CompuServe Thread

Street Atlas USA

25 messages in this thread
#30680From: Bill LutholtzNov 10, 1992 1:35 PM
I just got a copy of DeLorme's Street Atlas USA and did the natural thing: pulled up my address and started looking around my neighborhood. When I pulled back to a 12X magnification view of Indianapolis, I noticed some BIZARRE things…like place names of buildings and institutions that have been gone from the landscape for 20-30 years or more. Our baseball stadium (Bush) had its WWII-era name (Victory Field). Riverside Amusement Park, torn down when I was a kid, is back. So's the Mallory Technical Institute. St. Vincent Hospital is in the spot it occupied up until about 1974 on Fall Creek Parkway. Interstates and state roads all appear to be in the right spots, but many of the place names around them are from the wrong end of the time-space continuum. DeLorme tech staff says they pulled their info from the 1980-85 TIGER databank of the U.S. Census Department. Is this just an Indianapolis phenomenon, or are other parts of the country having similar problems? –Bill
#30720From: Paul Zane PilzerNov 10, 1992 11:14 PM
The map dating problems with DeLorme's Street Atlas are not just limited to Indiana. Our firm has used the disc for CD-ROM demonstrations for hundreds of people–and always hear that the local maps are from outer space. It seems that they have street names and places chosen randomly from different decades.
#30733From: Bill LutholtzNov 11, 1992 7:31 AM
Glad to hear they weren't just ganging up on Hoosierland! <G> –Bill
#30753From: Steve LeenNov 11, 1992 7:34 PM
I work for DeLorme. I also DEMO Street Atlas and other DeLorme products around the country. While the data is not without flaws I challenge you to find another product for your firm to demo like Street Atlas. DeLorme is interested in correcting data and will be doing so in our up-date next year. We would appreciate hearing from you. In any case we appreciate your using our product for demos and for helping make Street Atlas a Top Selling CD Title. Have you seen our latest product, MapExpert??
#30761From: Bill LutholtzNov 11, 1992 9:43 PM
Steve -I'm curious how these errors could've crept into the program — I mean SERIOUSLY! 20-year-old place name errors? Streets changing and new housing developments I can understand. Anybody will cut you some slack for that kind of stuff with a new product. But you've got three "airports" listed in the downtown Indianapolis area that just DON'T EXIST! And, should anyone try to land a plane at one of these places and crash, I hope they don't use the map to find their way to St. Vincent Hospital — which is about a half hour's drive from where you've located it! It looks like the program was put together by someone using VERY OLD maps… When I called about it, someone on the tech staff said that the info was taken from the U.S. Census TIGER data. If so, is TIGER really this far off course? Maybe we ought to be complaining to them…? I also noticed that Patoka Lake in Southern Indiana (near Paoli) isn't on the map, though the town of Newton Stewart is shown. Newton Stewart's at the BOTTOM of Patoka — the town was submerged when the lake was opened in the late-1970s. –Bill
#30782From: Monte DavisNov 12, 1992 4:59 AM
Street Atlas is a bargain *at the price* — but when I've paid more (as I probably will) for Map Expert, I'll start begrudging the errors more. Two that I remember offhand: in Manhattan, the "Yorkville" label is way downtown instead of on the upper East Side (roughly 3 Ave & 86th St) where it should be… and in New Jersey, the "Maplewood" label is floating in West Orange instead of two miles south, around the (correctly placed) Maplewood train station. On the other hand, I was pleasantly shocked to find even the logging roads around my other home (Pockwockamus rapids, 17 mi WNW of Millinocket, ME)… good grief, was TIGER set up to include moose and blackflies? 'cause there are scarcely any other permanent residents *there*… Best from S. Orange, NJ…
#30931From: Paul Zane PilzerNov 14, 1992 12:55 AM
I agree that Delorme is the best product around although it seems embarassing when the data is so off for many residential users. Can you get the Mapsco data available in most cities–that is the most accurate we've seen. Our firm has probably sold a few hundred Street Atlas' purchased from our dealer–is there a way we can buy directly from you? If you'll contact Mr. Reed Bilbray (800-460-4623) we'd be happy to send you our new multimedia CD-ROM titles (being released in December) and discuss how to bettter work together. THanks. Paul Pilzer ZCI, Inc.
#31057From: Bill LutholtzNov 16, 1992 7:20 AM
A curious thing… I left a note here a few days ago for the DeLorme rep who logged on, asking about the abnormalities I'd noticed in the Street Atlas disk (incorrect building locations on several major structures, several places that were razed by wrecking balls more than 20 years ago, three "airports" in downtown Indianapolis that don't exist, and a lake in southern Indiana that's missing…). Rather than reply to my question, he apparently decided to simply delete it from the board! Strange way to respond to customers' questions, don't you think…? –Bill p.s. — My unanswered question still stands: How did errors like these find their way into a NEW program? From appearances, it would seem they came from VERY old maps.
#31081From: John F FlanaganNov 16, 1992 3:50 PM
Hum, glad you mentioned that. I checked and my responce to his posting was deleted also. I had assumed that it had just rolled off, but as it was a responce to a message 30753 that has not rolled off, mine must have been deleted also. Reinforces my viey of DeLorme.
