CompuServe Thread

#Underwater in Imagine

29 messages in this thread
#29266From: Peter GreciApr 21, 1993 5:11 PM
Howdy Paul, have you ever experimented with UNDERWATER Scenes in Imagine? Were you able to get realistic results???? I saw Erik Floms Demo Reel and it had just such a scene and it looked GREAT and so I of course had to try the idea. My first attempt was a FLOP. Any light you can shed will be apreciated. Thanx
#29274From: Paul GerhardtApr 21, 1993 6:30 PM
Peter, No, but I have read that section in Steve's book and it sounded neat and worth trying. …AutoPilot Engaged… -Paul-
#29323From: Peter GreciApr 22, 1993 5:34 PM
<Steve's Book> Understanding Imagine 2.0???? Egads, Time to dig that PUPPY OUT again. Tho Erik Did mention he used some Non linear Greenish FOG so I'm going to try that myself too.
#29331From: George Safirowski [NJ]Apr 22, 1993 7:40 PM
Hi guys, why don't you just buy some of my REAL underwater scene frames. Great for back grounds, on disk from video, clean too and it's the real world, and you don't have to dope out the program. george delfin underwater productions, inc.
#29351From: jeff HolinskiApr 23, 1993 3:31 AM
Of course the problem with using REAL underwater scenes for backgrounds is that the illusion of reality falls apart the first time you move the camera.
#29379From: George Safirowski [NJ]Apr 23, 1993 5:54 PM
Jeff, i'm missing your point about loosing reality. would you explain. george
#29408From: jeff HolinskiApr 24, 1993 3:21 AM
George, Imagine you're doing an animation that takes place in about 40 feet of water. You want to use an image of a reef as a backdrop. The animation starts with a view of the reef and a computer generated fish swims into view. The camera them pans to the left to show a minisub cruising over the bottom. Since you're using a background that's fixed to the camera when the camera moves the reef stays in the same spot in the view and it appears that the sub slides sideways into the view rather than the camera panning to the side. The problem can be avoided by using a sequence of backgrounds but it's VERY hard to syncronize the movement of the computers camera with the sequence of background images. Most of the 3D animators that want to do underwater stuff want to do deep water scenes. Since there's very little light or plant life below 100 feet it's much easier just to use a dark fog and a smooth landscape for the bottom of the ocean. I tend to use backgrounds only for very complex scenes with a lot of detail. (A flying saucer takes off from the center of a city and flys past the camera) With a scene like that you don't HAVE to move the camera to get an interesting shot.
#29476From: George Safirowski [NJ]Apr 25, 1993 8:15 PM
Jeff, I shoot in all depths, from shallow with ambient light to 130 ft and more. There I use lights. Heavy duty puppies giving me 3400K. As for still reef, well that depand on a shot. Sure, many shots the camera is still, the back ground is in one place and the subject is moving. But often when i swim through along the reef, the whole image passes, or pans. It all depands on a shot. Depands how it's used. An animation is animation. Motion video is just that. But often one frame as backdrop is neat for c.g. or whatever. george
#29387From: Peter GreciApr 23, 1993 6:18 PM
Email me Details. Are they avail on CDROM or Syquest Carts???
#29474From: George Safirowski [NJ]Apr 25, 1993 8:14 PM
No Peter, I simply freeze frame with tbc from live video and save on disk through toaster in rgb. I shoot my own video underwater. Have good scenic, sharks, fish, divers, wrecks, invertabrates, octopus, eels, dolphins, you name it. Benn shooting for about 12 years video and 3 years film. are you interested? george
#29553From: Peter GreciApr 27, 1993 6:00 PM
Please email me details/pricing/method of delivery etc. I'm interested in Stills mostly in IFF24 or JPEG form.
#29395From: Paul GerhardtApr 23, 1993 6:39 PM
George, Your underwater images sound interesting. Have you uploaded any samples. You could composite four quarter screen images. That way we could take a look but the images would not be useful until you bought the real full screen version. I use real 24bit images in my 3D animations all the time. I also add hand animated effects to 3D animations. Whatever works to produce the images I have in my imagination. However there is a real kick to creating a virtual reality that works right in a variety of situations. I view the challange of translating a series of images that reside only in my imagination into a working virtual reality within my Amiga as a great puzzle – much more interesting, fun, and engaging then any game I could play on Ami! Sometimes you need water to react with animated objects. For example: A DS9 runabout enters the atmosphere of a planet. It descends to the surface of a great sea. "Shields up" The spherical shields are invisible except where it contacts the water as the runabout descends. The water is displaced as the runabout submerges, revealing the shields shape. Underwater the runabout moves off surrounded by shields to an underwater city. Wow, that one sounds interesting enough to try. . .;) …AutoPilot Engaged… -Paul-
#29419From: Peter GreciApr 24, 1993 1:47 PM
It sure Does. When ya do this Underwater Runabout Anim I'd love to see it.
