#Needs help
21 messages in this thread
Bill, at this point it doesn't have an Arexx interface? How important is
that?
It's so important, that I, and many others, would not consider buying
it without the interface. I have Word Perfect and ProWrite and do not use
either in favor of CEDPro (which has an ARexx interface).
Steve, what does ARexx do for you when using a word processor, or any other
product for that matter?
It allows any program with an ARexx interface to talk to (and control) any
other program with an ARexx interface. I'm using some very powerful
sub-programs with CEDPro. CEDPro makes the call to my ARexx program which
then, via the ARexx port, takes control of CEDPro and performs various
functions that are more sophisticated than CEDPro's own macros would allow.
Steve, an arexx interface is a definite plus. It allows one to integrate
different programs to create new functions, allows you to be able to
'reprogram' an existing product – for instance, I set up the keypad layout
I prefer to use in an editor (assuming its a good interface).
Ron, most of our products are oriented towards the non-technical user -the
person who does not know how nor wants to know how to "reprogram" anything.
With that assumption, will ARexx still be a benefit?
It allows one to make the product much more powerful as one gains more
technical expertise. I find it very frustrating not to have abilities like
keyboard (re)designation – I like to customize a product so that I don't
have to learn umpteen different interfaces, especially for actions I often
take. For instance, I'm used to using a certain numeric keypad key sequence
(gold + another key) to first do a search, and just that key to do a repeat
search. Some people here on the forums do much more sophisticated work.
What's even better is that people upload their rexx procedures, so others
don't have to be highly technical to use rexx. So, yes, it will be a
benefit.
Steve – though it may require a bit of work by the user, if you provide
AREXX capability it will allow your Word Processer to work as if it is a
part of an integrated package – as if it were a "Word Processing" module.
It may require more cleverness and experience from the programmers to
figure out how to make this easy for users, but it's definitely the way of
the future, I think – even for users who don't know what a CLI is.
…cheath
It really depends on the implementation of the ARexx interface itself. A
good implementation will allow an ARexx script (or another program that can
send the same sort of messages), to do pretty nearly anything that can be
done from the keyboard or mouse. While many (possibly most) purchasers wil
never write an original ARexx script to make use of your interface, there
are many who will, and will provide thse to others on a PD basis. Once a
user sees the power of the combination, and has a working script that does
something useful, he is likely to start modifying it to better suit
himself.
I use CEDPro for all my text editing work, and have written several very
useful ARexx scripts for it. As an example, I have written one called
'delfile' that lets me delete a file that I have in a CEDPro window. It's a
simple little thing, but the saving in keystrokes over the same function
done from a CLI is enormous (CD to the directory, TYPE the file, decide if
I want to delete, DELETE file). Others I have written make life very easy
when reading Usenet postings; 'keep' a message, delete a message, answer a
posting, etc.
Some folks use a combination of TxEd and AmigaTeX as a TeX processor,
editing the file in TxEd, and simply using a function key or menu selection
to save the file and call the TeX previewer to see what it looks like.
Quitting from AmigaTeX brings back TxEd for any changes needed.
I don't thinkit takes too much imagination to be able to visualize ways
in which a word processor could work a lot of magic when tied in closely to
DTP packages, databases, mailmerge programs, and so on. In addition, you
must always bear in mind that no matter how many features you provide in a
program, no matter how many other programs you allow it to interact with,
there will always be applications that you never dreamed would be of use to
someone. With an Arexx interface, you let the use decide what application
he wants to build using your program as one module.
The AREXX scripts are already being posted as PD things. There is a
library for AREXX over in AmigaTech. Up to now, most of the scripts are
working between editors and other programs, but as more of the programmers
use AREXX, and as the commercial software adds these ports, the scripts
will become available. Unsophisticated users will be able to get them
through the regular PD channels. ALo, they'd make nice little additi9s to
put in your package.
I believe that AREXX is to be very, very important to Amiga software in the
future. Many of the better packages are being released with it now, and
Commodore is thinking of adding either the real AREXX or else something
similar to 1.4. (The latter from hearsay, not announcement.)
Anyway, most people who know anything about AREXX want every piece of
software to have it. It gives you a scripting ability that lets all
programs work together like integrated packages. We are already beginning
to see AREXX scripts appear that make specific programs do marvelous
things. Please look into it.
Betty, can you give me examples or names of current products that support
ARexx today. This would help us decide if "integration" makes sense.
PenPal is supposed to be a novice's word processor, right? I don't think
most novices use ARexx. Programmers may value ARexx, but beyond that… I
wouldn't hold up production to add ARexx.
John, whether it is worth holding up production for is not in my bailiwick.
However, Steve has described this program as being easy enough for novices,
but with enough power to meet the needs of most average users. At this
point, I think putting out a new program without an AREXX port is a bit
shortsighted. Of course, it could be added in an upgrade or something
AREXX scripts are already showing up on the BBSs and also here. I think we
will see more and more of them, and that even novice users will be able to
use AREXX without writing any programs in it at all.
I'm sure B-W has gone to great lengths to "position" this word processor.
I certainly hope Steve isn't swayed. It makes little sense to me to worry
about ARexx in a product that won't be used by people who want a "hotdog"
editor. Is anyone out there using ProWrite for writing C programs? Does
Steve intend his program to go head to head with Cygnus Ed?
I own ARexx. I use it. I use Cygnus Ed, too. Am I crazy to think that it
is not necessary to add ARexx ports to every application?
Use the RM Function to read
these messages.
I'm sorry, but I think you're out of touch with the 'typical' user.
The #1 selling Amiga title for 1988 at my dealer is 1.3 — followed VERY
closely at #2 by ARexx. This is a dealer that sells 8-10 Amiga systems a
week.
Well, we could always ask Hawes if he knows that the "typical" user bought
ARexx. If ARexx was popular among programmers, and programmers are
frequent visitors to dealers, then sales might look good at your local
dealer. At face value, I think it's fair to say that ARexx programming, or
any programming in general, is beyond the typical user's ken. I still
maintain that a lot of users rarely make it back to their local dealer –
and that the ones that do, are the techies who know about things like the
release of 1.3. I don't remember an update being mailed out about 1.3.
I would say that any Amiga owner who does not know about 1.3 lives in a
dark hole somewhere. They don't read Amiga mags, attend user group
meetings, visit their local software store, or talk to other Amiga users.
If that's the case, they aren't a computer user. A computer owner, yes.
But owning an Amiga an living in a black hole doesn't make you a user –
novice or otherwise. If you really want to get in touch with the 'average'
user, donate a week of your time to work for your local dealer — see just
who is buying and using the machines. You can write it off as market
research.