Video Graphics Overlay
15 messages in this thread
I need some help with system configuration. First to give you some
background. I have a BS degree in broadcasting and film and have done some
TV work; former radio news director. Currently, at my job (I now work for
the govt.), I use a Macintosh II with 8 mgs RAM, and 160 mg hard drive. I
am wanting to do some graphics and special effects on my videotaping I do
on the side. The Amiga looks like the route I want to take. I would go
Mac, but I don't want to spend a lot of money. I used to own a Commodore
128 and I have sold everything but the Thomson RGB monitor. Is the 128
software usable on the Amiga? What about this monitor? First and foremost,
what is the minimal system configuration I need to do graphics and
character generation (all in color) with the Amiga without getting
bit-mapped, ragged edges on my type. If anyone knows anything hardware and
software wise, genlocks, etc., plus approximate cost, I would appreciate
it. What capabilities would I have? What are the best mail order firms?
Geez, I know I've asked a lot but if you could even help me with a single
portion of this problem I would appreciate it! Ron
Actually, there is a C64-C128 emulator for the Amiga (name escapes me) but
for serious video work you wouldn't want to use anything from C128 land.
(Although, I just read that there is a paint program for the C128 out now
that does some pretty amazing things — HAM-like images, supposedly). >>
Ron Legro / Milwaukee
Ron,
After reading through this thread I would definitely suggest an A2000, but
methinks the GVP controllers are better than the Commodore ones, and so are
the drives. Yes you will need some Ca$h at first, but you will not be
sorry you spent it.
Video Toaster is very cool way to go, but it is very new; I prefer the
Supergen Extenal model. It has two outputs and one through, as well as
nice big sliders and is software controllable as well. The Toaster is a
really high end model and if you want to do graphics overlay it is probably
overkill at this point.
Software: DeluxePaintIII, Pagerender3D, maybe some video titling software
as well, but careful colors in DPIII is fine for me……
You will probably want an '030 card; GVP's is great and comes with 4MB of
RAM and is VERY fast, also has an AT/IDE controller and you could probably
get the whole GVP package, ('030/882, Hard disk, 4Meg RAM) and a stock
A2000 at a dealer for a really good price.
Using your Mac will cost you more in the end, when 2 years down the line,
you wish you had or need capabilities like the toaster…….
-Scott
Continued;
I have the GVP 030/882 at 28MHz and 4 MB 32-bit RAM, plus a 16-bit RAM card
with 6 MB on it plus my 2000 has 1MB on motherboard for a total of 11MB,
but it only sees 9 maximum. I have 160MB of Hard disk space and I tend to
use it up……….
You will not be sorry with the Amiga, like the other message said it will
run circles around the Mac when it is cranked and there is TONS of software
available. I find myself using the same three or four pieces of softwre
out of the hundreds that I own………like deluxePaintIII, pagerender3D,
TurboSilver.FP and Pixmate (for image conversions, etc.) and DigiPaint3
(for when I need HAM painings -4096 colors). I do not like most of the
titling software, I must admit, and actually, AmigaVision (object-oriented
authoring system) or Elan Performer or the Director works fine for me for
titling (I like writing script files, so I use the Director; my partner
HATES writing scripts and makes titles on black backgrounds and uses
AmigaVision to do titling); either way you can get the same results. Best
of
-Scott
Thanks…I appreciate your help. My dilemma with the Mac is that I own all
of this software…and that's what I use at the office. I am curoius how
good that AMAX emulator is.
Ron,
..sell the software?
I heard the emulator is great except for MIDI, but that should be corrected
in the next release. I don't really USE Amaxx, as you can well
understand….
-Scott
Ron:
AMAX has only a few limitations: won't do MIDI, won't do color, won't do
sound. Used to not do hard drives, but I've heard that's fixed. Used to
not do Apple Talk (or whatever), but the newest versions are supposed to
handle that.
Pluses: faster on an Amiga (much). Fully able to take advantage of all
your 32 bit ram (if you have it), your 68020 or 68030 (if you have it),
your MMU (if you have it) and your math chip (if you have it with a 68020).
In addition, it will use ALL your ram easily (if you have lots), and permit
you to have a BIG ram drive.
So, if you have a souped up Amiga, and you don't need MAC color and sound
(which, for the most part, the Amiga puts away on a cost/performance basis
anyway [i.e. if you can spend $10,000 or so, you CAN beat a $3,000-$5,000
Amiga in _some_ areas of sound and graphics with a MAC]), then you can (for
most productivity MAC software) take a $3,000 to $5,000 Amiga and beat the
cr*p out of an equivalent MAC, using MAC software, for the grand total
price of an additional $450 to get AMAX, the MAC roms, and a MAC disk
drive, total cost. In my case, I have 5 megs. I allocate 3 to the MAC
system, and 2 to a RAM disk when I run AMAX. I have a 68020 cpu, two of
these megs are 32 bit, and I have the FPU. The MAC speedometer program (is
that the right name?) says I run 11 times faster than an SE overall! (I
generally load the system and the applications I am using into that 2 meg
RAM disk. AMAX thinks its a super fast hard drive. I use the floppy for
data storage and retrieval.)
