#Key Factory Motion
29 messages in this thread
To all:
I've been using the New Imagine Key Factory from Schrieber. All I can say is
that this module has saved me at least 20 hours of work over the past week. It
is their version of a Dynamic Motion IPAS routine. This IPAS is so big it must
have at least 30 screens with real time phong, gorourd and phong shading. It
has exceptional collision dtection, friction, and drag , wind, implosion and
explosion routines among many others. You can eaisly create key frames based
on scale to show things like wobble, jitter based on collisions. COllisions
can also trigger AXP events like fireworks and other particle IPAS routines.
The different types of motion it can produce are random linear, true r randon,
orbital motion, helical and brownian motion. I'd say this is the best IPAS
routine Ive used (right up there with Bones Pro). I do don't work for
Schrieber but I am truly impressed. I've had 50 balls bouncing inside a cube
with no gravity, to show how gas molecules i interact. If I had to do this by
hand for 250 frames it would have taken many hours. Anyway I though all of
you should know about this I IPAS routine. BTW calculations can take awhile
with a complex system. They even take in to account object embrace where
objects appear to to stick to one another. Just too many options to describe.
Is this actually out? How much is it? Why haven't we heard more about this
(I saw some short comments between individuals, but nothing official)?
I hate to say this, but from what I've heard about the DMM, the KeyFactory
sounds like it's much better. But then again, I don't know how the price
compares (isn't price ALWAYS an object?).
Mike, I paid half price because I'm a University employee, however the regualr
pprice is $495.00. It's been out since last Thursday. I th think I was the
first customer to purchase it because my manual is still a draft copy. I was
told I will be recieving the final copy in a few days.
The more I work with this IPAS module the more I like it. A must have! The Key
factory does much more than work with collisions, it allows for many automatic
settings of key frames, for things like object scali scaling and rotation. You
can combine collisions with gravity, wind, scaling to rotation, and speed
limits. Very very flexible. The m manual is almost 200 pages.
PMJI,
Your post was *very* interesting. I had heard the name Key Factory, but wasn't
even sure if it was another name for DMM. Is Schreiber the only source ? Is
there a demo version ? Do you know who developed it ? Have you encountered any
shortcomings ? It sounds *too* good <g>.
Thanks,
BILL
The Key Factory was written by Sergi Goluch. SO far it does what its supposed
to do. Collision detection can even be calculated doen to th the face level of
objects for very accurate interaction.
Hi Steven,
Thanks for the info.. Just to clarify, is the normal (non-student) price $495,
or TWICE that ? Brent M. stated that:
<< is my understanding that you are limited to four separate settings for
dynamic objects in Key Factory, which is extremely limiting. >>
Can you confirm/deny this ?
Does the s/w require a (#*@$&*@#) dongle <g> ?
Why do you suppose there hasn't been that much talk about the program ?
Thanks again.
BILL
The regular price is $495.00 as far as I know.
You are not limited in that way at all. You can have 4 separate "SETS" of
objects with each set containing as many objects as you want These sets allow
you to keep track of objects interacting with other sets. For example you can
avoid collisions with objects of one set and not the other. I see this as a
very flexible system.
Dynamic objects can have any combination of 11 classes of dynamic effects.
That seems pretty "non-liniting" to me. Anyway, I love the IPAS routine and
will be using it quite a bit. As I use it more I will probably see the need
for one thing or another but not so far.
Thanks a lot for the information Steven.
BILL
>I paid half price because I'm a University employee, however the regualr
pprice is >$495.00
Okay, well that settles it for me. I've made up my mind I'm not going to pay
more than $500 for any add on for 3DS — not when upgrade costs for the whole
program are less than that. So, I guess I'll lump Key Factory along with
Pentello (ya know, I must not be alone, because I noticed recently that
Pentello had to be discounted by 50% just to get people to try it).
By the time the next release of DMM comes along I'm sure it will compete
featurewise — and be priced so us mere mortals can afford it.
>> $495.00… …I'm not going to pay more than $500
By my math it IS less than your price limit. <g>
I fortunately am able to build the price of needed routines into the projects
on which I'll use them. If I can save several hours effort, or create an
effect that wasn't possible otherwise, the price is no object.
OTOH, regardless of how neat/cool/useful a routine is, I won't buy it until I
can use it on a project. That is why I am a strong supporter of non-save demo
versions. I can try out routines, become familiar with the capabilities, and
know exactly where to get what I need when a project comes up.
(Thanks for letting me share my feelings.)
– Dave
>> $495.00… …I'm not going to pay more than $500
>By my math it IS less than your price limit. <g>
Nope, that was a special student price. The regular price is twice that
(according to that student source — admittedly I haven't heard from anyone
from the company selling it.)
So, pricewise, my original objection stands. I just think anything over $500
is outright lunacy when it comes to an add on (unless it replaces completely
one of the five major 3DS modules, I suppose — isn't $500 a module about
right?)
>> Nope, that was a special student price. The regular price is twice that.
