Tosh 3401 & Adap 1542
11 messages in this thread
Dave,
The software business is changing at a dizzying pace. One way or another,
the major players will find a way to make money at it. I just hope folks
like us don't end up getting shortchanged later due to low purchase prices.
Your experience with Adaptec is much like mine. I had avoided using their
products for years because of the near-total lack of support. Lately I
bought an Ultrastor 14F SCSI host adapter, but was never able to get it to
work reliably with my Maxstor SCSI hard disk. I tried 3 14F's, 2 drives and
2 motherboards, all to no avail. Finally broke down and got the Adaptec
1542C, and all has worked well since installing that. I noticed that
Adaptec now has a toll-free number for support (800-959-7274). Is that what
you called?
Unfortunately, many of the support BBS's are not run very well. All they
seem to do is allow downloading a few files. That has been helpful to me
sometimes, but could be much better.
CI$ has become my best source of support lately, but I have NEVER seen
anyone from Adaptec post a message. Too bad. They could be so much better
if they chose to do it.
One way or another I'm going to have to get into the image processing area.
Time to visit some new forums. I did pick up a shareware program called
Graphics Workshop for Windows, which says it can read PhotoCD disks. I hope
to try it RSN <g>
Just getting busier,
-=Rob=-
Rob,
The Adaptec number you mentioned is listed on their product brochure as being a
software ordering number. The number I called was their main number of
408-945-8600. I got treated to several layers of touch-tone wild goose
chasing, then waited on hold for- what did I say? 20 minutes?
Then, if their stuff works, I shouldn't be too concerned. Usually the
magazines beat up pretty thoroughly when a company has lousy support, but I
guess some never learn.
I sent 'em a letter by USPS mail with my technical questions. One of the
questions was if they offered support on CompuServe. Maybe enough queries like
it will get them started.
I think you will enjoy using GSW, but after using Picture Publisher I've become
hooked on the greater flexibility it offers. And I am looking forward to
PictPub version 4's ability to have movable objects in layers that don't get
'glued' in to the base image until you want them to.
Have fun!
Dave McKeen
Dave,
It seems like Adaptec indeed never learns. Your experience is much like
what I have experienced for several years. For some reason, the trade press
never seems to criticize Adaptec for their lack of support. Their products
always seem to be reviewed favorably, with no mention of support problems.
Surely I'll be able to get around to working on the image processing real
soon now <g>. BTW, I saw a color printer the other day that's really
impressive. It's the CorrectPrint 300i made by RasterOps, a dye-sublimation
Postscript printer. The prints are excellent. At 300 dpi with 16.7 million
colors, it is VERY hard to distinguish the output from a conventional
photographic enlargement. I would say that very few non-experts in
photography could tell the difference. STUNNING!
It's just perfect for your Picture Publisher images. Only $9,999.99 <bg>
-=Rob=-
Rob,
With Adaptec, it's "love 'em or leave 'em", I guess!
I'm amazed that the output of the 300 dpi printer you saw was as good as it
looked to you. Think of this. If you have a 10 x 10 dot area (100 dots) that
needs to be 1% cyan, there will be ONE DOT somewhere in that area. And at 300
dpi, that's a pretty big area! I've come to realize this with my HP 550C,
which does a darn good job for an outlay of around $650.
The 550C is a 24 bit printer, too. Plain paper! For printing photographic
images as a hobby it's great, but for a pro it would be only good for proofs.
I thing it would be great around the shop, though, as you can get the proofs
pretty good before you send out to the service bureau to get the finished stuff
done.
Now for $10K, I would hope something better than 300 dpi would be coming along
soon. A res of 600 dpi would look lots better, but it will probably take 1200
to be acceptable for pro output.
I'm dreaming… Just trying to scrape for a little more RAM. Then there are
all the other things I 'need'… <g>
Dave McKeen
Dave,
The effect of color depth on perception has been surprising to me. When I
began to see 24-bit color video, I was surprised how good a 640×480 image
could look, even when only 20,000 or so colors were actually used. When you
think about it, you can't have all that many colors in a 640 x 480 image.
