Toaster 2.0
32 messages in this thread
Any words on the new Toaster (v2.0) software!?
Pat
– via Whap!
Pat,
The Video Toaster 2.0 upgrade has not been released yet.
It is planned to be released sometime in the fall but a specific
date is not yet available.
As soon as I have something solid, I will post a notice here.
RAD Moose
"'o.o'"
Moose…
now that we have ageneral release time frame, do you have any idea
about the price??? Free, $20, $50, $100, $1000???? Thanx
Brad Hayes
Brad,
There is no specific information available on Video Toaster 2.0
including date of release, price, or how many disks will it take.
When any information is available, it will be posted here as soon as
possible.
RAD Moose
"'o.o'"
All
I heard that the upgrade will be $300.00 – plus the toaster is going up
$900.00 in price.
Bob Naffziger – Vivid Copy Inc.
Bob,
To the best of my knowledge, no annoucements of a price increase or
of the cost of the Video Toaster 2.0 system has been made.
NewTek will be at Comdex next week and I hope to be able to get a
connection to CompuServe from there to provide all of the information as
soon as it is released.
RAD Moose
"'o.o'"
RAD;
Have you considered changing your "NAME" on the forum. Looks like the
[NewTek] is 'illegal' as far as Whap! is concerned and thus you will not
appear in the address book. Maybe changing to something like "RAD
Moose/NewTek" would clear the problem up.
Bill,
I have been using the RAD Moose [NewTek] name since this seems to be
the preferred format for most people on CompuServe, but I will go into the
Amiga forums and change it. (Since this is being sent on an automated
session, the update will not happen until my next manual session, which
should be in the next 24 hours.)
Since I do not use WHAP!, I do not come across this problem.
Previously, I had RAD Moose @ NewTek and some software choked on that. Are
there any other characters in the address line that WHAP! chokes on?
RAD Moose
"'o.o'"
What the hell is WHAP!?
Bill,
I just changed my name on the Amiga forums to "RAD Moose / NewTek".
Hopefully this will not cause problems with WHAP!, but I would still like
to see this problem fixed with the program.
I do appriciate you bringing this to my attention.
RAD Moose
"'o.o'"
Rad;
Maybe I should have directed this to Steve Ahlstrom first but in the last
couple of days, I have tried to get your name/uid into the address book. I
just tried again (with the '/' rather than the '[' present, went and looked
and the one from yesterday was there! Now, I know that I checked each time
that I tried and even added some others to be sure that it wasn't something
with just the 'add to book' command.
You are probably better off to leave it as is but a question to Steve would
likely be in order. Thanks,
-bill/ARS KB7LX
Bill,
I will leave a message to Steve Ahlstrom sometime this month
(heheh.. Comdex, Oingo Boingo and Moosettes sort of hoof me busy this month
and I do not know if I am going to be at the keyboard any time soon.)
Thanks for bringing this up. [I do know that the INTERNET gateway
on CIS does not like RAD Moose @ NewTek, so I changed it, but then again, I
am not AT the main offices anymore… Southern California Moose…hehe]
RAD Moose
"'o.o'"
Moose:
Have you ever thought of going to work at the White House? You
are SOOO very good at denying rumors…
Jokinly, Brad
Brad,
I deny everything becuase unless it is written and official, it does
not exist. People had problems with us making comments about future
releases and then they complained if everything was not 100% the same, so I
do not post any information until after it is offical.
[BTW, I did have dinner with someone last night regarding my running
for President of the United States in 1994]
RAD Moose
"'o.o'"
Well I can tell you the price increase is not a rumor, and I got to say
that NewTek is on some serious drugs. First they choose not to use the
Amiga name on anything they produce in advertising which I guess is ok, but
now they price the toaster out of the range of the consumer. Effectively
telling the average Amiga owner that you do not want their business.
The price of the toaster as of Monday of next week is $2495. Those
unforunate souls who want to upgrade to the new Toaster software will have
to fork over $400.
How do I know this? Simple. Call the distributors. They are mad as hell.
I had plans to purchase a toaster if and when the thing was supported on
the A3000. At that price, NewTek can keep it.
-mark=
– via the Whapster!
Mark, interesting tidbit, but it doesn't make sense that Newtek would
advertise the free Revolution Videotape in major mags since it states
plainly the price of $1595, unless they have another version of Revolution
already duplicated in the wharehouse with the new price tagged in,
certainly a possibility. I also had talked to some development people
working for Newtek that told me the last word they heard on 2.0 was $100
not $400. You might want to check with your distributer and see if maybe he
wasn't talking about the price on the "Workstation" model for the "Mac"
which has seperate software for importing graphics and the mac interface
for controlling the toaster. I'm not discounting the possibility of a
radical price change, rumors have been flying lately, but they are just
that, rumors. I guess we'll know by Monday if your source is correct.
