#Flyer Inputs
35 messages in this thread
Frank,
I keep reading threads that talk about loosing two inputs on the Toaster when
you use the Flyer. I think that all four inputs are still usable. I haven't
tried three and four yet, but I'll give them a try tomorrow.
The Flyer comes with a S-VHS input and an RCA video input, L & R channel audio
inputs and outputs, both RCA plugs.
At first I thought that you had to go into the Flyer via its own input, but I
found out that you can use the Toaster inputs.
The Flyer switcher shows video input, audio input and Toaster Output. You can
do a freeze frame in the Toaster and then punch the Toaster output button and
feed that freeze frame to the input of the Flyer.
I know that this may not seem to make sense, but at the time I did it there was
a good reason. I was trying to do a frame store. I had just plug in the Flyer
and a clint walked in and I need to take a frame from video and convert it to a
computer graphic.
I could not find the normal freeze and save button that is on the Toaster Setup
menu. So, I grabbed it through Toaster Paint and then grabbed it again in the
Flyer. It was the long way around to do it, since after spending most of
yesterday on the unit, I have learned almost all of the menus.
I am going to spend some time tomorrow figuring out the rest and I'll try and
be more concise.
Fred
When you're in the Project/Switcher screen hit F10 and voila the old toaster
controls, including frame freeze options (also project select which dowsn't do
anything anymore, RGB/PREVIEW select, background/effect colors, etc.).
F10 on any other screen gives you rudimentary settup options – if you do this
then go back to the project switcher you get the rudimentary screen, but do it
a couple of times and your back to the big settup screen.
On the other hand this may all have changed on the "Under Construction" .9
disks which I just picked up and haven't loaded yet. We'll see tomorrow.
TTFN
Russ Spencer / MM
I just tried the F10 key from the Project/Switcher screen and got some kind of
a setup screen with an option to go to the RGB or Preview screen. The only
other options seemed to be choice of 4 inputs.
You gave me the idea of playing with the F keys, so I found that F9 jumps you
to the large Project screen. F5 brings up color bars and F4 gave me the Toaster
4000 screen that you see when you first boot up. Although it may just be
whatever is in one of the buffers.
I have a monitor with two inputs. One input give me the output of my VCR which
give me the output of the Toaster. The other input is the Preview monitor from
the Toaster.
I noticed that when I had the color bars up on the screen and switched between
the RGB and Preview switch, the sharpness inproved on the Preview output. Any
idea why?
I went to every other Flyer View Screen and pressed F10, but all I got was the
same setup options, so I guess they changed the option on the .9 disks.
What happens when you pull up a video clip and use the control button. When you
slide the slider to change the starting or ending point of the clip and you
leave it at one setting, does the still image on the screen jump?
I get the same kind of image you get when you try and freeze a video on the
Toaster.
Fred
Fred,
F1 to F6 switch between Inputs, DV1,2 & 3. That's why you got the opening
screen and color bars – if you load other graphics, they will appear when
pushing F4 or F5.
Guess we'll have to find another method to do prior settup functions if ver.
.9 has changed F10 settup screen.
Output was sharper with the Preview overlayed on the preview monitor??? I'll
check later but sounds kind of nuts.
I don't understand your question about jumping stills when you move the in/out
video clip sliders. Please rephrase.
Till later,
Russ
Michael,
Correct my statement about the Prefiew monitor. I read the wrong thing.
However, when I switch between the progam out and the monitor out, the monitor
out looks better. Of course the program out is going through an MX-50 and then
a JVC-BRS-810. I'll try doing a direct connection and see what it looks like.
The jumping I am talking about. OK. Select a video clip. Go to control. Move
the slider so that you see video on your monitor. Now, leave the slider in one
position. You now have a freeze frame on the screen. Does it jitter? Maybe it
is suppose to. But I get the same kind of jitter during an effect between two
scenes.
Fred
PMFJI – When the Flyer is set to Project/Switcher mode and the left mouse
is clicked in the Project (top) window, F10 reveals GPI/Termination/and
Preview monitor selection. When you click in the Swither window (bottom),
you get the full Setup screen from Toaster 3.1. If found that the Help
key will reveal this also, but I don't remember if it only works in a
certain environment.
Hank
Videology, Inc Where you get all the P.O.M.P. under all
circumstances.
