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#Log house – Perpective

27 messages in this thread
#55352From: Michele BousquetAug 29, 1993 5:58 PM
Regarding your camera problems: You are not alone, as a 3DS teacher I have gone over this problem with many people. There is a set of three books on 3DS currently available, and each book has an introduction which gives basic info on cameras and lighting that it sounds like you could use. The purpose of the introduction was to solve basic lighting/camera problems that new users always seem to go through. The books are called the 3DS Tips and Tricks Series, and they are available via mail-order from two locations: Pyros Partnership (714) 833-0334 Opamp books (800) 468-4322 I should add that I am one of the books' authors. Hope this helps. Michele
#55383From: Dan O'LearyAug 29, 1993 10:15 PM
Michele, I am interested in your books, and have contacted Greg Pyros about ordering them. I have yet to do so, though, because of the pending release of r3. If you have had the opportunity to work with it, would you care to comment on the applicability of your books. IOW (in other words)… am I wasting $130 by ordering them now and r3 in October? Also, could you tell me about their content (# pages and illustrations, I am already familiar with their topics). And are you working on more? thanks Dan
#55407From: Michele BousquetAug 30, 1993 3:38 AM
Regarding the books and R3: Thanks for asking as I am sure many other people have similar questions. First I will describe the book contents. Glass & Reflection This book tells you how to create glass materials that will look like glass and not plastic by manipulating reflection maps and transparency for the best effect. You will also learn principles of reflection, as they apply to way flat mirror and autoreflection work in 3DS, so you can get both kinds of reflection to reflect what you want every time. Regarding R3: R3 has a much more comprehensive materials editor so there are many more possibilities for glass and reflection. However the basic concepts are still the same. The book is meant to give you the basics by showing a some models and how to make them look perfect, but on your own models you would have to play around with the materials to get them to look right with your scene. The book is meant to give you a springboard from which to experiment. R3 means you have more ways to experiment once you know the basics, but the basics are still the basics. Shaping & Lofting This book tells you how to use the Fit tool in the Lofter, and how to determine the shapes needed to make a particular object. With the book you make a Microsoft Mouse and a fancy perfume bottle to learn the concepts, but you can use the techniques to look at any real object, determine the shapes for the Shaper, make them "fittable", and loft them painlessly. It also shows you how to manipulate the path in the Lofter so your lofted objects will land perfectly sized and placed in the 3D Editor so you are not doing a whole lot of moving and scaling in the 3D Editor. Also a lot of miscellaneous tips on shaping and lofting. [continued]
#55408From: Michele BousquetAug 30, 1993 3:38 AM
Regarding R3: The 2D Shaper and 3D Lofter have been improved in R3 but the changes have been smallish. You still have to place the path where you want it, there is no automatic way to do this. And your fit shapes must still be made in such-and-such a way in order to work. 95% of the book still applies as it stands. I am being safe here, it's probably more like 98%. Morphing & Animation In this book you learn how to make morphable objects, both lofted objects and 3D Editor objects. You even learn how make lofted objects with the same number of vertices as Editor objects so you can morph them. In the Animation section, you learn the basics of character animation; you make a puppet man, link him and make him walk. Regarding R3: Again, there are more possibilities for animation in R3, but the basics are still the same. For example, you still have to have the same number of vertices to have two morphable objects, and there is still no automatic way to do this in R3. Also, there is also still no "Object/Walk" command in the Keyframer <g>. There is one thing: the book tells you that you cannot morph materials, and in R3 you can. I am glad you asked this because until now I hadn't really gone through the books with an eye to R3, but I firmly believe the books are still good for someone who is somewhere between the tutorials and perfection. Of course, I am one of the authors… <g> If you are still skeptical, I suggest you post a general message on the forum, or call Pyros Partnership (714) 833-0334. They sell the book but are also heavy-duty 3DS users. Or if you have a particular project you are hoping to get help on, ask me and I will tell you if the solution is covered anywhere in the books. [continued]
#55409From: Michele BousquetAug 30, 1993 3:38 AM
Please contact me if you have any more questions. Michele
#55573From: Dan O'LearyAug 30, 1993 11:13 PM
>> Please contact me if you have any more questions. Thanks so much for the informative discussion of your books. They sound great! I will be calling Pyros real soon! Dan
