CompuServe Thread

#Well sue me silly

10 messages in this thread
#4355From: Paul VendrickApr 3, 1995 1:51 PM
I need a little coaching here. A friend is getting married April 28th. She has hired a videographer to chronicle the event, but she asked me to produce a 60 second interstitial to sandwich between her ceremony and reception segments. Something to give those inevitably awful tapes a little lift. I have storyboarded a parody of the Folger's "secretly switched" commercial in which "we secretly switched frosting on the Wilson's wedding cake with Colgrate's new frosting-flavored toothpaste". I will shoot it at her reception. For props, I just clipped the ends of Colgate tubes and rinsed them out so they can be filled with frosting and re-crimped by the baker. These will be used for close-ups of cake-decorating and of guests trying the frosting by squeezing a bit on their fingers or cake. The tubes will be handled so that the 'ga' is covered by people's fingers and then I'll alter the 'Colgate' to 'Colgrate' in the product beauty stills during post prod. My question: is this enough alteration to satisfy the parody? I'm not selling this video, nor am I producing it for money, but it will see limited distribution to certain members of the wedding party. Does this still fall in 'personal domain'? I would like to use something as close to a real product as possible; but if forced I could invent something completely new and 'sleeve' each prop with a new label. I just don't want to get sued. Best, Paul
#4364From: Gary MeyerApr 4, 1995 12:03 AM
Paul, I've recently looked into Fair Use laws at the local library. Seems like what you're describing falls within fair use based on allowance for parody, even if you didn't alter the logo. However, the parody sections are written specifically in relation to musical works. Also, a large part of any court decision is based on what monetary damage the plaintiff may have suffered as a result of your actions–in this case; none. Sounds like there would be no case. I am no lawyer, so don't bother trying to sue me if I'm wrong. Gary
#4384From: Timothy LiebeApr 4, 1995 9:52 AM
Gary: >I've recently looked into Fair Use laws at the local library. Seems like what you're describing falls within fair use based on allowance for parody, even if you didn't alter the logo. However, the parody sections are written specifically in relation to musical works. < The same type of laws apply to literary works, film styles, product designs, etc. F'instance, if you wanted to satirize Microsoft Windows ("Windoze 99–ruling the Universe…some day…"), you could use a logo similar to Microsoft Windows' to get your point across. Best, Tim
#4390From: Paul VendrickApr 4, 1995 3:46 PM
<<a large part of any court decision is based on what monetary damage>> Gary, thanks. That's usually the hook; did we lose money because our product likeness was appropriated? Back to that 'no loss, no harm' caveat. Still, some companies sue everyone because they feel if they let anything slip by, it dilutes their cases against instances of true damage. <<I am no lawyer>> You're not? I read that 1/3 of the world's lawyers live in the US.
#4397From: Gary MeyerApr 4, 1995 6:22 PM
I don't know how I got out of it–guess I met up with some poor lawyerly role models early on. I was trying to figure out the legality of writing a book which consists mostly of excerpts from other books–about a paragraph from each–and gives full credit to author, publisher, etc. GM
#4383From: Timothy LiebeApr 4, 1995 9:49 AM
>My question: is this enough alteration to satisfy the parody? I'm not selling this video, nor am I producing it for money, but it will see limited distribution to certain members of the wedding party. Does this still fall in 'personal domain'?< Maybe not under "personal domain", but you're certainly protected under "satire" from trademark/copyright infringement or libel. NATIONAL LAMPOON routinely does pretty much what you've done–take a known design and change a letter or two (i.e., changing the "d" in the word "Budweiser" w/two "t"s so it comes out "Buttweiser" <groan…>). Satire and parody are considered an essential part of free speech–so long's the intent is clearly humorous or satiric (and it does not appear that you're attempting to misrepresent your product as someone else's), you've got a few centuries of precedent to protect you. (If you were, OTOH, attempting to *sell* "Colgrate Frosting" by putting it in toothpaste tubes and giving it a design similar to Colgate's, you *might* have a problem–though even that's questionable, since Rome Black's "XTransits" morphing software comes in a box designed a great deal like TIDE laundry detergent's…) I seem to recall a recent libel/trademark infringement case where Rev. Jerry Falwell and Dewar's Scotch both sued HUSTLER over a satiric print ad where HUSTLER used the format of Dewar's then campaign "So&So Talks About His/Her First Time" to suggest Falwell was talking to Dewar's about having sex w/his mother behind the barn when he was a kid. The judge threw the case out, ruling that while the satire was certainly tasteless in his opinion, the intent was clearly satiric and did not represent trademark/copyright infringement in Dewar's case, nor libel in Falwell's. As for "personal" vs. "public" domain…well, now, that all depends on a) whether anyone connected w/Colgate-Palmolive actually finds out about the video, and b) whether or not Colgate-Palmolive *honestly* wants the PR nightmare of suing some poor videographer who used their product in a wedding video seen only by friends of the lucky couple… 😉
#4420From: Paul VendrickApr 5, 1995 12:59 PM
<<you're certainly protected under "satire" from trademark/copyright infringement or libel.>> You are just a wealth of info. I feel that nobody at Colgate-Palmolive really cares. We're talking about a negligible infraction. Still, I'd be embarrassed (if nothing else) should say a principal of their creative agency be in the wedding party! If I can use the packaging directly then that makes it all the easier for me. The more I have to doctor the props, the less convincing they look. And I think I remember that HUSTLER ad <g>. Get it strictly for the articles (if you knew me better, you would know how funny that really is).
#4443From: Timothy LiebeApr 6, 1995 9:40 AM
Paul: >>you're certainly protected under "satire" from trademark/copyright infringement or libel.>> >You are just a wealth of info. I feel that nobody at Colgate-Palmolive really cares. We're talking about a negligible infraction.< Bingo! It's not worth it to them… >And I think I remember that HUSTLER ad <g>. Get it strictly for the articles (if you knew me better, you would know how funny that really is).< That's okay, Paul–I know HUSTLER, so I know how comic that really is! Best, Tim
#4894From: Bruce ColgateApr 22, 1995 3:22 PM
Don't worry. We don't care <G>.
#4946From: Paul VendrickApr 24, 1995 10:31 AM
<<We don't care>> Bruce, thanks. The shoot is this Friday, and I feel much more comfy having secured your permission <laugh> Paul