Henry,
This refers to the Setup Screen from Toaster 3.1. When I pressed the help key,
I found no reference to this. But, I may have had the upper screen highlighted.
I'll go to the bottom screen and see what happens.
Lots of undocumented stuff.
Fred
Fred
I found out about it from tech support. And even the tech was trying to
remember what the sequence was. It seems you must make the switch window
active and then hit F10. If the project window is active, F10 gives you
the short screen with the GPI, input termination and preview monitor
options.
Hank
Videology, Inc Where you get all the P.O.M.P. under all
circumstances.
PMFJI –
I believe the Flyer S-VHS input is for the future TBC. At present it
isn't connected to anything. These guys sure have alot more things for
the Flyer then currently announced.
Hank
Videology, Inc Where you get all the P.O.M.P. under all
circumstances.
Henry,
You are correct. NewTek told me today that neither the SVHS nor the video jack
are connect on the Flyer.
I am having a big problem. When I try to do an effect between two scenes, the
Flyer causes the out going scene to freeze.
Also, my big 9GB drive now tells me I have only 21 minutes of recording space
on it. There are no files on the drive. I tried defragging this drive, using
the reorgnization command on the Flyer, but that just took a split second,
which means the drive is empty.
Fred
Don't like the sound of that 21 minute 9 gig drive problem. Our 9 gig hasn't
arrived yet. Please let us know if you find out anything and hope you get it
resolved.
Russ / MM
Russ,
I did a reorig of the disk and the 21 minutes stayed. Then since there was
nothing important on the drive I went an reformatted it. This did it and the 48
remaining minutes came back.
I noticed that none of my utility software can read the actual size of my 9GB
disk. The window that appears when you click on the disk in Workbench reads 500
and some megs. Opus does the same. The Flyer telling me that I have 48 minutes
is the only way I could tell that the drive is that large.
The 2gb give you about 10 minutes.
Fred
Fred,
AmigaDos uses some sort of special offset adressing method for it's file
system. From what I have been told, the largest HD that it will recognize
properly is 6 gig. Even though the entire 9 gig drive is there, Amigados can
only see 6 gigs even if you partition it.
Frank
Whew! Just about as we had calculated.
Maybe we should bug the Opus people to catch up with the technology?
RUSS / Mike
Since you didn't say, is the 9GB a Newtek certified drive? I don't think
it should effect the capacity, but who knows.
When I loaded a framestore on a flyer drive and then placed it between two
clips, it effected the start of the first clip. Newtek recommended that
all framestores be stored on other than Flyer drives. Note the in and out
points on the scenes. They may be forcing a delay to give the effect
enough time. Also, it could be a bug, since this is Beta software. Be
sure to alert Newtek.
Hope I've helped some.
By the way, what video jack on the Flyer isn't active? I only noted the
SVHS, which I believe is the front for the TBC to come. The remaing five
RCA jacks are stereo in and out and time code in.
Hank
Videology, Inc Where you get all the P.O.M.P. under all
circumstances.
Henry,
Boy, am I getting mis-information. Or are we both?
Computer Basics told me that it was fine to store Framestores on the Flyer
disk. To quote them "that's what they are there for". IOW it was not suppose to
effect the useage of the drives.
Computer Basics also pointed to each of the RCA jacks, which as you know are
not marked, and there is not mention of them in the manual, and told me that
starting with the jack next to the SVHS that they are Video IN, Audio IN L/R,
Audio OUT L/R. I may have the L/R reversed. But, the audio and video are
correct.
Then when I spoke to NewTek, they told me that both the SVHS and the VIDEO jack
were not connected. They never told me it was TC. Do you mean to say, I can
send TC into the Flyer. I thought that I kept reading or hearing that this
version didn't support TC. Are we all getting the same boards?
The problem I have is placing two video clips next to each other and then
putting ANY effect in between. Dissolve, digital, wipe, KIKI Fairy. It doesn't
matter which effect.
The outgoing scene freeze at the point where the effect would start. Then the
new scene comes in, in full motion. It is only the outgoing scene that I am
having problems with.
I've tried adjusting the starts and ends of the scenes and the effects. Nothing
has any effect – no pun entended.
I, like you, noticed that if you are going to put in a freeze frame, you have
to put a live action scene in first. I'm sure this is another bug. There are
many times when you will want to open with a still image and then go to live
action.
