CompuServe Thread

#What is CDTV?

13 messages in this thread
#104969From: David GoldstromJun 25, 1993 11:28 PM
Hi. Can anyone explain what CDTV is? I just bought one (a local store closeout for $169.00) and am wondering what to do with it. I allready have an AMIGA 500 gathering dust. Will this unit run my A500 games? Is it worth upgrading with memory, newer ROMs or whatever? What is the availability of CD-ROMs for AMIGAs? Is there any "authoring" programs for developing CD-ROM based games for CDTV? If this unit can do everything my A500 does, I plan on selling/trading my A500 for accessories or software. Thanx in advance for your help. David
#105197From: Ron LegroJun 27, 1993 8:56 PM
David: I picked up a CDTV on closeout, too. I'm using it with my VCR as a video titler and to play CDTV-based games. Basically, it's a 1-meg (all chip RAM) A500 with a CD-ROM drive built into it. It'll play CD audio discs, CD+G audio/graphic discs, CD-MIDI discs, CDTV discs (about 100 available including games, an encylcopedia, image discs, MOD discs, interactive storybooks for kids, etc. etc.) and some Mac and PC discs (it won't run their software, but will access data on many such discs). Of course the advantage of CD-ROM is that it holds 600 megabytes on one disc. You can get the entire Fred Fish collection on one CD-ROM for $40 and even boot up Workbench with it. Safe Harbor mail order has a reasonable collection of CDTV discs and CD-ROM discs that'll work with the unit. I suggest "Sherlock Holmes, Consulting Detective" as an excellent game with some interactive video sequences. Using the shareware Parnet device (and a special cable to hook up the parallel ports), you can network a CDTV to any conventional Amiga, which lets it act as a CD-ROM file server. Parnetting CDTV to your A500, for instance, would let you access files on the CDTV via your A500, using its keyboard and mouse. Cheaper than buying a keyboard and mouse for the CDTV itself. Non-compatibility issues: CDTV at present only runs Workbench 1.3. The CD-ROM driver uses up a bit of RAM so a one meg A500 has a bit more free RAM than a 1 meg CDTV. There is only one accelerator board I'm aware of that works with CDTV (see below). You need to put discs into a CD-ROM "caddy" before inserting into the machine, just as on many CD-ROM drives available for Macs and PCs. Caddies cost about 8 bucks each; you can of course get along with just one caddy. Hook CDTV up to your stereo system and it'll play regular audio CDs very nicely, and if your TV set is on, you'll see an on-screen control menu while the audio CD is playing; you can control the CD via the remote. Otherwise, CDTV is almost identical to a plain vanilla A500. One advantage: It's got color composite output built in, so you can dump stuff directly to videotape or use your TV set as a monitor. If you do any video titling or other video stuff as I do, this is nice. The CDTV remote control device does double duty as a mouse and joystick. If you get a standard Amiga external floppy drive and plug it into the rear drive port, you can run almost any Amigaware that'll run on an equivalent A500. For $99, Commodore will (until end of June, I think — call the Commodore Express 800 number and ask) sell you a keyboard, diskette drive, mouse and Amiga system and application software. The package is tailored for the CDTV (the keyboard and mouse are painted black and use CDTV's special plug-ins; you can use an ordinary Amiga mouse or keyboard only if you buy a third-party adapter; one such adapter is called the Brickette). As for authoring CDTV software, Amigavision Professional has CDTV hooks and will let you develop CDTV applications. However, you'd need to add a hard drive and memory to the CDTV to run AV Pro, which needs about 4 megs RAM. I think Scala and Showmaker also will fairly easily do CDTV type programs. You dump the finished work to a removeable hard drive, ship it to Commodore, and they master the CDTV disc for you. There's also a firm in Texas that does it. The applications can, of course, be interactive. There are a couple of SCSI interfaces for the CDTV expansion port on the rear to let you add a hard drive. Also, the Blizzard board 8 meg RAM expander/accelerator will work in CDTV. There's a CDTV-specific genlock available, too. Any printer or modem will plug right into the CDTV parallel and serial ports. Any MIDI device will plug into the MIDI ports, for making music. Didn't you get a CDTV "Welcome Disc" and manual with your closeout? Call Commodore Express and see if you can get a set without buying a CDTV. — Ron Legro, Milwaukee via AUTOPILOT (the only way to fly)
#105660From: David GoldstromJul 1, 1993 12:01 AM
Ron, Thanx for all the info. I was out of town when I bought the CDTV unit and haven't had a chance to try it. I have called around to see what titles are available, doesn't seem to be well supported. Do you think it could take a "IBM-PC" emulator and handle those CDs? Since it can read and write the files it might work. That would open up a whole lot more software. Does the Genlock replace the video port in the back or the spare slot? Who makes the "Blizzard board" you mentioned? Do you have any CDTV titles you're tired off and would like to sell/trade? I'm planning to buy the pro upgrade from commodore if they ever get it in stock and then trade my A500 for the Megachip2000/500 2 Meg upgrade. Thanx again for taking the time to reply. David
#106303From: Ron LegroJul 6, 1993 4:25 PM
