CompuServe Thread

#CEI/CBM Status

15 messages in this thread
#173602From: John Toebes/SYSOPNov 22, 1994 8:52 PM
Well, your arguments all sound good. I can only speak for myself, but if whoever gets the Amiga pushed the euromarket and ignores the US market at the start, I'll move over to PCs and forget the Amiga altogether. I can't imagine I'm the only one. So, if enough others feel the same way, your course means the death of the Amiga in N. America, in any event.
#173636From: Mark D. ManesNov 22, 1994 11:05 PM
Jim, Commodore spent way too much time 'milking' the European cow. The milk spoiled I figure… or how can you explain a company going out of business when 80% of the market is in Europe? 🙂 The market for the Amiga is here and there. The US has driven the personal computer market to where it is today. I don't see that changing. Doing what the UK wants and creating a computer company that specializes in low-end products for the Chinese (rumor there) is not what I have in mind for Amiga. Instead a re-focusing of marketing energy and good engineering on the things the Amiga is good at today is the best way to preserve the technology and step it forward to create new high end and low-end products for the world marketplace. The UK doesn't seem to understand that based on the conferences I have read with Pleasance. Give me 8MB of chip memory–or give me a Pentium. 🙂 -mark= Otto Pilot Engaged..
#173723From: Jim Drew/UUINov 23, 1994 4:11 AM
The only thing that killed Commodore was the management. They had a decent income outside of the US. For the last two years, Commodore UK *completely* funded the US division. Commodore UK, Commodore Canada, and Commodore Germany all pulled their share to stay afloat (Commodore UK made enough profit to keep the US division floating). If you go through the corporate records you would be shocked… I almost thought the US government was running Commodore. Who the hell would pay $225 for a case and power supply… well, Commodore would… that is what they paid (in quantity) for the A4000's case and P/S. The price paid for parts is rediculous… maybe even scandalous… Looking at the figures, the A4000 costs 2 1/2 times as much as it should have… there is where the money went… not to mention Gould and Ali…
#174334From: Grant BoucherNov 26, 1994 4:40 PM
>$225 for a case and power supply… well, Commodore would… that is what >they paid (in quantity) for the A4000's case and P/S. The price paid for >parts is rediculous… maybe even scandalous… Let me guess, Mehdi was buying these parts from one of his other children or friends…unbelievable… Marlet acceptance for the Amiga was at its highest since it was first introduced. Before I went to work for Amblin, I worked as a free-lance animator and digital/video consultant and the Amiga had finally gained acceptance at Nickelodeon, Fox, Amblin, Warner Brothers, Disney, etc, etc. The CD32 was whooping Sega, etc., in Europe and the A1200 was the the home computer of choice in England and Germany. Despite the poorly designed A4000 (slow 040, no slots, IDE foolishness) and the A1200 problems (no fast ram, outdated 020) and the ultimately idiotic release of the A600, the Toaster market was booming and Europe was solidly Amiga. They used to hang men who could run a billion dollar corporation into the ground in 3 years, with sales and market acceptance up. Or, at least, the losers had the self respect to jump from a building when they had lost all honor. Oh yeah, I forgot, there is no honor among thieves. Said my peace…love my amiga…rendering on an Alpha-based PC on the sorriest excuse for multi-tasking I have ever seen. Grant Boucher – Amblin Imaging "It's hard to believe grown-ups do this for a living."
#174443From: Trent K. JohnsonNov 27, 1994 5:46 AM
Excellent views, Grant. There's little doubt the 'video' market in North America is the vanguard, with European 'games machines' equally important. Of course, I'm speaking in generalities. but… For the Amiga to continue (start?) to really move the major aspect must be price. There's not a real possibility of major technical advances in Amiga hardware right away, so those who finally take over have to make an afforable machine that highlights the current tech. Then, if and when the sales firm up, new tech can be researched. As one quick example, CEI (or whoever) could start marketing bare bones 4000's (add your own Warp, for example) for comparable prices to that of IBM systems. The goal would be to make a machine that, fully equipped, would price out similar to 486 systems, thereby making affordable "Flyer-ready" boxes. (And change the damn case so you can actually fit some decent components in there) Of course this is just one possible scenario… Trent/ReAnimators
#174510From: Jim MaddoxNov 27, 1994 1:46 PM
>> As one quick example, CEI (or whoever) could start marketing bare >> bones 4000's (add your own Warp, for example) for comparable prices to >> that of IBM systems. I hope they'll go ahead and do that, except for two things. First, it should be priced _lower_ than a comparable PC (a 4000/040/25 with monitor should be priced less than a DX2-50 non-multimedia system; a 4000/030/25 with monitor should be $900-$1000 or so). Second, forget the Warp — it's too darn expensive. Leave that for those serious enough about speed to need one. CEI (or whoever) should produce the 3640 boards with '030's (25/28, 40, 50MHz), '040's (25/28, 33, 40MHz), and even '060's (when available), like Commodore was supposedly going to do. That would be considerably less expensive. Heck, maybe they could even drop the 1200 if they brought the 4000/030 price down enough ($399 sounds good ;). – Jim, on AutoPilot!