Henry, I didn't think this was suppose to be Beta software. I was told that
this was another release after the Beta release. I was also told that there is
suppose to be another set of 3 1/2" disk coming out next week. But, NewTek is
NOT calling it an upgrade.
Don't most companies pay people to run Beta versions of their products.
Parson's Technology use to send me the regular release a not cost for the
programs that I beta tested.
I'm glad I never mentioned to my banker that this was a kind of beta release.
He would have never loaned me the money. Which just proves that all of us video
people are nuts. The least NewTek could do is give us earlier buyers an 800
number to call. Well, wait, I can't complain. Look at the price I paid. Anybody
ordering after June 30th had to pay more.
I hope you and everybody who reads that above paragraph takes it with all of
the humor that it was intended to be. This system plays back a picture that
looks absolutly great. Once we find out what is causing my problem and solve
it, it will be a dynamite system. And when the entire 4.0 is finally
released…
Fred
The rules keep changing. I have digitized video from a Beta SP source
using the Toaster's Input 1 and the audio RCA jacks you referred to. I
was told by another dealer that the first RCA jack (the one next to the
SVHS connector) was for time code input. On a recent post here, I was told
the serial connectors, ported with the SCSI cables, are for the timecode.
I guess I'll call Newtek tomorrow.
I've used framestores for the first frame, and placed dissolves, and other
effects/wipes, between two clips. The only time there was a problem is
when one of the croutons was a framestore which was stored on a flyer
video drive. I've used other framestores with not problems and will try
the old one once my flyer is running again. I hope it's not the power
supply. BTW – I believe the flyer drive treats the framestore as a
continuous video stream if its on the flyer video drive, where is loads
the framestore into a frame buffer otherwise. This might cause the A/B
conflict which stutters the video.
I used the setup screen to create framestores for background colors and
can now start any clip sequence with a black background, dissolving to the
first crouton.
Hank
Videology, Inc Where you get all the P.O.M.P. under all
circumstances.
>>Since you didn't say, is the 9GB a Newtek certified drive? I don't think it
should effect the capacity, but who knows.>>
Yes, all of the three drives are NewTek certified. At least they better be, I
paid the price. When I re-formated the A drive, I noticed that my three drives
are the following
9GB is a Seagate 2GB is a Quantum 540 audio drive is a Quantum
I remember in the list you posted a few days ago, you said that the 2GB were
IBM. Does this just mean that Newtek has approved other manufacturers?
Fred
I got a fax last week from Newtek indicating that a 2GB Quantum and a 9GB
Micropolis are now certified. My supplier said they already had the
Quantum in stock, so that may be what you got. You can always check,
because the drive will have a 'Newtek Certified' sticker on it. The
original 2GB drives are IBM.
Any fast SCSI drive will work on the Audio ("C") SCSI port, so the Q540 is
great.
I'll update my Flyer info file and repost it this week.
Hank
Videology, Inc Where you get all the P.O.M.P. under all
circumstances.
Fred,
Thanks for the info on Flyer input/outputs. I look forward to getting more info
as it becomes available.
Frank
Frank,
You still don't have your Flyer. You are on the west coast. Closer to Kansas
than we, I think. What are they using? Mule Trains. Wells Fargo Stage Coach?
Seriously, unless you are a lot luckier than me. Don't plan on doing any real
production when it arrives. Use the time to learn it, but if you are now using
the Toaster, keep it on your system until NewTek works out some of these
problems.
Fred
Fred,
My unit was ordered thru Computer Basics (AmigaMan) and supposedly it will ship
in the first pre-order group of 50 that were pre-paid with deposits. They
charged my credit card in late December saying at that time that in a few days
ALL pre-orders would be filled. Obviously Amigaman has no control over Newtek
and circumstances have lead me to believe that perhaps I am luckier NOT to have
recieved one of the very first units. I have been unexpectedly busier than
usual for this time of the year, and if Flyer software is as fragile as you and
others have reported, I would have been in deep doo with paying clients. Gee
what a concept; a paying client expecting to get professional performance for
the money they spend. I wonder if Newtek considers me a "paying client" now
that they already have my money? <g>
Hopefully my unit will show up in the next few days and I'll have the time to
really get to know it before I begin to reveal it's magic to my clients.
