#MultiSync monitors
18 messages in this thread
I am looking to purchase a MultiSync monitor for my Amiga but do not wish
to be REQUIRED to use it in de-interlaced mode (since I do not, yet, have a
de-interlacer).
FIRST — can EVERYONE tell me what Multisync monitor(s) you are actually
successfully using this way (e.g. both modes).
I am VERY interested in the Panasonic PanaSync C1381 for price ($389 MO)
and features but, natch, have some questions…
1). Anyone using the beast ? Is it OK with standard RBG video AND
de-interlaced ?
2). Earlier thread ref'fed Panasonic C1391 and someone said he sold one for
a 3000 and it worked fine, but another thread said watch out cuz Ami wants
Sync down to 15 KHz and many don't go down that far. I can't find 1391's
for sale, only 1381 – is/was this a typo ?
Well the one ad for the 1381 sez 31-37 KHz AutoSync ("autoscan" 50-90 Hz,
video Bandwidth 45 Mhz, Interlaced, .28 dot-pitch, 1024×768 resolution)…
Does this (lack of "down to 15KHz") mean it will only run de-interlaced ?
-tnx – da – via Whap!
Doug,
Yup….to run standard Amiga video into the beaste…it must
support 15.75kHz horizontal and 60Hz vertical sync rates.
Don
Don, I thought I was beginning to get it but now I've got more
questions… A de-interlacer sends out 400 horizontal lines but its really
525 counting "oversan", right… so 525 lines 30 times a second is 15750 hz
– great… But doesn't the standard interlaced video, sending 262.5 lines
in 1/60th second, then the next 262.5 in the next 60th turn into the same
rate ? Are my numbers correct ? The 60Hz vertical requirement suggests
that we're redrawing the screen 60 times per sec, but then the 525 lines in
1/60th second would be 31.5Khz, a number which many IBM-type monitors
support… I will use the requirement for 15.75kHz as a rule of thumb but I
remain…
-thoroughly confused – da – via Whap!
Daryl,
Easy…frame rate is different. You can send out 262.5 lines every
60th of a second. Or you can send out 525 lines every 60th of a second.
The normal 400 line mode for the Amiga is interlaced…that is, as
you guessed…200 (262.5) lines per 60th of a second. 400 line mode adds
the other 200 lines (again…really 262.5) on the alternate 60th of a
second.
That leads to the perceived flicker. In order to eliminate
it…you thus have to push out those 400 lines in a 60th of a second. In
other words, by de-interlacing, you have to double the frame rate.
Don
OK – gotcha, thats the 60Hz vertical.
On to the other issue… do you use a MultiSync ? Which One ? So far NO ONE
has actually replied to that part of my inquiry (!)… praps we are all
just TALKING about owning MultiSync !?
I did see an AOC Multisync (model 324 or 326 I think) with 15-38Mhz and
60Hz specs and a <400 price MO…
– da – via Whap!
For what it's worth, the 3000 has a 31 Khz video output as well as a 15
Khz. The 31 Khz port supports the 3000's 'display enhancer' (de-interlacer)
and its output can be handled by a VGA monitor. I have mine hooked up to a
Zenith Flatscreen right now.
-Brian
Thanks Brian – that explains how the 3000 is doing it. Do you have any
ideaq how FlickerFixer or FFV do same ? E.g. do they allow switching
between de-interlaced and otherwise ?
– da – via Whap!
As far as I can tell the FlickerFixer simply adds a 31 Khz port to the
machine.
In other words, it does what the Display Enhancer does on the 3000. I
know the FlickerFixer is compatible with VGA monitors.
You can switch to lower resolution using the FlickerFixer, but you can't
un-deinterlace it — i.e. you can't get the flicker back. I assume that
means you would have to use the 15 Khz Amiga video out port and not the
FlickerFixer video out if you wanted to do video work.
-Brian
Thanks… My understanding tho is that VGA != MultiSync, so FF
"compatibility with VGA" could easily leave an unknowing buyer with a
non-multisync VGA (especially since there are nice VGA monitors floating
around for $300-$400) BUT no effective de-interlacing (I imagine you'd get
garbage in interlaced mode ?) Could you clarify your point or confirm my
impression ?