#174683From: Trent K. JohnsonNov 28, 1994 3:20 AM
I'd certainly agree with that, too. Whether it's a 3640 '040-40 or a Warp '040-40, the performance would be the same. When all is said and done, I hope the new owners do whatever it takes to keep the Amiga viable. If it makes pricing sense, so much the better. Trent/ReAnimators
#174459From: Scott D. SobelNov 27, 1994 8:30 AM
Karim Miteff who produces Nick Arcade was high on the Amiga even before he went to work for Nickelodeon but it is too bad most of the industry has not really shown the fact that they use Amigas… It seems as though they rather not let it be known… I have seen many behind the scene shows that shows someone working on an Amiga but they never mention it by name..
#174586From: Tab TrepagnierNov 27, 1994 7:24 PM
Jim, "…there is where the money went…not to mention Gould and Ali…" I _think_ I know where Gould came from, didn't he buy Commodore from Tramiel? But I don't recall ever hearing where Ali came from. Out of the clear blue sky, he was in there screwing up everything he touched and making big bucks for it. How and when? Thanks. Tab Trepagnier Cruising on AutoPilot from Beaumont, Texas
#174718From: Jim ButterfieldNov 28, 1994 10:34 AM
Gould was ALWAYS the major stockholder in CBM .. or rather, the Gould Family Trust. I looked up their financial statements back in the days when they were still making calculators. –Jim
#173718From: Jim Drew/UUINov 23, 1994 4:06 AM
Jim, I would not want the US market ignored… that is happening right now. 80% of Commodore's sales come from outside of the US market place. I am concerned that if the US market is the ONLY market sought after it will mean no long term plans to keep the Amiga around. The US needs high-end machines, everywhere else needs low-end machines. The solution looks pretty simple really. If we don't have production of something, we'll all be in a race for the lifeboats… and PC's don't make good lifeboats… more like boat anchors. 🙂
#173820From: Gregory FeltnerNov 23, 1994 7:24 PM
I have to say I agree. As an American user I've pretty much had my fill of being ignored. This waiting game has already gone on far too long IMHO. If at the end of it I hear "Sorry folks, we've gotta cater to the Euro Donkey Kong market first then maybe we'll see what we can do for you." I would be inclined to say "Don't bother, Intel land here I come". Greg
#174335From: Grant BoucherNov 26, 1994 4:40 PM
I am so sick and tired of showing people how good my CD-32 looks and sounds, and then having to explain why I only have 2 games for it. Am I right in assuming that the Akiko chip was the Amiga's answer to DOOM compatibility and it that was almost three years ago now… Grant Boucher – Amblin Imaging "It's hard to believe grown-ups do this for a living."
#174365From: James R. OllickNov 26, 1994 8:16 PM
Only 2 games for your CD32? You should check out the EURO magazines, even AmigaWorld. There are at least 50, I have 5 games myself so far and several CD's from EURO mags. Also good are a couple of UK mags that come with CD's full of demos of the EURO games. You can get the mags with their CD's for $9. each from Ben A. Lott, he is available through internet mail. If you want his internet address, let me know. He usually lets me know when new stuff comes in. Jim R. Ollick Using AP from Bergenfield, NJ
#174409From: Jim MaddoxNov 27, 1994 1:15 AM
>> I am so sick and tired of showing people how good my CD-32 looks and >> sounds, and then having to explain why I only have 2 games for it. Only 2 games? If you want, I can E-mail or post you a list of Amiga Game Zone's catalog (great mag); or, you can call them at 800-32-AMIGA or E-mail them at gamezone@prairienet.org. They've got dozens of CD^32 <g> titles listed and a section in the mag of soon-to-be-released titles (as of September). >> Am I right in assuming that the Akiko chip was the Amiga's answer to >> DOOM compatibility and it that was almost three years ago now… Possibly. Too bad they didn't stick scaling and rotation chips in too, though. Of course, even without Akiko, Amigas still easily have the edge on PC's in sprite games. 😉 – Jim, on AutoPilot!