#AmigaWorld
32 messages in this thread
Hi. I'm posting this here because I don't know of a better place and maybe
someone has had this experience themselves.
I received a copy of AmigaWorld along with a note congratulating me for my
purchase of an Amiga. This came as a shock to me since I don't own an
Amiga. I think it's a sharp computer but I don't own one. I figure I was on
some mailing list because I bought some Amiga software for a Christmas gift
for a friend of mine who does own an Amiga.
The letter said that IF I wanted to continue getting the magazine, I should
pay $xx.xx. (I forget the amount). I didn't want the magazine. I don't own
the machine. So I didn't pay any money.
I later got a letter saying that if I didn't pay, I would lose touch with
the world of Amiga…blah…blah…the standard stuff you hear with any
magazine. I didn't care. I don't own an Amiga.
Several months went by and I got an letter saying that 'it used to be that
a gentleman's word was his bond and that you had given your word that you
wanted AmigaWorld!' … and if I didn't send money, the matter was being
handed over to a collection agency! Whoa!! Now they stepped over the line.
First: I never subscribed. Second: If I had I would have given them my
current address. The address they were using was my old address and was no
longer valid for the past 8 months! Third: I only received ONE COPY of that
magazine. And THAT was accompanied by the letter that I spoke of earlier.
Fourth: This latest letter had my current address. They probably got that
from an updated mailing list. Now I got a letter from a collection agency!
I don't know what is going on but this really smacks of mail fraud. Now I
have to spend money and time either writing to them or calling them, not to
mention online charges for writing this.
This letter I just got actually goes so far to say that if I don't respond,
the publisher's claim against me will be considered valid. What kind of
magazine is this?
Please, I'm not trying to start a flame war but this is a disgraceful way
to run a magazine and if I ever do buy an Amiga, I wouldn't buy AmigaWorld
anyway. It doesn't have enough meat to it. Even if it did, I wouldn't give
them business after this.
Has anyone had experiences similar to this?
Randy Schirmer
Randy,
What has happened to you is indeed unfortunate, but it seems that a note
or letter some time back would have saved you a lot of grief.
It didn't happen with AmigaWorld, but I canceled a magazine subscription
once with no problems. I just wrote them a letter and explained that I
wished to cancel and explained why.
Lloyd
Lloyd, there is no subscription to cancel. I never asked them to send me
anything. There was no activity on my part ever. The magazine that they did
send me had a letter that said 'if I want to continue getting the magazine,
send money'. I never even inquired about the magazine.
Randy
Randy,
I understand that. But if someone steals the carbons from you VISA (or
whatever) and starts making fraudulent charges, do you just ignore your
bills because *you* didn't make those charges? And then refuse to pay your
VISA bill – WITHOUT explaining to VISA *why* you are refusing to pay?
My point is that *we* didn't sign you up for that subscription either.
Complaining to *us* won't get your problem resolved. A mistake occured, and
if you had communicated that fact to the magazine some time ago you might
have saved yourself the aggravation you have now.
The fact that this happened with AmigaWorld is irrelevant. I really
doubt they have a policy of signing up random people for unwanted
subscriptions – and then trying to COERCE them into accepting/paying for
them.
I suggest you mail a letter to them asking them to stop their actions,
and explain to them that you didn't subscibe in the first place. That is
something you should have done a long time ago, however.
Lloyd
Lloyd, please see message #38066.
Randy
Randy,
I don't know if Amiga World is guilty of mail fraud, but the situation that
you describe does stink! Amiga World may be deliberately engaging in
unethical practices, or a real mistake may have occured.
If you get turned over to collection, you may find that it is very hard to
rid your credit record of the problem. I am a partner in a medium sized
collection agency that does business only with hospitals. We, as many
agencies so affiliated, value our credentials and ethical standing, and
often get involved in clearing the credit ratings of people incorrectly
saddled with charges. Sometimes miniscule charges can wreak havoc with a
person's rating! As much as you do not wish to have to take action in your
case, I advise you to immediately do so. Your situation is unfortunately no
different than the case of someone who has been erroneously billed due to
an incorrect entry of a credit card number.