Frank
Frank
My dealer says that his distributor confirms the price increase for the
Toaster board.
-bill/ARS KB7LX
All you say is true…although on their latest "sales tool", the 100,000+
copies of their video "REVOLUTION" does say….."the Video Toaster captures
all the power and all the quality of a $100,000 TV studio and puts it in
your Amiga……." I thought that was a Great AD!
Mark,
You say the price increase has been mentioned by distributor as
being next Monday. Since I am not in the marketing department, I cannot
comment on future pricing, products or availability.
As far as pricing it out of the range of the consumer or average
Amiga user, please feel free to write to the marketing department.
Of course, I have my own opinions, but this is not the area to argue
on how to market the Video Toaster.
RAD Moose
"'o.o'"
Rad,
Are you inviting me not to post in your forum because I am upset about the
handling of this price increase? I certainly hope not. The video toaster
is an important product for the Amiga community, it would be nice if the
thing was not priced into intersteller orbit.
Are you telling me that my information is inaccurate? I sure would love to
find out that it is–but I suspect by now we both know that it is true.
Don't read me wrong. I believe in capitalism. I believe NewTek should be
able to price their product at the price they want, but I also believe they
have the right to go out of business. So please tell marketing that unless
they wish to alienate their entire supporting group, namely Amiga owners,
that they had better at least let the people who supported NewTek by buying
a not-ready-for-market product an upgrade to 2.0 for the $100 price instead
of the $400. By the way I know that the beta stuff was upgraded to 1.0 for
free.
No. I don't have a video toaster, and no, it doesn't look like I want one.
The Apple philosphy of pricing is not something I will ever support, or
recommend. In case you are wondering I did do a lot of toaster
recommendations.
By the way.. why is NewTek so ashamed of the Amiga? Opps, Sorry, that is a
marketing question.
Sorry folks, but I am angry about this. I am angry because of how it is
being done. I have been on a slow boil over the "marketing" of the toaster
for quite some time, this only puts the iceing on the cake.
-mark=
– via the Whapster!
I don't blame you for being angry. I too had hopes of buying a Toaster and
voiding my 3000's warranty and was JUST about ready to swing for the
Toaster when I saw some Usenet messages about the price increase. I called
my favorite local Amiga dealer to ask what was up and they confirmed what I
had read but could offer no reasons. If it is true, it sure would have
been nice to have had a warning that it was going to happen.
Having not seen the 2.0 upgrade yet (I know many Toaster owners), judging
from the opinions of the people who walk into my favorite dealer, the 2.0
upgrade offers many new capabilities in many areas. If the changes have
been massive, $400 can be justified. It takes money to pay the people who
do the code so and I'm sure more than one person has been hard at work at
the 2.0 upgrades.
I certainly hope all this is untrue or that NewTek has something else up
it's sleeves. I was so close to have a Toaster JUST FOR LightWave but at
$2495, it's out of my reach. If the new price stands, I certainly hope
they come out with a standalone version of LightWave!
Poor Rad here is also around in SoCal and not in Topeka so things can
happen pretty quick without him knowing.
Dan McCoy – via Whap! and saving money doing it too!
As I mentioned in replies to Mark, the Video Toaster 2.0 upgrade
will be part of the new package. Current units at the new price will have
a registration card that when sent in will put the Video Toaster owner on
the 2.0 list. Existing owners will be receiving information via US Mail on
the upgrade.
As you mention, yes, it has taken LOTS of people (many more have
been hired since the "Video Toaster Group" portrait advertisement. I am
located in Southern California, the Marketing and R&D groups are in Topeka
and our sales department is in Minnesota, so some things are not getting to
me as fast as I would like, but since I now have a FAX system here, we hope
to correct that.
As far as LightWave standalone… no plans at this time. Regarding
pricing of Amiga products… (I really dont like to use other companies
products as an example…) but there have been some products (software
ONLY) that were priced over the cost of the Video Toaster.
My online time is to provide technical support. I do not get paid
for any of this. [I decided that I prefer Southern California
weather…hehe] When it comes to Marketing decisions I am not "in the
loop".
Mark,
As you have already read, I posted information regarding the price
increase based upon the information that was given to me last night.
"Are you inviting me not to post in your forum becuase I am upset
about the handling of this price increase?" No, I am saying that posting
a message here will not reach the people who make the decisions. I do not
handle marketing oriented aspects of the Video Toaster or any part of the
NewTek product line. That is up to the Marketing Department in Kansas and
the Sales Department in Minnesota.
I do not have a address for the sales department, but if you would
like to write to the marketing department, they can be reached at:
NewTek,Inc.
