 4.0 could be included) only served to bolster my image of a book of never-before-seen material on LW. However, the lion's share of the book is in fact a reproduction of material covered in the original manual sewn together by a comfortable, informal narrative. I was sincere in stating that this is a fine book for every Lightwave novice, and I am happy to know that it is being included in the curriculum of many colleges. If I were just beginning, and had my choice of learning Lightwave from the Newtek manual or your book, I'd go for yours in a second. Your thoroughness and clarity in highlighting Lightwave's many features shows this book to be a true labor of love. And your offer to make refunds shows you to be an honorable person as well. Sean Hannon Ad Rats – Stamford, CT
#122201From: Trevor LowSep 12, 1995 2:20 PM
After reading Exploring Lightwave 3D cover to cover, I have to say I am disapointed. I realise that not everybody is looking for an advanced book on Lightwave, however, this book doesn't even cover all the basic features of the software. When I read a manual, I keep a pen and paper nearby to make notes of items of interest, techniques I was unaware of, new ways of doing things, etc. After reading this book, my notepad was blank. Now I agree that this book would be of benefit to someone who has just cracked the LightWave box for the first time. However to someone who has spent a little time with the software (and read the manuals), I feel that the LightWave portion of the book has little to offer. The reason I'm posting this note, is that I feel this book fell so far short of it's advertised promise (in terms of intermediate and advanced topics), that after reading the book, I felt scammed. This wouldn't bother me if the book was bound in yellow and sold as "Lightwave for Dummies" or something like that, but don't tell me it's an advanced set of tutorials, because it isn't. Trevor Low, Ecofab International Inc. P.S. I do respect you coming on-line to defend the book. I agree the book has a valid use in the training of LightWave. I don't agree with false advertising.