Regards
FRank
Dont't mean to rain on your parade but I don't think NewTek is shipping
production versions as (even if prepaid). I would expect that they are waiting
for more feedback from Dealer Demo Beta units.
Hope I'm wrong for your sake. Good Luck.
RUSS SPENCER / MM
Russ, Don't mean to clear up your rainstorm, but my Flyer IS from computer
basics. Regards, Gary
I suspect Canadian dealers are typically being put on the back-burner re:
delayed shipping. On the other hand it's possible that the units recieved by
Computer Basics (and maybe others) were actually originally destined to be Beta
Tester or Delear Demo units but were cancelled orders when NewTek decided to
charge for these units and, indeed, charge $1500 more than the pre-order price
(alot of people were pretty upset when NT announced this pricing).
I have a buddy who cancelled his Beta order to await production shipping (he
also had a pre-order in with a dealer) – he is still waiting. So we are all
pulling for NewTek to get rolling ASAP.
I thing NewTek had only orderred about 300 Beta-Dealer units, so this may be
the number now in user hands. Where did that 900 number (no not phone number)
come from? So far I've only counted about 20 people corresponding on
Compuserve and the NewTek BBS who have Flyers in thier hands.
Later – RUSS
Michael,
Thanks for your message. Yes I am fully aware that they are only shipping the
\.9 version. The dealer called me back in December to ask me if I would be
willing to accept the .9 version until the final version (then expected 2nd
week of Jan) was automaticly shipped to me when ready. Even with supposed
"final" versions of software, there are always bugs or unnaceptable work
arounds. At least this time Newtek was being much more up-front about the
issue.
Frank
Frank,
Computer Basics is the same place I got mine. They told me on Monday, that on
Saturday they had received two unit. One was mine. But, somebody forgot to tell
me to come up Monday morning.
Then on Monday, they receive, what they said, was a bunch of units. When I
called them on Wednesday to talk about my problem, I could not get anyone in
tech support to answer the phone. I called the 800 number and was told by one
of the salesman that Doug Smith and Jim were busy building Flyers and could not
be disturbed.
Jim finally called me back at about 4 in the afternoon.
Figure you are five days shipping via UPS, you'll probably get your unit early
next week.
Do you mean to say, they charged the entire purchase price to your credit card
back in December. I thought companies only put charges through at the time of
shippment. You might want to call your credit card company and tell them. The
least they could do is back off the interest until you actually receive your
Flyer.
""Gee what a concept; a paying client expecting to get professional performance
for the money they spend.""
I had the same feeling as I was driving home yesterday. I didn't pay for a Beta
version. When I spoke to NewTek on the phone, they told me that they had no
idea why my Flyer is doing what it is doing. But, if only a few units are
performing this way, then they need to give me either a new board or new
software and that should fix it.
Fred
Fred,
When my credit card bill showed up I was on the phone instantly to Computer
Basics. They were very apologetic, explaining that Newtek had promised them
immediate shipment (within a couple of days) as soon as the money was wired to
them in Kansas. Apparently a last minute snafu (or several) delayed shipment of
the software. Personally I feel that this is unfortunate for Newtek, as much of
their professional reputation has eroded seriously in the last year. They
really didn't need this delay from a PR standpoint, and I am hopeful that these
setbacks are minor. On the other hand, with as much money at stake for me
personally (in excess of 8k) I am becoming less understanding as each day
passes without even as much as a phone call from my dealer regarding the
statuus of my order. I have to take the initiative to contact them every few
days.
BTW, they will be sending my unit next day air when it ships. Shipping the unit
ground doesn't really save much because the insurance on this size puchase (over
80%) is the bulk of the total shipping expense.
Frank
Frank,
If Computer Basics has not yet shipped your unit, you may be waiting a little
longer. I just spoke to them today, to see if I could get a replacement card
just in case that was the problem. I was told they have nothing in house.
NewTek is rationing the dealers. Send just so many to each one.
I am told my problem may be a software one. The cards are suppose to be really
hi-tech. When they had an overheating problem, they solved it via the software.
Speaking of the cards, I asked NewTek what they were going to do about the two
video input jacks that are not now connected. Are they going to have to send
everybody a new card when they finally figure out how to make it work. The
answer I got was "maybe". I wonder if anybody even thought of this. The tech I
spoke to at NewTek seemed to sound like that was an area than was not covered.