There are only 307,200 pixels on the screen, and if they are all different
colors you won't have much of an image.
Whatever the pixel mathematics, the prints I saw were dazzling. I would not
hesitate to hang them on the wall alongside my conventional photographic
enlargements. I doubt that even one person out of a hundred could tell
the difference. Get a look whenever you can. BTW, I expect by this time
next year, you'll be seeing 600 dpi color for that $10k.
Have you seen the new little thermal-wax printer on the market? I forget
the name, but I saw one at Computer City recently. For about $850 it can
produce 8.5×11 prints with 24-bit/pixel color. Last year such capability
would have cost $3,000-4,000. Not bad at all. Even good enough for
proofing at a commercial level.
RAM, more disk, better video, faster CD-ROM…
So many needs, so little $$$,
-=Rob=-
Rob,
I just got the RAM in my 486 up to 20 Mb. Now I want to focus on a Windows
accelerator graphics adapter for my ISA bus that will display at least 32K
colors at 800 x 600 and 72 Hz. That's the minimum Picture Publisher needs to
display 24-bit color without dithering.
The math doesn't add up for me. It's just what Micrografx says.
And it might not be an ISA bus card, if I can be talked into upgrading to an
EISA bus motherboard, which my clone dealer says he'll do for $150.
I haven't heard of the thermal-wax printer for under a grand. I'll keep my
eyes open.
Say! I had an idea about an external case when I was in my clone dealer's
today. One of those mini-tower computer cases has three 5 1/4" bays front
access and a couple of internal 3 1/2" bays inside for hard drives. He said
one would cost me $75 and I'm sure the power supply would be extra. Great for
my Gb hard drive and my first CD-rom drive!
There are lots of toys out there!! <g>
Dave McKeen
Dave,
You'll definitely want to look at the Hercules Graphite card. It can do 800
x 600 x 65,536 colors at 72Hz. That's the 1 MB VRAM version. They are
coming RSN with a 2MB version for more colors at higher resolutions. I have
heard that their windows drivers are reasonably solid, but cannot verify
that personally. This is an ISA card, which according to Steve Gibson's
recent testing is very fast, only exceeded by some local bus stuff.
Have you seen Gibson's WINVID.COM program that summarizes his testing of
windows video accelerators? It's a gem. I think I got it here on CI$ in
the IBMHW forum. Definitely worth a look.
There's no reason at all you couldn't use one of the mini-tower cases as an
external drive cabinet. That $75 probably _does_ include a power supply.
The main complication would be mounting the SCSI connectors on the back (no
holes the right size) and making up the required cabling. Not particularly
difficult, but tedious and the parts may be difficult to locate. If all
else fails, I know an electronics shop in Houston which has all the stuff.
You know the difference between men and boys, don't you <g>
-=Rob=-
Rob,
I put the Graphite ISA 1 Mb on order a few weeks ago based on Gibson's article.
But I cancelled the order the same day based on Jim Carlton's (Hercules-
72420,1152) caution that it wasn't fully up to speed as a Windows accelerator.
HE SAID THE 2 Mb version would be. So I'm holding out for the 2 Mb model. I
*did* get Gibson's WINVID.COM. I really don't know what to make of all the
testing, though.
I'm going through another phase now. I'm looking at swapping out the ISA bus
motherboard in my 486-33 with an EISA board with a couple of VL slots. It
seems that some plug-in board makers are coming out with the EISA and VLB cards
before the ISA ones. I wonder how much more the 1742A is than the 1542C?
On the external case, you brought up something I hadn't thought of. Why would
the 3401 have a different connector requirement if it was internal or external?
Or a hard drive? Why couldn't the SCSI cable just go through a hole in the
back of the box and connect straight to the peripheral?
Is it that their voices are different? Or is it the price of their toys? <g>
Dave McKeen
Dave,
I didn't realize that Jim Carlton had suggested caution about the 1 MB
version of the Graphite. I think I would really want the 2 MB version
anyway, though. Only problem is the higher cost.
