#68020 boards
8 messages in this thread
Yes, the Mac was limited when it came out. But reading the premier issue of
MacWorld was like reading the premiere issue of AmigaWorld – all the promises
didn't get fulfilled till many months later. The Amiga, however, is over
two years old. I have yet to see some really serious software (aside from
C, Modula-2, and assemblers) that I would like to own. Then again, maybe
someday…
All I want is a good, fast LISP development system. And Prolog.
Winston
Try running WordPerfect on the Amiga, sometime. It is "really serious"
software. I have no doubt that Prolog will arrive–it is already available for
the 64, and I doubt the Amiga market will remain as small as it has been with
the 1000. The 1000 was a computer with no niche (I am quoting Len Lindsay from
about 18 months ago.) The 500 is the ideal first computer, and the 2000 looks
to be a machine for someone who wants something that can grow and grow. Over
time, I would bet a LOT, you will have your fine LISP.
BTW, what do you do with LISP? Have you used Amiga XLISP much? I have played
with it and gotten some help about it on the AIE forum, but I find in an almost
impossible environment. Just undoing your mistakes is a hassle. (I used to
use the C-64 COMAL cartridge, so I am used to the Rolls Royce of environments
for amateur programming.) An article about using XLISP would be very useful.
// jim
Jim,
I was interested in the interactions you had with the people at AI Expert
a couple of weeks back – did you ever try the small structure editor that
Jeff Jacobs suggested?
XLISP is fine, but not complete enough and a little slow. Common LISP is not
the greates of all LISP dialects, but if you're going to LISP, it's going
to include Common. Personally, I like Scheme, but haven't used it much since
I sold my PC. I'm now mainly using Allegro CL on my Mac.
BTW, I am using LISP for my graduate studies. Makes prototyping of NL
parsers (and understanders) a little easier.
Winston
Winston–
I did download the small structure editor. I also printed it out and studied
it and the docs. I can make out some of the structure, I think. I also got a
book on common Lisp from Digital and was/am going through it. But around that
time I got Modula-2 (Benchmark) which is where I am putting my energies now.
I have known several programmers who love Lisp. A friend recently told me of
a machine he uses at MIT that does an amazing flight simulation. But all I have
is XLISP and it does not look like the optimal choice for the casual
progammer–which is what I guess I am. Still, I hope to do some more reading
about Lisp/
BTW what is NL parsing?
What have you heard about Le Lispe? As I recall, it was related to Scheme in
some way.
// Jim
Are you aware of a book called "The XLISP Primer?" This is a tutorial type
book on LISP programming, using XLISP as the LISP dialect. If I were to learn
LISP, I'd recommend three outstanding books – "LISP, 2nd edition by Winston
and Horn", "Common Lispcraft" by Robert Wilensky, and "Introduction to
Common LISP" (or something like that) by Deborah Tartar.
NL Processing is natural language processing, one of my areas of interests.
(Actually, natural language understanding is what interests me, but LISP is
a great tool for protoryping parsers and other things I need).
Winston
I didn't know of XLISP primer, and I do have Deborah Tartar's book, which is
the one I am slowly reading. The description of XLISP for the IBM will no
exactly *introduce* an Amiga user to XLISP. I found, for example, that
typing in some of the examples from the BYTE tutorial by Mr. Betz himself
produced results different from the ones predicted. Naturally, this makes the
learning curve longer.
// Jim
"I have yet to see some really serious software… that I would like to own."
I think the operative phrase there is "that [you] would like to own". You said
it yourself: all you want is good fast LISP and Prolog.
There is quite a bit of "really serious software" available for the Amiga,
including everything from CAD packages to word processing. I feel for your
situation, Winston, but perhaps the problem is that there just isn't a
perceived market for the products in which you are interested.
Rick
Well, as I said in my message, just because a product does not meet my needs it
doesn't mean it won't meet another person's needs. At least with the Amiga.
there are productivity packages that are equal to those of other
microcomputers. From my standpoint, though, I need tools that the Amiga
community does not yet possess. Well, maybe someday.
Winston