David: I don't know of a PC hardware-based emulator that works with the CDTV. I presume you could run a software emulator like PC Task. Either way, you'd need a device driver to access the CD-ROM drive, and it would have to be a PC-based driver. CDTV will handle standard ISO format discs so maybe that's possible, but given that the drive is tied into the Amiga side of the system, maybe not. I just don't know; I haven't heard of anyone doing it. The genlock goes in the video port. I saw it for $150 at Safe Harbor. Safe Harbor also carries a fair selection of CDTV software. US distributors seem to shy from CDTV software, even though there's lots of it out there and new titles on the way. The best selections are from outfits in Great Britain (not as hard as it sounds; you just have to get hold of a British Amiga magazine and look through the ads). CD-ROMs that play in CDTV are available lots of places. The "GIFs Galore" and "Ultimate MOD Collection" discs are two of the best. Walnut Creek Software offers others, too. The latest Amiga Euromags talk of a "CDTV II" machine that will essentially be an A1200 with a CD-ROM drive but no keyboard. This would take advantage of AGA graphics. But Commodore has not officially announced this, yet. It has said it will incorporate CD-ROM drives into all future Amiga machines, but that's about all we know. Exactly what compatibility they will provide, no clue. The Blizzard Board is made by a German outfit. I don't have much info on it. You could try some of the bigger mail-order shops. I know it was being sold stateside. If you can't get the CDTV "Pro" pack, there are, as I said, third-party adapters to let you use a standard keyboard, mouse and joystick. But then you'd need to have all those input devices, as well. I've only got about 10 CDTV discs and most of them I plan to keep. I'd be willing to part with: * "Guy Spy," a shootemup role-playing game from Readysoft. Uses animated characters, a la "Space Ace" and "Dirk the Daring." I'd let it go for $25, about half price. * A CD+G disc of "St. Matthew's Passion" by Johann Sebastian Bach. This is an audio CD with graphics. The graphics include wood cuts pertinent to the music and mulitlingual lyrics. Ten bucks. — Ron Legro, Milwaukee via AUTOPILOT (the only way to fly)
#106359From: David GoldstromJul 6, 1993 11:54 PM
Ron, I have given the PC emulation idea some more thought, and it's not too promising. Oh well. Don't think I'll try to expand other than maybe upgrading my A500 to an A2000. Might get that Genlock though. I did a video and filmed my animation and titles using a video camera pointed at a monitor with the lights out. It worked and I just spliced it into the various segments I was putting together. Not the best quality though. How good is the quality of the CDTV Genlock? I ordered "Sherlock Holmes, Consulting Detective" and "Battle Chess", would like to see some different things that demo what can be done by CD based multimedia. Figured I'd track down a source of some of those Brittish titles, like "Psycho Killer I or II". Considering the amount of data a CD-Rom can store, there must be some games that can only be done on a CD! (Saw a description of a game (in AC's Guide) called Lunar Rescue that seems to meet the above criteria, but of course it was never released.) Would like to buy your copy of "Guy Spy". Give me your address and I'll send you a check for $25.00 and a stamped self addressed envelope big enough for the CD. Thanx for the info on upgrading, etc… David
#106406From: Ron LegroJul 7, 1993 10:50 AM
David: Safe Harbor had a copy of "Psycho Killer" in stock last I looked. SH is a national mail order shop, but I'm a local and SH has a store front here. Give 'em a call. Their prices are good, too. They'll special order stuff, oftentimes. The CDTV genlock is not pro quality, but it's serviceable for my needs. My office had a Supergen and from memory I'd say that's much nicer — also three-four times as expensive. I would imagine one could buy an external genlock and use it with CDTV, which would offer some flexibility, but I haven't investigated that possibility. I liked the idea that the thing could be tucked inside the machine, out of the way. It will let you use the remote control to switch from computer to video to overlay, a nifty feature. For "Guy Spy," send the check and SASE to: Ron Legro 2877 N. 47th St. Milwaukee WI 53210 I'll get it right out to you. It's a great game, but you have to work at it. Without fast reflexes, Guy gets splattered by the bad guys. I just haven't had the time and patience to get past the first couple of levels. Lots of action! It's fun having CDTV plugged in the big living room TV monitor and playing the sound through the stereo system! — Ron Legro, Milwaukee via AUTOPILOT (the only way to fly)
#106614From: David GoldstromJul 9, 1993 12:03 AM