Marketing Department
215 SE Eighth Street
Topeka Kansas 66603
Sincerely,
RAD Moose
"'o.o'"
I do not believe that Netwek is ashamed of the Amiga name. I think that
they saw the, perhaps irrational, reaction to the name (it is, after all, a
game machine in many people's eyes), and made a *marketing* decision to
stop using the name whenever possible. They did not move the product to a
different platform or build their own platform for it. They are still
supporting the sale of Amigas, which is a good thing. They are trying not
to take the heat for the mistakes of Commodore, which swered up in certain
marketing areas themselves.
You know, I never cease to wonder at the rightous indignation of people
when a producer sets a price they don't like.
Sure, don't buy it – that I can see – that's the way to vote and it WILL
affect the company (even newtek notices a few grand, multiplied by very few
votes).
But it IS their product, and they can price it as they like.
The distributors are a perfect example. Jerks.
Ben
Then perhaps you don't know the full story Ben.
It is not just that NewTek raised their price. Yes, I am angry about it
but agree they have every right. However, dealers orders were sent back,
saying "sorry, newtek raised their price". As wonderful as that might
sound many machines are purchased by schools and state/government agencies
who go through a procurement process.
Entire computer system sales are being lost!
It is one thing to raise a price, another not to honor the price for a
reasonable amount of time.
NewTek has told several dealerships that they (after this had already
happened) would go ahead and accept the order, if it was filed _before_
Monday. That is right… MONDAY.
Now tell me, would Black Belt ever do that?
Yes, I agree the distributors can be jerks, but I am not so sure the "jerk
call" is fair this time. Perhaps so.
By the way, I still stand behind my last comment. NewTek is making a
serious mistake.
-mark=
– via the Whapster!
The thing is, it's their mistake to make. At least, I think it is.
These things are always complicated; and it's hard to know it all. But a
the bottom of the heap, NT has something to sell you. You see a perceived
value, and you decide buy or not. That's the arbiter of the market. And I
think it's the only one that counts.
If it's not worth it – don't buy it.
As for orders being sent back… I'd be surprised if that wasn't a plain
vanilla screwup.
Mind you, I am NOT a fan of Newtek, particularly. They're not very helpful
to us, generally, and they can really be a pain when you try and work with
them. But they own the toaster till you exchange currency equivalent for
it.
Would we do it? Dunno. Maybe. You never know what the future holds. I'd
like to think we're more considerate of our customers than that – but if we
were crashing, cash-wise, or something similar… I think we'd do what we
had to do to save the company and the people who work here.
Ben
Is is your understanding that NewTek is refusing the orders directly, or
are the distributors refusing the orders for low-priced Video Toasters?
I think you should make the distintion clear. I was under the impression
that most Video Toaster sales to dealers happened at the distribution
level.
Mark,
The Video Toaster has been repriced at $2495 for the version to
install into an existig Amiga 2000 series computer with a hard drive and 5
megs or more of RAM. This includes the upgrade to Video Toaster 2.0 when
it is available.
The Video Toaster Workstation is still priced at $3995 and the Video
Toaster Workstation/30 is still priced at $8995, but does not include the
upgrade to the Video Toaster 2.0 at this time.
The Macintosh Video Toaster Workstations are priced the same, but
availability has not yet been set.
There is no information as of today on other platform support.
The Video Toaster 2.0 upgrade will be $395 and information will be
sent to all registered Video Toaster owners. ESTIMATED availability is
12/15/91 for Video Toaster 2.0.
The Video Toaster 2.0 is concidered "a hardware upgrade on disk" due
to the design of the Video Toaster. Most video equipment does not even
have an upgrade path, let alone one that provides many new features.
I hope to have a list of what is new in the release of 2.0, so I can
post it here in the near future.
RAD Moose
"'o.o'"
Thank you for assurance that we will know when it happens, rather than
hearing it through the Grapevine….that "they" had it 3 weeks ago! Do you
know if distribution will be first-come-first-serve? or chronological based
on 1st owner down the line? Also…I may have missed it in the discussion,
but do you know if 2.0 will eliminate the "color shift" when using some
DVE's?
Thanks Alot!
Kip,
Since I work offsite at a location in Southern California, and the
sales department has been moved from the main office in Kansas to a
location in Minnesota, there is a possibility of a delay of information
online, but I will try to get the information out as soon as possible.
This Monday, I expect to be at ComDex in Las Vegas and will
hopefully be able to log on Monday night to post a report of some kind.
I do not have any information on what features or fixes will be in
Toaster 2.0, nor do I have specific information on pricing, availabilty,
etc.
As soon as I know for sure, I will post it.
RAD Moose
"'o.o'"