#Info for PPC users
18 messages in this thread
Which PPC(s) do you use with A:M? I use it with a 8100/100AV and a P90 with a
Number 9 video card and 32M RAM (if that matters for rendering) The 8100/100AV
isn't ANY faster than the Quadra 800 at work, but the P90 is anywhere from 5 to
30 times faster depending on the complexity of the rendering job (transparency
etc.) Luckily I use the 8100/100AV for more than 3D (Director, COSA, Premiere).
Do you think it might be the 8100/100AV's display card that's slowing things
down? I know it's not the nuBus BART problem because a couple of Apple sysops
told me that's fixed in the 8100/100 and 8100/110. But that still doesn't make
me happy about buying the 8100/100AV.
Charles,
Try rendering the clam.cho at 640 x 480 targa, no optimized color, no show
screen. On my PMac 8100/100 non-av 32 megs ram using the PDS Video Card (w/
the 2 meg upgrade) to drive a 21" NEC Monitor, this file rendered in 1:05
compared to 2:10 (about) on the 8100/80.
The PMac is about 3 to 4 times faster than my 486-66 compaq. Don't run other
apps, turn off appletalk, and any other unnecessary inits, etc…
Let me know the timing you get on the Clam.cho!
I hope this helps,
Jim JOnah
Thanks for the benchmark instructions. I'll try it tomorrow night. What's a PDS
video card? If you have more than one video card installed in a system, does
the Mac slow down to the slowest card speed even if you aren't displaying video
from it?
Charles,
The non-AV Pmacs have a High Performance Video display card in the PDS
(processor direct slot). This card comes with 2megs of VRAM which can be
upgraded to 4 megs for about $135 to drive a 21" monitor at millions of colors.
The card is AS FAST as a thunder II GX (at least to me, visually). Thus saving
me from $1500.
My impression would be that the display card shouldn't affect rendering, IF
you do not display the window while rendering! (Steve, is this true?).
Various versions of A:M have had problems with Picts. What format are your
image/transparency maps in?
Try changing them to Targa files, or PCX, and see if this makes a difference.
I hope this helps!
Jim Jonah
<< Various versions of A:M have had problems with Picts. What format are your
image/transparency maps in?
Try changing them to Targa files, or PCX, and see if this makes a
difference.>>
I've been using Picts and getting artifacts resembling tears (the image map
appears torn). I'll try converting to targa in Photoshop or Debab.
Thanks for the advice.
Charles,
What object is your Map applied to? Some of the primitives on CIS don't render
correctly when maps are applied to them! (I keep meaning to upload some of mine
<G>).
The cube with an X though it doesn't work right on the X side, and the circle
has problems also. If you are using these, I can tell you how I drew mine, if
you wish.
Jim Jonah
<< Charles,
What object is your Map applied to? Some of the primitives on CIS don't render
correctly when maps are applied to them! (I keep meaning to upload some of mine
<G>). >>
I'm applying them to a model of a key on an ADB keyboard.
What do you mean by "CIS" above — CompuServe primitives?
You are correct that a video cards performance should not affect rendering
speed… also you can choose to turn off the rendering display window, then
there is no output to the video screen at all…
Steve, Hash Inc.
Steve,
I always turn off the rendering display when rendering ;).
Can Ken add a feature on to not allow background events (users controllable of
course) while rendering, on the Pmac version? Please?
There would then be no wasted CPU cycles. Usually when I'm rendering, that is
the only thing that the machine is doing and every little bit would help!
Also, can the Windows renderer be changed to allow the user to change the
default settings when rendering on a machine without a dongle. My work group at
work runs 24 hours a day, and it is alot easier to walk someone through setting
up the next animation to render, over the phone, using the Windows Renderer,
than the DOS render24. AND, while your at it, how about batch rendering, have
the renderer read/write to a text file a list of .chos to render.
Thanks (<G> with sugar on top!)
Jim Jonah
Oh yeah, there was a discussion in another venders forum (in Anvena, I don't
remember how) about simulating radiosity and having control over blurring
reflections, if you get a chance check it out, it sounds very interesting!
Thanks!
Jim,
Something you said earlier about rendering speed & cards/video.
I have a NEC 4FG monitor on my PMAC 7100 & I also have the 24xp card installed.
