new A500S pricing
24 messages in this thread
Ethan,
So what's the functional difference between the mass-market 500C and the
dealer's 500S? I know the package is different and there's no expansion on
the "S". Is it just to allow dealers to feel better about having to give up
the low end to the mass-merchandisers?
Karl
As afar as I can tell, the S and C are the same. There mayb e
differences in the softwarea that comes bundled.
— Ethan
Ethan,
My (limited) understanding was that the 500S was in a brand new package,
not as deep as either of the 500's, that there was definitely no expansion
connector. I'm really confused by this. Why would CBM give the 500C to mass
merchandisers to sell, and give the 500S to dealers to sell if they are so
similar? Maybe they're just trying to grab as much market from as many
sources as possible, regardless of overlap. I'd never make a retailer.
Karl
I don't know. You might be right. From what I was told the 500S is
just a 500C in new clothing. I guess a dealer is the best source for the
info.
— Ethan
After talking to my dealer a couple of weeks ago, I was under the
impression that the 500S was a package for the dealers to make up for the
mass marketed 500C (he couldn't come close to the $499 A500C before..).
-chris
Karl:
It's my understanding (from a C= rep) that the 500S is the same as the
original 500 in that it's the base machine with nothing bundled with it.
-Mike Schiller
In sunny Fort Lauderdale
Mike,
Hmm. The one thing I was fairly sure of was that the 500S would NOT be
expandable, to keep it separate from the 500P the dealer would be selling.
S'pose the only way is to wait and see!
Karl
Karl:
As I heard it, it wasn't EXPANDED, but was expandable. Yes, we'll have to
wait and see, as I personally feel a non-expandable Amiga will just give
the Amiga a bad name, and personally I'd rather they called it something
like "The Amiga compatible Commodore 500" with Commodore 500 the machine's
actual name. As a matter of fact, perhaps they should do that with the
whole 500 line, and keep the Amiga as their higher end machine (with the
2000 as it's base model) and the 500's as Commodore machine. Commodore has
a name as a low end machine maker, so why not capitalize on that for the
500's, and at the same time, people who have seen the wonderful things
Amiga's do won't get upset when their A500 they just bought (one that can't
be expanded especially) can't do them. being compatible with something and
being something are 2 different things, and a machine that's either not
expandable, or is with non-standard accessories (like the 500 is) should be
called compatible.
-Mike Schiller
In sunny Fort Lauderdale
No one who buys a 500 over a 2000 will expect to be able to run a Video
Toaster on it.
On the other hand, anyone who shells out more than twice the price for a
basic A2000 setup could get quite upset when they learn their investment
won't do anything more than a $499 A500.
Frankly, this discussion on image-monging the Amiga is quite disgusting. It
would be healthier to discuss marketing strategies that won't alienate more
than half of the Amiga user-base.
Chris:
Perhaps somebody that bought a 2000 and never plans to expand it might feel
that they'd have been better off with a $499.00 A500, however what about
those that have seen some of the neat stuff an expanded 2000 can do, then
next time they're in Penny's or whatever store they see an Amiga 500 for
only $499.00, so they buy it only to find out later that they either can't
expand it at all, or that they can't expand it nearly as much as the 2000's
they'd seen earlier?
-Mike Schiller
In sunny Fort Lauderdale
An A500 can be expanded quite well, thank you, and the price differences
for components are negligable now.
I am a bit surprised. You are either blind or snobby. Maybe you haven't
seen the products available for the AMIGA 500 lately. Do yourself a favor
and buy a few AMIGA WORLD magazines and actually READ it (NOT just look at
the pretty pictures!!) With the ATonce you can now have a 286PC INSIDE the
500. I can drop 4Meg of memory underneath and put any number of hard drive
expansion modules off here on the side. Maybe too there are a few of us
out there who started out with what we could afford and KNEW that we could
upgrade later.