Write to Amiga World or call their subscription department. If you don't
get the problem cleared up, contacting a local 'consumer's advocate'
ombudsman at a TV station or newspaper can be very effective.
Rich
Rich, thanks for your input. I dismissed the earlier letters from them as a
subscription ploy. Now it seems that I can't. I think maybe a letter to a
postal inspector wouldn't be bad either. If my credit is damaged, they're
going to wish they never started this.
Randy
Randy,
I've been the victim of shoddy treatment similar to this from magazine
promoters as well. In my case the trial copy was requested, but the
directions to cancel were followed to the letter. Finally, I had to send a
threatening letter to the magazine before I stopped getting the notices.
This scenario has happened to me twice, which indicates to me that the
industry has a _really_ dirty act that they'd better get cleaned up.
(BTW – the incidents that I described were _not_ with Amigworld, or any
other computer publication. I suspect that the problem really lies with a
questionable marketing company rather than the publishers themselves.)
David
PS – I hope that you make them wish that they never tried their ploy on you
or anybody else!
Hi David. I should have written to them long ago but I never dreamed that
it would go this far. Maybe I ought to give AmigaWorld a call and do what I
can to make them see that their distributors are unscrupulous at best.
Randy
Randy, AW's marketing people did the same thing to me…twice. It's not a
real collection agency, just marketing BS. I still get banks falling over
themselves to give me credit cards. Throw it out and ignore it. — Art
I think it's slightly absurd to assume AW would enter into some
sort of fraud scheme like is being presented here. This is beginning to
sound like some sort of witch hunt.
My experiences with AmigaWorld have been the greatest. Sorry you have had
a bad time.
.Betty
P.S.: This "disgraceful" action is no different than any large
magazine runs its business. Again, from what you've described, I'd be
willing to bet that someone else subscribed at YOUR expense. This isn't
the magazine's fault. They only see a subscription form that says yes.
Randy,
I got the exact same letter a couple of months ago, but decided
just to toss it in the trash. They sent this one to me, and I already
subscribe to Amigaworld!! (a 3 year subscription to boot). I figured it
was just BS and forgot all about it.
Not sure what they're up to, but it's pretty weird to get a 'free'
issue and then get that nasty letter questioning your morals! Stranger
still that a paying subscriber gets the same treatment!
Hi Beth, which letter did you get? The one asking you if you want to
continue getting the magazine or the one questioning or ethics or the one
from a collection agency? They must be pretty heavy handed to do this to a
paying subscriber too. If this practice is the work of one or two people it
would be nice to see them get called on the carpet for doing this.
Randy
Though I'm not empowered to be an apologist for AmigaWorld, all of you
involved in this confusion over the AmigaWorld letter should calm down a
bit. The magazine staff is not directly responsible for anything that you
are encountering.
Magazines typically use outside fulfillment agencies to handle subscription
delivery and renewal. These agencies are notoriously screwed up. That's why
you often subscribe to a magazine, receive your first issue, then get a
card asking you to renew.
It's a tremendous frustration for those of us on the editorial side of
publication because we have no control over it, and it just cheeses off our
loyal readers. (Or, as in your case, Randy, a completely uninvolved,
innocent bystander).
I suggest Randy call a member of the AmigaWorld staff, CALMLY explain the
problem and ask them to resolve the matter with AmigaWorld's
circulation/distribution departments. That should fix the problem.
I know, I know … it's a pain in the *ss. But it's one of the irritating
realities of the magazine biz.
Good Luck, Bob Lindstrom Editor in Chief Computer Shopper
Thanks Bob. I had heard that there are two main magazine clearing houses in
the US and that this could be caused by them although some of these letters
are 'signed' by the editor. I guess I will call AmigaWorld. Hopefully my
credit hasn't been hurt by this.