#31164From: Bill SimonsenNov 17, 1992 9:13 PM
John, I don't mean to jump into this in the middle, and I don't know *what* is going on, but I can tell you that Delorme is a class act as a company. It's quite possible one person made an error here, who knows? But the company, and the individual who gave it his name and heads it, are highly respected and quite incapable of intentionally mistreating a customer! -Bill
#31091From: Rich Bowers/OPANov 16, 1992 6:16 PM
To the best of my knowledge, one person cannot delete another person's message. The message scroll does not necessarily go in message # sequence: are you sure your message was not a victim of the scroll? I interject just because I would not want your addressee to get a bad rap for something he cannot do. Can you re-post your message? He may simply have been away long enough to miss it! Let me know if the problem occurs again. Rich Bowers co-sysop
#31092From: Albert DayesNov 16, 1992 6:22 PM
Don't you have all the powers in the world being a sysop? <grin>
#31095From: Rich Bowers/OPANov 16, 1992 7:09 PM
If I did, things would be just a teeeeny bit different around here. By the way, the FAQ file has been loaded and we're just waiting for the great Master Merge to turn it on so it is visible. Then I'll make a general announcement. It turned out to be 70K uncompressed, so I stripped off the Table of Contents so that people could see what was covered before they download the whole thing. I'll look forward to your comments when you can get around to it. Your ideas helped a lot! Cheers Rich
#31101From: Albert DayesNov 16, 1992 8:40 PM
I can't wait to see it myself. I'll probably be at Comdex tomorrow. This will really help all the users of this forum tremendously. Thanks for your support.
#31104From: Rich Bowers/OPANov 16, 1992 9:02 PM
I hope you have the time to let us know what the important things were in Vegas. At COMDEX, I mean. Have fun! Rich
#31169From: Albert DayesNov 17, 1992 11:22 PM
Rich, You can only see so much in 8 hours … most of the time is just going from hotel to hotel trying to find a booth. <grin> I just grabbed literature mostly and I didn't see too much in detail though. Its been a long Comdex day … maybe tomorrow won't be so bad.
#31120From: Bill LutholtzNov 17, 1992 7:33 AM
Rich — Forum software allows for either the sender OR the receiver to delete a message. You just read the message as you normally would and then type DEL. The system also provides a "Delete message? Y/N" prompt to doublecheck for bad typing. And, yes, I reset the age on my messages back to a few days BEFORE I posted my original note, to make sure that it hadn't scrolled off elsewhere. It was simply deleted — plain and simple. A simple reply from DeLorme, even if it was nothing more than "We're looking into the problems" was all that was really necessary. –Bill
#31126From: Rich Bowers/OPANov 17, 1992 12:19 PM
I'm sorry to hear that. I agree a response would have been, at minimum, polite. Rich Bowers
#31167From: FRED THOMASNov 17, 1992 10:53 PM
Using CIM to delete a message only deletes it from your board – not from the system.
#31140From: Frank/Lisa RichardsNov 17, 1992 4:55 PM
Rich, Anyone can delete messages that they sent, or that are addressed _to_ them. And I'm pretty sure that scrolling does happen in numeric order. (Unless they're held by a W flag or forwarded by a B flag.) It does indeed take your B flag to zap or move third party messages. Albert of the 7-triple-0 number can doubtless tell you of the mystic powers that accrue with a W flag<grin>. Frank
#31147From: Rich Bowers/OPANov 17, 1992 8:05 PM
Frank: Yes, I'm learning about some of those mystical features. The other time scrolling doen't work numerically (directly) is when the oldest message is part of a still-active thread. But apparently the problem was indeed just as the member described it. It's ashame. The Foru is supposed to be information exchange – and you gotta take the bad with the good! Thanks for the input! Rich
#31112From: David HaydenNov 16, 1992 10:54 PM
Bill, I don't know about the lake, but I'll bet that the "nonexistent" airports are actually helicopter pads – they show up as airports. I've seen several oddly placed airports that turned out to be right! Dave
#31121From: Bill LutholtzNov 17, 1992 7:33 AM
Helipads makes some sense at least… Although, in that case, they've missed the Indianapolis Heliport, the city's largest helicopter airport. I was reading the fine print in their license agreement last night and noticed that it specifically prohibits you from using their maps for navigating by land, sea, or air. Given these various points, that could be a very good thing. –Bill
#31168From: FRED THOMASNov 17, 1992 10:53 PM
Did you zoom in to 15/16 power? Look at the Hawaiian Islands at 6 and then go to 14/15. Also check what you think is missing or wrong with a USGS topo which can be bought at most good sporting goods stores.
#31166From: FRED THOMASNov 17, 1992 10:53 PM
I saw a reply from DeLorme explaining why some differences show up. I thought he expressed a willingnes to collect problem reports. Remember, they don't go to every town and draw maps. The data comes mostly from Gov. Maps and info. and from some towns. I know some of people in Freeport and think highly of them. Worked with several for several years in the computer industry and visit once in a while. It is a small and highly dynamic company. Also if it were possible for a member to delete messages these forums would have very few. Visit some of the areas where contriversial subjects are being discussed.