#55427From: Judy WellerAug 30, 1993 7:19 AM
I finally got somewhere with the camera this weekend!! But it sure took me hours to do it! Basically I was trying to place and adjust the camera in the user viewpot, when I really need to be using all the other viewports EXCEPT the user. I feel stupid now that I have figured it out! I have your 3 books and think them excellent. I do have a question on the house in the first book. I would like to do something similar for these log houses, but I am finding that the most realistic look is to shape and loft a "single log" and then build from there, log by log. I have thought about creating the shapes the way you do in the book, but that makes the houses look like they were in Levittstown<g>. Also I would assume that if I want to do it like that, I would need to create a material that looks like "log house siding" and I wouldn't know where to start to do that!! If you have any ideas or pointers for me I would really appreciate your help!! Judy
#55444From: Michele BousquetAug 30, 1993 10:56 AM
If I were to approach this project, I would approach it like this: 1. Make a simple 12-sided cylinder. Use 2D scale until it is the right size. You can apply maps to this to make the texture, no need to loft a bumpy log! 2. Make a log material with a texture map and matching bump map. As an experiment I whacked together a texture and bump map which I am sending to you via Email– they are small CEL files so they won't take long to download. These will at least give you an idea of what you should try to do. I didn't try them out in 3DS (someone swiped my dongle for the day!) so they may be ugly, but it's a start. To make the material: Texture map LOGTEX.CEL at 100% Bump map LOBBMP.CEL at 10% (this may need to be adjusted up or down later) Specular color medium brown Shininess 10% Assign the material to the log, and also apply a cylindrical texture map to the log, roughly the size and shape of the log. 3. Stick three lights in the scene as in the introduction of the books, stick in a camera and have a look. If the maps are not good enough, the best approach is to look at an actual log or a picture of a log and make your maps that way. Since I assume the view of the logs will not be very close up the maps do not have to have a lot of detail. [continued]
#55445From: Michele BousquetAug 30, 1993 10:56 AM
[continued] Once you have one log looking pretty good, you will have to copy it. With a little planning this can be painless. I assume you want to stack them perpendicular to each other. In that case, copy the log once, then rotate and move the copy until it is in the right position above the first log. Then select both logs (Select/Object/etc.) and use Object/Move with Selected ON, and hold down the Shift key when you click on the logs to move them. This will automatically copy them. Practice this with the one set until it is easy for you to make the second set. After that, the rest should be easy. If you would rather make "log house siding", just do what we all do: find a book with a picture of a log house in it, scan the picture and use it as a texture map. Believe me, that's what EVERYBODY does. It is difficult for me to be sure this is the right advice since I cannot see your project, for example if the logs need to be more detailed the mapping approach won't work. If you have any more questions please ask. Michele
#55460From: Judy WellerAug 30, 1993 11:59 AM
Hi — Thanks for the files, but I only got 1 — I believe it is a CEL — at least it lets me display it from the ANI PRO cel menu. The other aborted,but I am not sure why. I have had fairly good luck with making individual logs. But I have been making a circle bringing it into the shaper and then lofting it. I tried to put windows in last night, via boolean subtraction, but that did not work. I tried increasing the number of steps to my path and then deleting the edges in the 3D editor. That looks do-able except for the fact that it deletes them from the rear part of the house and I am not sure of a way to avoid this. I also seem to get better results if I make sure Tween and Contour are set on so that I will have lots of edges to work with. Judy
#55481From: Michele BousquetAug 30, 1993 2:30 PM
You should be able to use plain old cylinders and boolean them. Deleting edges in the 3D Editor??? Youwch, I don't even have the courage to do that! There MUST be a simpler solution. For the windows, perhaps you can make one log from which the window has been cut out the middle with boolean, and stack that log a few times to make a window. This would be a lot easier and safer. Watch out you don't cut yourself on those 3D Editor edges! They can be sharp. <g> Michele
#55608From: Judy WellerAug 31, 1993 8:14 AM
I ran into a problem doing a Boolean subtraction — got the message that it was unable to complete, please modify your geometry! You are right — deleting edges is very painful in the 3D Editor! Judy PS — I was finally able to download the LOGBMP.CEL bump map. I don't know why my navigator had such a problem with it. I ended up having to do a manual terminal and download to get it to successfully complete! Thanks they look great!