Randy
I had a similar problem in the past with other magazines, but it
eventually turned out that a "friend" had decided to pull a practical joke
and filled out a subscription card in my name. it would'nt have been too
bad if it was Playboy, but it was Parenthood Magazine!
John, I really don't know many people who are familiar with what comptuers
I might have. The only one who know is beyond jokes like that and is just
as angry about this situation as I am. Now I know about a dozen people who
might send my name to Parenthood magazine!
Randy
Randy, Last year I recieved the same set of letters. Of course I was a
subscriber. Worse, in the same mail as the You-broke-your-word letter, I
recieved the cashed check for the Magazine. I ended up sending then several
letters about their impolite letters, and how, If collections cound not
communicate with their accounting department, I would be glad to take over
for them.
I soon recived an apology. David M. Dowdle
Let me just jump in here and say it would be very easy for anyone knowing
someone's name and address to clip out a subscription card out of any
magazine and select "Bill Me"!!!
I don't know if AW or other magazines would send an issue out before
collecting payment.
just a thought!
Oh my! Are they still using that "word is his bond" thing? I was so angry
that I cancelled the subscription that I had paid for when I got that. It
must be the marketing virus that infects every business involved with the
Amiga. Peter.
This was almost three years ago by the way. Peter.
Those letters rarely have anything to do with the signature at the bottom
of the bill. They are form letters, pulled from books or files that these
companies keep and re-use between companies. Ever notice how so many of
them begin "Frankly, I'm confused." Like there's really a person at the
other end, worried because you haven't sent in your money. I find the
bills and renewal notices quite confusing. They rarely show, clearly, when
your sub started, how many issues you've recieved, how many you'll get, and
how many months in advance they want your check for a renewal. Then
there's the consumer / marketing problem caused by cover dates that have
nothing to do with delivery dates.
Marketing virus? Does this virus prevent people from marketing, or does it
make stupid marketing campaigns? Did we catch it from someone inside
Commodore? If it's contagious, maybe we should visit a few more MacWorld
shows, and shake a lot of hands.
That's how they got my name in the first place. I bought some Amiga
products for a friend. They see my name on a list and they try to get me as
a subscriber. I don't have a problem with that but don't create these
'agreements' unilaterally and then say that my not telling them that I
didn't want Amigaworld means that I want it! Whoever does that should look
for another line of work.
Randy
Randy,
Several of the editorial staff from AmigaWorld make frequent visits to this
forum. Your letter came right at a holiday weekend, and they have not
answered you, but I suspect that you will hear from them next week. Do
remember, though, that these are editorial people who have nothing at all
to do with the marketing stuff.
.Betty
After I first posted my message, I wondered if that might be true. I do
appreciate the responses I've received.
Randy
Hi Peter. Nothing like questioning one's ethics to inspire customer
loyalty!
Randy
You realized something was wrong, you should have done something about it.
The easiest thing to do is to send the bill back to them, after you've
written "Cancel, I didn't order this" on the bill. Works like a charm.
The subscription fulfillment departments have very little to do with the
people who run and write the magazine. Ever notice how so many magazine
bills get sent back to Boulder, CO or Harlan, Iowa, or other tiny towns?
It's because the fulfillment companies are nowhere near the publishers.
How could this have happened? Someone could have written your name on a
subscription card, and sent it in.
It's not his responsibility, I'm not a lawyer, but I'm pretty sure postal
regs are clear cut when it comes to receiving something through the mail.
If you receive something that you didn't specifically order, didn't expect,
etc., you have absolutely no financial responsibility in regards to
receiving that item. If a publishers sends someone a mag that wasn't
supposed to receive it, too bad, that the publisher's tough luck.
John
I'd imagine whoever lives at your old address is happily reading
their free Amiga World subscription even as you read this…