?|^] Ray Lewis
I thought you might like to hear from another Mac owner who just finished
going the route you are investigating. I've been a Mac user since day one
– I got one of the first delivered in Cupertino. I currently have a IIfx
with color scanner, color printer, and almost every major software package
available. When it came to wanting to do video, however, I reached the
conclusion that you have. The way I went on the Amiga wasn't cheap. I got a
2000 HD with a 40 Meg hard disk, 1080 monitor and 3M of RAM. It took me a
week to decide I couldn't live with the speed of the 68000 at which point I
added a GVP 3001 accelerator (68030). So far, we're about $5000 into this
project with no software and no genlock. For Genlock, I added a SuperGen
2000S since true S Video was important to me. The only negatives to this
genlock is the cost (almost $2K) and the fact that it occupies the Amiga's
only video slot. More on this later. On the software side I bought ProVideo
Post, TV Text (now upgraded to Pro), Delux Paint and about a dozen less
important packages.
This "high end" approach isn't the only way to go. A fellow I met on these
boards makes his living doing video production for local businesses. His
Amiga work is all done on a 500. In his case, it was more important to him
to save his money for high quality video equipment. He'd like a 2000 but
gets by OK with the 500.
First, I'm happy with Amiga, but I use it only for graphic and video
tasks. I'll probably catch some flak for this but I just don't think it
even comes close for DTP and other work. Even in the graphics area, I find
I miss the precise feel of the Mac and am annoyed by the Amiga's relative
lack of resolution and color capability. On the othe hand, the amiga works
with video like it was made for it and even with the large amount I've
spent, I couldn't have gotten
[continued in the reply]
[continued]
the Mac to come close.
Another really good thing about the Amiga is the cost of software which is
much lower than comparable Mac packages even though the quality seems
pretty good.
Two other things occur to me that might be useful for you. First, you will
hear a lot about the Toaster, particularly as a reaon to leave the video
slot open. While the toaster is a tremendously exciting breakthrough, folks
seem to ignore the fact that it is clearly pro gear and requires
sychronized signals. That means a TBC or recorder with one – not consumer,
or even industrial level, video equipment. In my case, I couldn't find a
genlock that did good S video on an external basis and don't expect to be
able to afford video equipment that would work with the toaster. The result
was I bought the 2000S and am happy with that decision.
The other thing you might be interested in is the ability to share files
between the Mac and the Amiga. I haven't tried the Amiga Mac emulator, I
have no intention of giving up my Mac. I did buy the program Mac-2-Dos. It
allows you to hookup a Mac disk drive to move files back and forth. It
includes some limited conversion utilities and on the whole works well. I
have also transfered files serial to serial using A Talk on the Amiga,
Microphone on the Mac and a Lap Link connecting serial cable. Most
importantly, I bought a package called Interlink which supports may kinds
of graphic format transfers including Mac PICT to Amiga IFF. This lets me
scan and edit material on the Mac and transfer it to the Amiga for video.
FInal prep on the Amiga is done with The Art Department, another excellent
product.
Whistle if I can help more
Bill Dwyer
Your comments have been invaluable. What exact I'm wanting to do on the
Amiga includes titling, flipping pictures, sequing from o one picture to
another (not a picture to color like the cheap models), and special
effects. I have a Mac at the office and am very heavily involved in a Mac
user group so my first instinct tells me to spend more and buy ht the Mac
cuz I will eventually want one…. my other instinct tells me that the
Amiga has more video availability and capabilities and that it would be
cheaper. ARGH! Any thoughts?
By time you are done, I don't know about the Amiga being cheaper but I sure
haven't seen any video from the Mac that is even minimally acceptable. A
2000 with at least 3M and Pro Video Post sounds like it will do a lot of
what you want. An accelerator and a hard disk would be very welcome
conveniences.
On the other hand, if video is only a small part of what you want to do
with a computer, I'd lean toward the Mac, hoping video will come along in
the next year or so. In that case, a Mac with slots (II) is a must. Right
now, the best Mac buy is a used II.
Best of both worlds is one of each in which case you could get buy with a
lower end Mac.
Bill
I am waiting to get some info from Mass Microsystem on ColorSpace ii. It is
in the price area of video toaster and it supposedly does some neat things
with the Mac.
Make sure you get to see what the results look like on videotape in the
format you intend to use. This is the usual big problem. Beyond that, the
other major problem on the Mac as relates to video is that the software and
fonts are all optomized for the Mac and printing and tend to look crappy on
video. Let me know what you find out. Bill Dwyer
Okay thanks. I was thinking Mass Microsystems had something neat I saw at
a Mac show.
Mass Micro was one of the earliest in the field and new competition is
being announced daily. The two problems I have yet to see solved decently
for the Mac is the quality of tape output (all the video input solutions
seem to work fine) and the lack of software specifically oriented to video
tasks. You can buy a dozen good amiga/video packages for the price of one
poor substitute on the Mac. M ind you, I love my Mac but for now doing
video on the Mc is a lot like doing Desktop Publishing on a PC – possible
but painful. Bill Dwyer