Re-read the original message. The reason for my toungue-in-cheek remark was
that I figured you misread the letter. He said he got it for half the price
which was listed at $495 (or something along those lines).
The point is, it looks like you CAN afford it!
– dave
<<I paid half price because I'm a University employee,
Does this mean that Schreiber has an educational or faculty discount?
Thanks
Ed
Yes they have had the discont for a long time.
Thanks
For some reason my WINCIM is having a terrible time with this thread. First it
can't respond to it, and now it doesn't appear to be posting my messages
properly. I'll give it another go.
Thanks for the info. The price has convinced me that I'll forgo Key Factory —
I'm not gonna pay more than $500 for any IPAS, when that's about what it costs
to upgrade 3DS. I suspect I'm not alone — that's probably why Pentello cut
their prices in half because no one was buying (no one lowers prices when
people are buying!). Oh well, Key Factory's loss is probably KPT's gain (or
perhaps the landscape generator — although I have bad feelings about price
there as well).
Steven,
key factory is really cool, I agree. I've had it for a couple of days and it's
just amazing what it can do. It sounds like it does some things that Positron's
dynamics doesn't handle – for example, friction.
Martin,
Yes, we do not have friction in Dynamic Motion Module. However, it is my
understanding that you are limited to four separate settings for dynamic
objects in Key Factory, which is extremely limiting. If an object has to fall
into four categories, try and imagine how to animate a billiard table.
1) The balls would likely have the same weight and elasticity.
2) The table surface would need its own characteristics.
3) The bumpers need their own characterisitics.
4) The back corner of the pockets would need their own setting to prevent the
balls from launching back to the table.
So far so good with Key Factory… now how about animating the pool stick to
strike the cue ball. Whoops!, your out of characteristics….
Brent
Brent,
>> However, it is my understanding that you are limited to four separate
settings for dynamic objects in Key Factory, which is extremely limiting <<
I'll have to cede to your greater knowledge of the issues than mine. I've just
barely scratched the surface of the tutorials with key factory and know little
of its limitations. Maybe a rep from Schreiber can duke it out with you <g>.
Since they were kind enough to send me a copy to evaluate, I'll need to spend a
little more time with the tutorials before I talk about it much more.
regards,
Martin
Martin,
Thanks. I'd appreciate that. It could be that I'm mistaken. I'm going by an
article from Morph's Outpost by Dave Duberman, and a few of their testers.
Brent
HiYa Martin,
I would be very interested in hearing your detailed opinions on Key Factory
publicly, or in private, if you would be so kind.
Regards,
BILL
Bill,
all I can say right now, is that it looks incredibly deep and powerful (10
layers of large dialogs). I haven't had a chance to analyze it thoroughly,
though, so it's too early to tell. It has cool preview capabilities in 3
shading modes.
I'll talk about it more when I have a chance to at least do all the tutorials.
<< I'll talk about it more when I have a chance to at least do all the
tutorials. >>
Thanks, Martin. I'd really like to hear about it when you feel ready. Please
keep me posted.
Regards,
BILL
Bill,
re: key factory
>> I'd really like to hear about it when you feel ready. Please keep me posted
<<
will do.
>>>Yes, we do not have friction in Dynamic Motion Module. However, it is my
understanding that you are limited to four separate settings for dynamic
objects in Key Factory, which is extremely limiting. If an object has to fall
into four categories, try and imagine how to animate a billiard table.<<<
Is it as limited as your package, which doesn't have it? How does you package
handle friction? Do you have to simulate it?
So far so good with Key Factory… now how about animating the pool stick to
strike the cue ball.<<<
Now you guys have some competition, not like those Newtons Law guys. Though I
did hear they are planning on a 3DS version of Newtons Law after the Amiga
version ships. (BG)
Tim,
>>Now you guys have some competition, not like those Newtons Law guys. Though I
did hear they are planning on a 3DS version of Newtons Law after the Amiga
version ships. (BG)
Tim, if you read an issue of VTU a few months back, the company that was making
Newton's Law was being investigated by the Santa Barbara district attorney's
office. Since that time, they have gone out of business. How they plan to do a
3D Studio version if they aren't around to finish the Amiga version is beyond
me.
We welcome Schreiber's competition.
Brent
>>>Tim, if you read an issue of VTU a few months back, the company that was
making Newton's Law was being investigated by the Santa Barbara district
attorney's office. Since that time, they have gone out of business. How they
plan to do a 3D Studio version if they aren't around to finish the Amiga
version is beyond me.<<<
I was being sarcastic, which sometimes isn't apparent through email.
Tim,
My apologies. That was a pretty sore subject. Cybernetica never shipped, yet
charged an collected from a lot of people. Their ads for a nonexistent product,
with an impressive feature list cost us a lot of money. So, any time I hear
about them, I lose my mind.
Thanks for clarifying things, and again, sorry for sounding like a caveman.
Brent
PMJI – as one who has has to do Brownian motion "by hand" (:-(, I'd sure love
to get this on our budget. Gayle G de N