I can just see, (what are there – about 900 owners) everybody getting this
little wiring schematic and maybe jumping cable.
This is one time, I think NewTek jumped the gun and let a system go out the
door too soon. From what I heard, they had to ship by the end of the year. Was
that a financial reason. The dealers had to pay in advance. So, maybe they
needed this vast income to cover something and shipping now gave them the
money.
You've got over 8K invested, I had over 11K considering my down payment. I'm
sure those figures are pretty close to average. Multiply that times almost 1000
units and thats somewhre around 8 to 10 million dollars. I wish I could figure
out a way to bring in that much at one moment in time.
I was going to suggest changing the subject heading on this thread, and then I
noticed I mentioned the video inputs so that makes it kosher.
How is the weather your way. I know that southern CA has been getting lots of
rain and flooding, but as I understand it, so has the northern area. Everything
ok in your neighborhood?
I have an aunt and uncle that live in San Jose. When we lived there way back
when, they use to tell me that when the big earthquake came, those in San Jose
would have water front property – the Pacific Ocean. May not need to wait for
the earthquake.
Fred
Frank
Safe harbor pulled a fast one on me – maybe AmigaMan did it to you.
I ordered the Flyer back in June at the introductory price, paid the deposit
and sent them the serial number particulars. Before I left for Holidays I
called them to confirm my order and to say that should it ship while I was away
that I did want it and could use CD-Rom.
Well, two weeks after I talked to the guy handling the Flyer orders, he called
for me, but I wasn't here. So, when I got back I was surprised to find no
FLyer here. When I called Safe Harbor I found out they had shipped all the
"pre-orders" except mine which the gave to a new order. They then moved me to
the bottom of the list of 1.0 orders they had as if I was a new order.
I'm not a happy camper and will not be getting my Flyer drives from Safe Harbor
I can tell you….
wmc – via Autopilot!
Fred, I (we all) appreciate your posting your discoveries about your Flyer.
Do you have any info about slo-mo capability….loading a motion clip at
regular speed and having it come out at, say, half speed?
Nick
Nick,
If I could figure out what I did to get slow motion, I could probably make a
fortune selling the commands to NewTek.(g)
I really don't know what caused it. It happened again this evening. I recorded
two clips and they both played back in slow motion. Then I re-booted, recorded
two new clips and they were normal.
It may be related to the problem I am having with the video doing a freeze
frame during an effect.
Have you tried recording at the extended play speed. I ran a one hour clip
today at that speed and the system would not play it back. Got an error saying
that it could not read the clip.
I have been able to record shorter extended speed clips that did work. So, the
size of this clip might have had something to do with it. BTW, this has nothing
to do with the slow motion problem.
When I questioned NewTek a while back, they did say that slow motion and
reverse motion was going to be possible. Hopefully, they will include it when
4.0 gets finished.
Fred
Possibly your drive problems stemming from having 2 different size drives i.e.
9 gig and a 2 gig (is that your config?). Since these would run at different
speed (at least they are probably rated differently) I could see that as being
a source of potential conflict since one drive would have to catch up to the
other after some effects instead of synching together for smooth A/B.
Just taking a shot. RUSS
""Possibly your drive problems stemming from having 2 different size drives
i.e. 9 gig and a 2 gig (is that your config?).""
This is NewTek's recommendation, at least according to the dealer. From
everything that I've been reading in the doc you need three drives. Two for
video/audio and one for just audio. Size doesn't matter.
Anyway, I have put my video clips on the same drive. IOW I'm not putting some
on one drive and some on the other. Actually, I tried everything. Putting clips
on drive A. Then recording new clips on drive B. Then recording clips on both
drive A and drive B. No difference. That's why I don't think the problem is in
the drives.
I'm really leaning to believing it is in the card. That's the other reason I
want to know the date of everybody else's software. If we all have the same
date then it must be the card, unless I have a bad software disk. Anything is
possible. However, at $10,000 I don't think I should have to come up with the
solution.
Fred
Re: Slo-Mo etc. There are no controls for it in the latest software release
(3.9) so it probably won't show up till after initial production models are
shipped.
Cound on "NewTek Time".
RUSS SPENCER / MM