You of course have ATLEAST a 2000 (boy am I impressed…yawn) and I am sure
you have a video toaster….being a pro…right!? Get off your high horse
and think about all those things you can do that I can't I think if you
look at it realistically you will find there isn't such a big differance.
Mad as crazy …….Ken Dunham 76467,601
Ken:
First off, I've never before been called snobby! Secondly, I'm not a
professional, and I don't own a Toaster, don't even want one. I use my
Amiga strictly as a hobby, and while I do have quite an expanded system, I
think you (and perhaps others) have missed my point. the Commodore 64 is
the Best selling computer of all time for the home market (I don't remember
the exact number sold, but it way up there in the millions), and they
should use their name to their advantage. In no way would calling the
machine the Commodore 500 (as opposed to the Amiga 500) downgrade it's
usefulness or it's expandability, all it would do is define the machine. I
happen to know quite a few professionals that use Amiga 2000's and they
have to cover the name on their machines so that people will think they're
using high end graphics machines! One guy had a client that was really
interested in his work, but when he came to the guys studio and saw an
Amiga sitting there decided that perhaps he could do the job himself on his
son's Amiga 500. While there's no excuse for stupidity, it's there, and is
a fact of life that has to be dealt with. If the 500 was renamed (or
perhaps the high end machines (2000 – 3000) should be renamed rather than
the 500's) there would be less confusion about what peripheral works with
what machine.
I am also an Amiga 500 owner, it was my first Amiga, and I very quickly
expanded it to 3 megs and a hard disk, but realised that if I wanted more
expansion I'd have to upgrade to the 2000, which is exactly what I did, and
now I have an extra 500 that basically does nothing other than a few games
that my daughter plays on it (it's worth having for just that reason!) and
all my work is on the 2000. I have absolutely nothing against the 500, and
the person that initially introduced my to the Amiga is still using a stock
A500 with 1 meg and 2 floppies, and is only now starting to think about
letting me get them a harddrive.
-Mike Schiller
In sunny Fort Lauderdale
Dear Mike,
While I apologize for my haste and bitterness I must say that I was not
directing it to you (not as much atleast as it sounded). I have had it up
over the ear drums with people down playing the AMIGA (much as I did
before….I was a Big Blue groupie) and tossing it off as some sort of
souped up Nintendo. Truth of the matter is that this little awkward
looking (not my attitude) Amiga 500 can dance circles around many computers
costing three times as much. I am amazed at the comments I have heard and
am a bit touchy on the "It's not a real computer" line. I think we *ALL*
need to do more to expand the intelligence of the computer users around us
than to argue among ourselves. Again I appoligize for my reply.
While some will never even take the time to recognize or swallow enough
pride to admit the worth of ANY Amiga I will continue on my jaw-flappin to
spread the word. I too will enjoy the advantage I have over them who are
running the "OLD STANDARD"!!!!
Honestly, have a great day, and enjoy life and your Amiga's….yes, both of
them!!
Ciao for now……Ken Dunham 76467,601
– via Whap!
Ken:
I can remember a while back when the friend that had the Amiga, and I had a
Tandy laptop MS-DOS machine, and I used to taunt him about getting a "real"
computer all the time, and I used to tell him that anyone that needs a GUI
obviously doesn't really know how to use a computer! Well, since that time,
he introduced me to the Amiga (he showed me the CLI), I've gone from the
500 to a fairly expanded 2000, and sold my laptop (to the same friend that
showed me the Amiga!). Now he is getting to know MS-DOS and it's amazing
him how brain-dead it is! Now what we really need is a laptop Amiga so that
we wouldn't need to use MS-DOS while on the road!
"I think we *ALL* need to do more to expand the intelligence of the
computer users around us than to argue among ourselves."