#29431From: Paul GerhardtApr 24, 1993 8:33 PM
First I've got to build the runabout ;)! I've got to get two Pagestream projects (next year's school calendar and a literary magazine) out the door, then I'll get going on some fun stuff! …AutoPilot Engaged… -Paul-
#29452From: Peter GreciApr 25, 1993 12:58 PM
Good Luck Modelling the Runabout. I've modeled "A" Runabout but it isn't very similar to the one from DS9. If you like I'll send it up to area 10. It uses some Essence Textures to make it look more interesting.
#29482From: Paul GerhardtApr 25, 1993 9:47 PM
Peter, I bought a magazine that has a pretty detailed photo of the runabout that shows alot of panel detail. I think I have enough to produce a pretty good likeness. I think I can save some time by using modified versions of Carmin's Enterprise Warp engines, but I still have to wait until I have the time to get into it. Of course if got off CIS and Genie once in a while I have more time ;)! …AutoPilot Engaged… -Paul-
#29554From: Peter GreciApr 27, 1993 6:01 PM
Tell me about it. CI$ and Genie Eat up ALOT of my Time as does the TradeNPost BBS. I just finished a SILLY Alien Model That I will also Upload.
#29587From: Paul GerhardtApr 28, 1993 6:31 PM
Uh-oh, what's the "TradeNPost" ;)? …AutoPilot Engaged… -Paul-
#29693From: Peter GreciMay 1, 1993 4:02 PM
TradeNPost is a 4 line Local BBS that carries ALOT of Fidonet Echo msg bases. It also is Getting a LARGE collection of 3D models online. The Sysop is a Toaterite and there's quite a few others as well as Imagine Dabblers like myself.
#29475From: George Safirowski [NJ]Apr 25, 1993 8:15 PM
Paul, I'm basically a computer idiot. I shoot video and edit. Loading up and sending images on cis, you must be kidding, i would not know where to begin. I freeze frame from video and save in rgb through the toaster. They look great. I even had some frame stores transfered to slides, shocked the heck out of me how good they came out. Right now I'm saving a few for a video slip case cover print. let me know if thereis an interest. I ussualy edit video and sell, and have sold raw footage on a buy out basis. trying to see if there is a market for still images for back drops. george
#29335From: John DowdellApr 22, 1993 8:19 PM
Say, Paul — Where's the rap on underwater scenes in Steve Worley's book? I'm interested, but don't see it! Thanks, John D.
#29337From: James GreenApr 22, 1993 9:48 PM
Page 115 <Fog is very versatile…If you make a dark blue-green color fog with a moderately short fog length, you can make some terrific underwater scenes.> Not a great deal of direction…
#29388From: Peter GreciApr 23, 1993 6:18 PM
I hadda reread thru the book to find the bits on underwater. Ther's no listing about it in the Index.
#29397From: Vance SchowalterApr 23, 1993 7:53 PM
The January 1993 issue of Amiga User International has 2 pages of FOG tips for Imagine 2.0. Page 54. *8> Vance
#29420From: Peter GreciApr 24, 1993 1:47 PM
Amiga User International eh? I'll have to look for that Rag.
#29396From: Paul GerhardtApr 23, 1993 6:39 PM
John, Oh sorry to mislead you. There was no big section on UW scenes. Steve just mentioned some fog settings that would give an underwater effect. …AutoPilot Engaged… -Paul-
#29588From: John DowdellApr 28, 1993 7:38 PM
Paul — No, ya didn't mislead me! I finally found the underwater section in the Fog chapter — good idea — thanks! jd
#29285From: Erik FlomApr 21, 1993 11:36 PM
Hey man. You gots to quit dropping my name. This is getting embarrasing! :^) Keep On Toastin' Erik Flom
#29324From: Peter GreciApr 22, 1993 5:34 PM
Erik Flom Erik Flom Erik Flom Erik Flom, you should now be the Color of a Ripe Cherry Tomato. Ha My Arsenal is Replete with Weapons of Embarrassment.