If you can trade up your motherboard for an EISA/VLB model, that's probably
a good idea. VLB seems pretty hot right now, and the performance clearly
leads the field. EISA peripheral controllers are expensive, though. Last
EISA SCSI host I bought was an UltraStor 24F, which cost about $450. It
could be a little less now, and I think the Adaptec costs about the same. I
believe Ultrastor may also have a VLB SCSI host now. Might be worth asking.
Your Toshiba 3401 CD-ROM just has one kind of connector on it, for 50-pin
ribbon cable connectors. However, there's a limit to how long a ribbon
cable can be before you get into problems. The standard way to do external
SCSI boxes is with a shielded 50-wire cable, usually using a centronics
connector. For this you would mount two centronics connectors on the back
of the case, one on each end of the internal daisy-chain ribbon cable. The
shielded cable then runs back to the host adapter in the computer, and a
terminator is installed on the other connector, unless yet another external
cable goes to another box. You might get away with running ribbon cable
from the computer to the external box, or you might not.
Have you _seen_ the price of toys these days? <bg>
-=Rob=-
Rob,
Thanks very much for the review of the SCSI cabling. I'm pretty sure I'll go
ahead and do the EISA upgrade. Maybe single-walletly I will cause the price of
EISA peripherals do drop due to the increased volume I generate. My clone
dealer will swap out my 486-33 ISA motherboard for one with not only EISA, but
a double-clutchin' CPU for $475. Notice how $150 is already passe!
A fellow in the COREL forum (SCSI section) recommended BusLogic/Bustek 742 or
747 boards. I haven't found out details about them yet, but they are CorelSCSI
approved, and Adaptec's 1742 isn't. Whatever that's worth!? He also said that
BusLogic is doing the built-in ASPI manager for NT. And it looks like I'm
headed the NT way. Not with the greatest enthusiasm…
So on the cabling, I'll need a bulkhead connector on the back of the box with a
Centronics on one side and the 50-pin ribbon connector on the other and go from
there? I guess terminators come in both Centronics and ribbon style?
There are are some parts stores around here I'll check out, but just to be safe
I should have the phone number of your source in Houston if you can spare it!
Such grand plans! <g> Upgrading the PC will slow me down a bit getting the
CD-rom, but I'll get there!
Dave McKeen
Dave,
Hey, might as well go for it! After all, it's only money. <g> Is that new
CPU a 486DX2-66? If so, that's clearly where you want to be for the next
couple of years. If you can do that for $475, it's a pretty good deal.
Last time I looked, that class of board cost around $800-900 wholesale.
(Sometimes I'm a reseller <g>) How quickly the dollars flow by!!
I'm VERY surprised that someone said the Adaptec 1742 is not supported in
Corel SCSI. My impression has been that Adaptec and Corel are very tight,
and the Corel software is targeted at ADaptec boards. I don't know that,
though. I have been very pleased with the UltraStor 24F EISA SCSI boards. I
have one in our main Netware server here, and it has worked flawlessly.
Recommended. You don't actually need Corel SCSI for your CD-ROM or any hard
disks. Ultrastor has a nice package of software which supports most all
CD-ROM's and lots of other stuff, for something like $50-70. I have that
running on a client's system with an Ultrastor 24F, Toshiba 3401 CD-ROM, and
an HP 1.6 GB hard disk. Very nice!
For cabling your external SCSI box, you'll need two chassis mount centronics
connectors (50-pin) with ribbon connectors on the back. You run the ribbon
cable around in a loop inside the box and out to the other connector on the
back. Then you plug in a terminator on that other connector, until you
continue the chain to another box. You could also fudge a bit and just put
one centronics connector on the back. Then you will have to install the
terminator on the last device on the internal ribbon cable. I have never
seen a terminator resistor pack for ribbon cable. They go either on the
SCSI devices or on the centronics connectors.
My source in Houston for all these parts is Electronic Parts Outlet at
713-784-0140. They usually have all this stuff in stock. If you can't find
what you need, let me know and I'll try to get it for you.
You're looking at some serious $$$ here. Don't forget you'll need 16 MB of
RAM for NT. You'll get near $2,000 for the motherboard, EISA SCSI host,
CD-ROM and say an additional 8 MB of RAM.
Go for it!
-=Rob=-