Here! Here! I just read March '91 VideoMaker magazine. In the Desktop
Video section, they have an article with many screen shots of the Amiga,
but the article totally circumvents mentioning the machine; The sidebar
with new developments mention IBM and Mac heavily, and the news itself is
old and not very practical, but no mention of the Amiga; Then the new
products section lists two programs for the Mac and IBM, mentioning those
platforms and aspects about them repeatedly… But the spot on Disney
Animation Studio right next to them doesn't give a HINT it's for the Amiga.
They DID mention the Amiga in a 2-sentence spot on a hardware editing
interface.. Whoops, they musta slipped!
What is sad is that this magazine is generally regarded to be one of the
more Amiga-supportive magazines, yet that old illogical fear of recognizing
the Amiga is still present.
watch for some Amiga refs in upcoming issue of Camcorder mag (main
competitor of VideoMaker).
Mike,
Ken's right.. You did seem awfully snobby. And the A500 is much more
exapndable than 3MB and a hard disk; Having an A500 is no excuse when
you're simply not interested in the full potential a 500 has to offer…
Just don't dictate your ignorance to others!
I understand your friends' position on video work, but the Amiga isn't a
miracle machine… Experience and talent should get them work, not the fact
they own an Amiga. You are a hobbyist, yet I am a professional using a
couple A500's; I'd say you probably upgraded unnecessarily, but that is
your choice to make and I respect it. Likewise, please show some respect
for those that would choose the A500, or at least do your homework before
you speak up about it.
Chris:
You obviously think I was putting down the Amiga500 in that message.
Nothing can be further from the truth. All I'm saying is that while the
A500 is a good machine it NOT as expandable as a 2000/2500/3000 is, doesn't
use the same expansion products (well some of them), and is generally a
different sort of computer, so therefore should be called something else as
well. This way an "Amiga" accessory would be understood as one thing, and a
"Commodore-500" accessory would be understood to be another thing
altogether. It seems to me that many people think that having the machine
named Commodore rather than Amiga is a form of a down-grade, and that's not
true. Actually probably the better thing would be to rename the
2000/2500/3000 to something other than Amiga, something that sounds more
professional (don't ask me what, I'm not good at naming products!).
-Mike Schiller
In sunny Fort Lauderdale
Mike,
Your message is the first time I have seen someone openly suggest a
different name for Amiga. I agree, and I hope the suggestion doesn't result
in howls of derision. I am very fond of my Amigas, but the history of
marketing problems and the fact that the name is taken as a frivilous thing
in the business world is a real problem. I'll bet there have been
discussions about this at CBM. I was surprised that the 3000 didn't address
this problem when it was introduced.
How about just naming the machines by their model number without "Amiga" in
the name (2500, 3000, 4000 [sic]) at all? Unfortunately, the name Commodore
itself is a problem, and will probably always generate the image of a game
machine.
Rich
As long as software is wriiten that for the most part will run on several
different models of the same computer, the name on that computer should be
the same throughout the line, distinguishing different models by their
model numbers.
A IBM XT will run the same operating system as an IBM AT. The Amiga 500
uses the same operating system as the 2000/2500/A1000 (and hopefully the
3000).
To change the name of the 500, suggesting that it is not a REAL Amiga would
not only be illogical, but marleting suicide for CBM.
Lighten up.
Michael
A500s are expanded all the time. There is an enormous market for people
adding hard drives, RAM, accelerators, PC emulators, etc. for it. Almost
everyone, it seems, who gets an A500 eventually expands it. It think most
people expect to be able to do that.
— Ethan
Interesting approach, Mike.
That would also let them explain weird practices like why adding
anything in the bay voids your warranty, why upgrading to a Fat Agnus voids
your warranty, etc.
Karl
Opening a 2000 now voids your warranty also. Upgrading to a 2mb agnus is
likely to give CBM conniptions if they find out you did it (Personally, I
think it's just the thing to do, but CBM is a company that doesn't happen
to agree with me. :^(
Just thought you'd like to know. :^)
Ben
Amateur Radio Callsign is A A 7 A S