I used to have it on a IIvx & simply transferred it to the 7100 when I made the
change. It works fine re colour depth, resolution & support here in UK said if
it works don't mess with it when I asked about Pmac drivers. (Not actually very
helpful at the time). As I said its fine but are you saying it would be slowing
the Mac down. I should take the card out & connect to the 7100's video?
I am not a great one for hardware 🙂
Elsby
Elsby,
>> As I said its fine but are you saying it would be slowing the Mac down. I
should take the card out & connect to the 7100's video? <<
No, the video card won't (shouldn't?) slow down the Mac, per se, UNLESS, what
you are doing depends upon screen redraw. A:M is great in that respect. When
working in sculpture, A:M's interuptable screen redraw makes most things "seem"
like real-time.
BUT, if you are rendering and you leave "show display" on, then the speed of
you video card can slow down the rendering. I always turn off the "show
display" command, only occasionally turning it on just to check the image. This
may have been what I was referring to, or I may have been claiming that, for
me, using the PMacs PDS video card (with 4megs VRAM) seems about as fast as the
Thunder II GX cards we have at work.
Again, the speed of the screen redraw only slows down the computer (Mac or PC)
when the next operation depends upon the screen redraw to be finished.
Did I clear that up? I hope <G>.
Jim
Jim,
Completely clear, thanks 🙂 Now that some time has passed though, I think it
won't do any harm to go visit the Radius people & see what the situation is.
I'll also give it a checkout with Povray as I have some samples with times for
different machines. When I first tried that, I was bowled over with the 7100's
speed.
Thanks again, Elsby
<< Charles,
Try rendering the clam.cho at 640 x 480 targa, no optimized color, no show
screen. On my PMac –8100/100 non-av 32 megs ram using the PDS Video Card (w/
the 2 meg upgrade) to drive a 21" NEC Monitor, this file rendered in 1:05
compared to 2:10 (about) on the 8100/80.
The PMac is about 3 to 4 times faster than my 486-66 compaq. Don't run other
apps, turn off appletalk, and any other unnecessary inits, etc…
Let me know the timing you get on the Clam.cho!
I hope this helps,
Jim JOnah>>
Just rendered the first frame of the above on my PMac 8100/100 AV 32megs ram.
The first frame took 1:09. Will try the same on the P90 at work on Monday. Did
you mean all 30 frames renders in 1:05 on your PMac? 😮 (facial equivalent of
surprise)
Charles,
>> Did you mean all 30 frames renders in 1:05 on your PMac? 😮 <<
That would be nice <G>!
No, just the first frame. It seems that you are in the ballpark. I noticed
that as my hard drive fills up (gets defragmented) the rendering has slowed
down to 1:07 for the first frame. It's amazing how little things add up to slow
down the computer.
Jim
I've got some more benchmarks for you.
I rendered the first frame of the clam.cho, no show video, fixed palette, on a
Pentium 90 with 32M RAM and a Number 9 video card (From now on I'm going to
ignore the video card as a speed factor given the recent discussion.)
Anyway, it took 28 seconds (compared to the PowerMac 8100/100 AV's time of
1:07.)
I then rendered the first frame of Coca-Cola bottle animation I made for the
new Coca-Cola screensavers (available on CompuServe, AOL, eWorld and
UMichigan's ftp site) on both platforms. The bottle has transparency, bump
mapping, a decal and about 8 lights of different types. It has 5 segments.
PowerMac 8100/100 AV's time: 18:39
Pentium 90's time: 0:57. Yes. That's 57 seconds compared to over
18 minutes.
Yikes.
Charles,
What files formats were you using both for saving AND importantly, for your
maps? Were your maps 24-bit?
(Steve, are your PC programmers using assembly were Ken isn't on the Mac? This
is a huge time difference, not in line with all published specs on Mac/PC
performance.)
thanks,
Jim Jonah
re: the Coke Bottle rendering times for one frame (0:57 for P90, 18:39 for
PMac8100/100AV)
> What files formats were you using both for saving AND importantly, for your
maps? Were your maps 24-bit?
The bump map for the coke bottle is an 8 bit grayscale Pict.
I can't tell what bit-depth the label decal is, but it's a Targa. The decal is
only a small portion of the image, in the center, and the slowness of the
rendering on the PMac persists for the entire height of the bottle (rendered in
upright position.)
The P90 was rendering a .fli file at fixed palette, no show screen.
The PMac was rendering a Targa file, no show screen.
The PMac render was uniformly slower all the way through.