#55616From: Michele BousquetAug 31, 1993 9:24 AM
When doing a boolean subtraction make absolutely sure the objects intersect in the right place in ALL the viewports. This might solve it. Also make sure you select the log first, then the cut (log – cut = …) Michele
#55645From: David RhotenAug 31, 1993 12:00 PM
You really should take Martin's advice: Make a stack of the logs for each wall (really, make one wall and clone it around). Say, for the sake of illustration, you want a window opening in side x that is two logs high. Using an elevation view of the wall, 2d-scale the two logs on the level you want the window so that they grow shorter horizontally until they are the length from the end of the wall to the window opening. Now Move/clone the two logs, sliding them down until they leave an opening the width of the window. scale them again to the far end of the wall (or to the edge of the next opening, whichever comes first. You could also select just the end verticies of the two logs in question and move those back and forth instead of using 2d-scale. Dave
#55707From: MARTIN G FOSTERAug 31, 1993 10:33 PM
David, good for you. I just don't understand all this talk of doing booleans on cylinders when they could just be made smaller initially, or cloned then scaled to the right size (or even just select and move the end vertices).
#55758From: David RhotenSep 1, 1993 9:43 AM
Just wanted to make you proud, Pa! Me and Hoss are ridin' into town — okay? Little Dave
#55742From: Judy WellerSep 1, 1993 6:54 AM
You make it sound much easier than I envisioned it. I have found 2D scale much easier to use than moving Vertices. I only try moving vertices in the Shaper. And I sure never try deform ! Judy
#55759From: David RhotenSep 1, 1993 9:43 AM
Hope you _do_ find it easy. The real problem with the "toolbox" concept of programs like AutoCAD and 3DS is that there are often sooooo many ways of getting from A to B, and knowing which one is best/fastest/most appropriate for any given situation is the real trick — and generally only learnable through trial and error (and helpful CIS hints<g>). Dave
#55907From: Judy WellerSep 2, 1993 6:58 AM
How right you are — and trial and error takes awhile. But CIS help is great! Judy
#55765From: Sep 1, 1993 10:07 AM
Judy: Where are you located? Greg Pyros
#55908From: Judy WellerSep 2, 1993 6:58 AM
I am located in Suburban Washington DC. Judy
#55916From: David RhotenSep 2, 1993 8:48 AM
Really. Synchronicity. I actually leave at 5pm today for Kansas City, and tomorrow morning from KC for DC <g> for about 2 wks. One of my old college buddies and I are off to see a friend who works for Sprint in Reston. Dave
#55927From: Sep 2, 1993 9:38 AM
Judy: >> I am located in Suburban Washington DC. You should contact Angelo Guarino here on the forum, right in your area, top dealer and 3DS instructor, and spend a few hours with him! You'd be amazed what four hours with an expert can do with your productivity! Ang, are you listening? Greg Pyros
#55809From: David TaffetSep 1, 1993 1:43 PM
Do you have a set of manuals? Have you tried using them? I would find learning 3DS without them awfully frustrating and difficult. FWIW DT
#55910From: Judy WellerSep 2, 1993 7:24 AM
My problem is that at this stage I feel overwhelmed by the reference manual. I find using the tutorial book the easiest since I have worked through all the examples. There is so much to learn and one can easily be confused by the ref. manual — esp. a first time user! Judy
#55973From: David TaffetSep 2, 1993 2:10 PM
Same here, on the Reference manual. I have only used it for, well, reference, so far. I keep meaning to sit down and *read* the goddam thing, but I find myself creating animations instead. I have done the tutorials and plan to do them again, REAL SOON after I get this project onto tape. Honest! I'm pretty much a newby, too, having had the program for about 6-9 months, but it has nothing to do with my job, so I've been doing this stuff at home in the evenings and on weekends. I'm no where NEAR understanding everything that I can do (nor the best way to do it) and won't be when R3 is going to be released and I'll be up to my eyebones in new features (and debt). I hope the perspective is looking OK now that you're getting a handle on the camera thing. In one of my for-me projects I'm trying to morph a fanciful beast's face so his mouth opens and closes and tongue comes and goes, etc. I keep getting a pretty good result except for this or that *little* flaw or imperfection, between smoothing groups or shapes, which I then try to fix and end up with something gawd-awful which I then fix till it looks pretty good except for this *little* flaw, etc. Latest, when his mouth opens, I get polygons stretching all the way across his head, over his open mouth. Looks like he's eating a buzz saw. NOT what I had in mind. Anyway PMJI. Good luck. Hope to see this log residence some time! David Taffet
#55629From: David RhotenAug 31, 1993 10:14 AM
>>I finally got somewhere with the camera this weekend!! Clap, clap, clap, clap, (whistle!)! Congratulations, Judy! "You've taken your first step into a larger world." Dave