Ron, I gave Safe Harbor a call yesterday to see what they've got. They're sending me a listing of CDTV stuff. Got "Sherlock Holmes consulting Detective" in the mail today. Thats more like what I expected from CDTV! Saw a CDTV like unit in Radio Shack today. Has it's own disks, but they can also be used in their PC compatable. Didn't look like they had expansion capabilities (keyboard, etc..) but with TANDY pushing it, they might catch on. With used TOASTER prices dropping, I may go with a more Professional quality Genlock. It's hard to justify the expense when I'm not doing any video stuff. I sent you the envelope today; you should have it by teusday. Inside the inner envelope is a money order for $25.0 for the Guy Spy CD. I saw a game in the video arcades around 1985 that sounds similar to what you describe. Look forward to seeing it. I have my CDTV hooked up to the 27" TV in my living room. It's under the A500 whose sole purpose has beem FALCON, which works great with the GRAVIS Mousestick. One reason I bought CDTV was the picture on the box showing FALCON. Turns out Spectrum Holobyte didn't release on CD. By next year the 3DO machine and ATARI's Jaguar should be out, maybe they'll have a good flight simulator or arial combat game. Please let me know when you get the envelope. Thanx, David
#107071From: Ron LegroJul 13, 1993 9:53 AM
I sent you a separate message that your m.o. arrived and "spy" is on its way today. "Sherlock Holmes" has been followed up by two more volumes. Unfortunately, II and III aren't available on CDTV yet, only MPC (for power PCs). Apparently, the CDTV version of "Holmes" did quite well in Europe but almost no business in the USA. Probably reflects the dearth of marketing here, plus the relative dearth of CDTV units. That changed in a hurry the past few months with sale prices. Supposedly, there are 100,000 CDTVs and A570s out there, which surpasses the number of CD-I machines. Also, there's more software for CDTV than any other type of TV-ROM player; like you noted, however, a lot of it doesn't max out the machine. Now that you mention it, I'm not sure whether there are any flight simulators actually released for CDTV. It would seem like a natural; get Falcon and all the mission disks on one disc! Psygnosis showed "Planetside" as a demo — a 3D-fractal flight simulator that was astounding. It appears as a demo on the "Lemmings" CDTV disc. But it's never been released as a full game. The Tandy VIS machine is based on "Modular Windows," a stripped down version of Microsoft Windows. It isn't as powerful as CDTV, but the software was maxed out and there is some cool stuff for it. However, the machine appears doomed; relatively few have sold. CDTV remains the only TV-ROM player that can be expanded with a keyboard, mouse, etc. into its own computer. CD-I is hanging in there. The new 3DO machines may take over the market. Then again, maybe not. Some outfit in the UK reportedly has figured out how to cheaply convert ordinary audio CD players to handle movie-length videos! — Ron Legro, Milwaukee via AUTOPILOT (the only way to fly)
#107301From: Kevin DarlingJul 15, 1993 10:59 PM
Hi Ron, >> "Supposedly, there are 100,000 CDTVs and A570s out there, which surpasses the number of CD-I machines." Over 100,000 CD-I units (and over a million CD-I discs) had been sold by sometime back around January. Philips predicts sales of 300,000 by the end of this year, and a million total by the end of 1994. Not exactly fast sales compared to Sega/etc, but respectable. They're saving their big PR push for the delayed intro of their addon MPEG FMV cartridge; now scheduled for this Fall. I believe that Tandy has cancelled their VIS effort. The latest rumor about 3DO is that some of its better hardware SFX will *not* come with the standard unit, but will be available in an addon cartridge. In the good news department, Philips, Sony, Matsushita, JVC, Samsung and a bunch of others have agreed on the new "White Book" standard for "Video CDs", CD-ROM movie discs using MPEG-1… which should be displayable by a cross-section of players, including any (future) MPEG-equipped CDTV models. BTW, Lemmings is being ported to CD-I. best – kevin
#107342From: Marlene Zenker/SYSOPJul 16, 1993 4:43 PM
"…its better hardware SFX will *not* come with the standard unit…" *Which* standard unit? Isn't 3DO just a standard? I thought that since different companies could build systems based on that standard, they could add different parts into their systems. It'd still be standard…they'd just have high- and low- end boxes. Hasn't Lemmings been ported to just about everything? I know it's been ported to the Lynx. I'm just waiting to see it show up someplace like the display pad of my microwave oven. 🙂 🙂 Steve
#107669From: Kevin DarlingJul 19, 1993 10:47 PM
Steve, I don't know the details, just the rumor that some of the glitzier FMV-like features demonstrated for 3DO won't be included in the base standard. BTW, remember when I mentioned that two ex-Amiga-addon-company guys worked with me now? Recently, they needed to add a temporary debugging error alert to one of our graphics terminals… so guess what this alert screen looks like? Yep, just like an old Amiga red "guru" box! I just about fell off my chair with surprise the first time I saw it come up 🙂 cheers – kevin
#107588From: Andy FinkelJul 18, 1993 10:58 PM
Hi Kevin. Where did you see sales figures for CD-I ? Previously, it was a policy of Philips to not announce sales figures for their products; so I'm wondering if your number is from Philips itself, or an industry 'experts' estimation. andy
#107670From: Kevin DarlingJul 19, 1993 10:48 PM
Hi Andy, I don't recall the exact date, but it was sometime early this year when Philips themselves announced the 100K player / 1 million disc figures. Both numbers were for retail sales to actual customers. They expect the sales rate to grow quickly once the FMV cartridge and Video CDs become available. As with Photo CDs, platform-independent MPEG "Video CDs" will also have embedded CD-I code. best – kevin