I had heard that FF doing non-interlaced mode was nice and rock-steady and
readable on a MultiSync.
I'm still uncertain on the matter of "staging" the purchase, e.g. buy a
Multisync (not just VGA right ?!) monitor first then consider purchase of
FF or the C= unit (2320 ?) or the ICD FFV unit. Will the Multisync work on
the standard (15 Khz) Amiga RGB port ?
Are you using a MultiSync (or VGA ?!) monitor ? If so what brand/model ?
Sorry for all the Q.s. I appreciate your taking the time.
Daryl,
_ALL_ output from MicroWay's flickerfixer or the A2320 is at 31.5 khz.
A VGA only monitor will work just fine. However, it will not work from the
15.75 khz Amiga RGB port. If you decide you don't want or need a
multisync, take a look at CBM's 1930.
-sja
Sorry for the delay in replying, but I was out of town for a few days.
If you use a FlickerFixer with a VGA, non-mulitsync monitor you get
effective de-interlacing. In fact, I have yet to see an Amiga display as
nice as you get with a FF – Zenith Flatscreen combination (which I am
using). The FF display is absolutely rock-solid and with the Flatscreen
the colors are amazingly rich.
As for which to buy, I would go with a multisync, since it will be much
more flexible. For one thing, it would allow you to do what you suggest —
buy the multisync, use it on the 15 Khz port, and then move on to a
FlickerFixer or whatever later.
-Brian
Daryl –
I may have been the one that said I sold the Panasync 1391 with an
A3000, because I have.
The 1391 is different from the 1381 in that it is a "Multi-frequency"
monitor and will go down to 15.7mhz. It is also more expensive than the
1381.
– Roy Pahnke –
Casper, Wyomin'
Roy,
Thanks – after scanning the entire Computer Shopper I found a mention of a
1391 and it was together with one for the 1381 so I could compare…
problem was neither gave a RANGE for the horiz freq, the ad said 36 MHz for
the 1381 and 37 MHZ for the 1391, but no low range was mentioned… I DID
notice that the 1391 was about $100 more – so must I resign myself to
$500-600+ for a color monitor that will allow de-interlaced video ?
..sigh
– da – via Whap!
Daryl,
The $500-600+ range is about normal for the multi-sync monitors that I've
seen. I don't ever recall seeing anything less that would work with the
Amiga's normal sync rate.
David
Dayrl: I just purchased a NEC MultiSync 3D that works great in the
de-interlaced mode. Unfortunately, it will definately take a byte out of
your Christmas budget. I'll be using plastic money to buy all of the
Christmas presents this year 8^) It's a nice monitor and I'll be using it
for a VGA board used with the BridgeBoard, as well as a flicker-fixer.
John,
Since you've got a FlickerFixer I don't imagine you've tried this but – can
you run the 3D from the original Amiga RGB port or does it REQUIRE hookup
to FF ?
Why did you go with the 3D instead of the, ahem, more economical 2A ?
The Nec 2A is a VGA-only monitor. The 3D is true multisync.
The Flickerfixer takes the Amiga video and puts it out at VGA rates, which
is twice the speed of the normal Amiga video rate. If all you do is use the
ff, then you only need a VGA monitor. If you want to use the standard RGB
and the FF, then you need a multisync. Also be aware that many multisyncs
do not slow down to the Amiga's rate of 15.75Khz (horizontal frequency).
Vga is 31.5 KHZ.
Using a VGA only monitor on the Amiga standard RGB port can possibly result
in damage to the monitor because the flyback transformer is often designed
to one frequency. Getting off that freq. can cause it to overheat and melt
(or worse).
-Greg
Actually, I don't have a FlickerFixer yet Daryl. Spent too much money on
the 3D, so the FF will have to wait until after Christmas 8^) I will
probably buy or build a switchbox to switch between the FF port and the RGB
port if I need to. Greg's answer was best in choosing between the 2A and
3D. Besides, I got a good deal from someone else who desperately needed
some quick cash 8^)
Merry Christmas!!
John