CompuServe Thread

#THUNDERVISION?

7 messages in this thread
#903From: Ulead SystemsDec 23, 1994 11:39 PM
A visitor (he is making a similar board but has not success yet) came to our company, while chatting, he told us that this board is in that pre-release status for some months. So, figure it out by yourself. BTW, a fast capture board only solve less than half of the problem of capturing (digitizing) video to your hard disk. The hardware bandwidth of the storage device, disk controller, and the bus connecting them determine the rest. I know you must know this, however, it may help the others in the forum to understand the problem and solution better. So, I write them down at the following. To achieve non-dropping frame capturing with best quality, you need a perfect match (and compromise) of all of them. A capture board can easily capture faster than the storage device can take. For the cards for lower speed buses, like miro DC1 is on ISA bus, this is more severe. That is because even the hard disk can do more, the bus itself has a practical bandwidth up to around 1M bytes per second. EISA or PCI bus with Fast SCSI-II hard drive has a higher but not so high practical limitation, too. Basically, there are two ways to work around this. Either it will compress more (in turn, lower the quality of the video captured) to use standard storage device (and bus) or it will use proprietary fast storage device to preserve the video quality. Boards just as miro DC1 choose the former approach (up to 1:35 compression rate), so that it can be plug-and-play into almost any PC that you can find. When I work with it on a Pentium/90 machine with a PCI Fast SCSI-II AV drive and host adapter, I got VHS to sub-VHS class video result and play it on TV in real time. I'm quite happy with it. If I remember them correctly, some use boards like Targa 2000 (around 1:2 to 1:5 compression) to compress and controll the hard disk directly while others use a similar board (around 1:3 to 1:8 compression) with two Fast/Wide SCSI-II disks link in parallel. If work right, they can give you VHS or semi S-VHS output, but either you need to buy the whole set from them or use a certified hard disk and card that they approved. You will need an AV class hard disk which can maintain a suitable transferring rate even there are fragments in the disk clusters. Adding disk cache may even slow the capturing process down. This is because you need to put the data into the physical disk surface as fast as it can, disk cache will not help. If you have many many RAM, capture video directly to RAM or use that as a RAM disk and capture video to that disk will help you to capture small clips better. Of couse, some systems offer you another option, online editing, which will use computer only to controll the analog devices connected and do the editing just like using traditional equipments.
#928From: Marc ReinigDec 24, 1994 8:19 AM
Thanks for the brief tutorial. Can you explain what characteristics a hard drive must have to have an "AV class" rating? I am about to buy a >1G drive, probably SCSI-II. Thanks in advance and Seasons Greetings,
#983From: Ulead SystemsDec 25, 1994 11:42 AM
Marc, Basically, from user's view, they are the fastest and most expensive hard disks in PC world. <grin> Good thing is that they will have an AV label on them. <grin> Details that I don't know, I believe they need to do some tricks or skip the checkings to maintain the sustain data transferring rate to around and above 1M bytes per second so that you can have a smooth capturing and playback. Micropolis's AV series and Seagate's new Baraccuda (?) line which spins in 7200 rpm (higher than 3600/5200 rpm other lines are using) are one of them. 1G AV disk may be hard to find, what I heard are all 1.7G/2G/4G/9G. When you get an AV disk, you also need a good PCI/EISA fast SCSI-II host adapter to fit it right in. Fast/Wide SCSI-II are even faster but the disk and controller are hard to find, so forget it for now. –Vincent Chen
#1052From: Marc ReinigDec 26, 1994 2:37 PM
Vincent, Thanks for the response. This forum has been very informative. -Marco
#1009From: Robert E. BruneauDec 26, 1994 7:55 AM
Pardon me for jumping in. As I understand all disk drives have to do what is called thermal calibration, which consists of periodic adjustments to head positioning. The problem is that if you are in the middle of an edit when this happens, the chances of having dropped frames are pretty high. The A/V drives, for example Micropolis, do their recalibration in a more controlled way so as to not result in dropped frames. There is a discussion of this on the tape which Jon Leland made for Videography Magazine, called "Video-Video". It can be ordered from Videography at 800-685-3636 for $14.95 – it is a reasonably complete discussion of desktop video and nonlinear editing. Bob
#1051From: Marc ReinigDec 26, 1994 2:37 PM
Robert, Thanks for the response. I'll try the video. -Marco
#1007From: dave norrisDec 26, 1994 3:07 AM
A minor correction: I just replaced my Cineworks/AM card with a Targe 2000 and Adove Premiere (1.1, looking to upgrade to 4.0 or Razor). The Targa 2000 uses MJPEG which has variable compression ratios but does not record directly to disk. You have to have a separate fast disk subsystem for this (I have the Buslogic EISA SCSI-2 controller). Although I am getting sustained rates of only just over 2M/sec, I can record video with a Q factor of 230 with CD quality audio. This is far better quality video than I was getting with the AM card; the DVI compression really sucked. One great thing about Cineworks that I miss is that effects only took a few seconds to calculate. In Premiere, an effect preview can take several minutes to calculate, and you have to "build" the entire film into a file before it can be viewed. — dn