#Good $500 Color Printer
41 messages in this thread
Can anyone recommend a good color printer for around $500 – $600?
I've been reading a bit about the HP PaintJet, but I haven't seen its
output. Is it clean? How're the colors? Is there any banding? How's the
speed?
Any advise would be greatly appreciated.
Roger
Roger,
Check out the Citizen GSX 140(80 column) or the GSX 145(132 column). With
color kit they can be had for 140~$350, 145~$400. I have the 145 and am
very happy with it. The color is pretty good. Both are 24 Pin and have good
paper handling. The speed at the higer resolutions is pretty good.
Good Hunting,
Jeff
– via Whap!
Jeff:
I have a 9-pin color (Star NX-1000) and a Toshiba 24-pin. I know 24-pin
printers can look pretty good but I just don't like the way color
dot-matrix output looks. On lower resolutions, it's too light for good
color saturation and at higher resolutions it mutilates the paper.
I have a Canon PJ-1080a (a color inkjet) which I like a lot but it has very
low resolution – 83 x 84 dpi. I used to have an Okimate 10 (that's right,
a '10', not a '20') and I like the idea of thermal transfer. I've seen
output from a CalComp ColorMaster which is practically magazine-cover
quality but then it starts at around $7,000. This is high-end color
thermal transfer.
I dunno, I was kinda wanting to hear that I need this-or-that off brand
color inkjet with 300 dpi, .25 ppm and street tag of $499. And then I
awoke…
Roger
Roger, well…. I had the PJ for about two years, and think very highly of
it. Some facts on it: you can only use special HP PJ paper (other ink jet
papers don't look nearly as nice), but the ink really looks sharp on that
paper! Paper is nice texture, a bit 'pastier' than regular copier type
paper.
Output is 180DPI, but that's only when doing primary colors. Figure actual
resolution at 90DPI, so that the machine can dither stuff to get more
colors. The main place I noticed the lower res was in text stuff, where I
was used to 300DPI you can only get 180DPI from the PJ for text 🙁
Speed is pretty good. Don't remember exactly, but it is certainly faster
than other printers that need three passes to make color output (PJ does
color in one pass).
The PJ holds two ink cartridges, one black and one color (three colors). So
you never need to swap cartridges while mixing text/graphics print.
Re quality/banding. Yeah, there is some banding, most noticable with large
blocks of solid colors (particularly black). Not nearly as bad as it
sounds, but it is there.
Now, for word on *another* color printer. The HP DeskjetC (color
deskjet!). 300DPI for primary colors, 150DPI actual resolution I guess
(same reason as above). And text looks just like regular DJ text, great at
300DPI! Uses any type of paper that the DJ uses (ie. copier, fine resume,
etc!). Speed is good (I watched it print a multi-color page, and it worked
pretty fast). Does make three/four passes for color printouts though. But
it only uses one ink cartridge, so if you are mixing color and B&W on one
page you'll need to swap cartridges often 🙁 Cost? Very cool $695 or
so. A bargain and I'll bet Amiga uses take to this one by storm.
Remember, the PJ has good drivers already available for it NOW. The
DeskjetC (text, B&W graphics) has good drivers already available for it
NOW. But the 'Color' of the DeskjetC will need new drivers, which I'd
expect we'll see RSN. Hope this helps.
[ MORE ]
Unless I'm missing something, I'd vote for the Deskjet C. Its my
understanding that they have the Mac model out now which you would not
want, weird cabling and all. Have not seen the IBM PC version but surely
they will have one and then it'll work with the Amiga very well. Don't know
about a driver though. In the Bay Area I've seen the Mac offering for $649.
cash but hopefully the PC version will be cheaper. I've used the Paintjet
and its a very reliable printer, nice color but it needs the expensive
clay-coated paper to get a result, .30 – .40 a page for 8.5 X 11. I'd wait
on the Deskjet C. With a Postscript emulator you would get some nice
prints.
Margaret, I agree that an Amiga user should get the Deskjet500C (not the
Mac's DeskWriterC). I have seen one in action (the non-Mac version) this
past weekend, so they exist. HP is just taking their time shipping them to
dealers I guess. This dealer expects to have them in this week sometime
(shoot, maybe they already do, I haven't called).
Cost at this dealer was to be $695 for the Deskjet500C (the one we want).
Have no idea if this is a 'good' price or not.
Folks should remember that this printer also includes the Deskjet500, which
has been an excellent printer for some time. I have one and have always
liked it's output. The 'C' only adds the color capability (only!).
By Postscript emulator, I assume you mean a software emulator on the Amiga,
that converts PS to Deskjet output, right? I've never heard of any
'Postscript' cartridge for the DJ.
–jp–seattle–
There are font cartridges for the Deskjet. I do mean a software emulator,
whereby you'd batch your prints and go out for coffee. There are a slew of
soft postscript emulators for the Macintosh that would be tiresome for
publishing. However the output I've seen on a Paintjet with a soft PS
emulator for a full page color design is very nice. Soo…I'd imagine Post
or what's the name of the Amiga commercial product(??) would work as well.
Microtimes and Computer Currents upon inspection had ads for the Deskjet C
– so it is in PC land now – price appears to be the same. Here anything
about a driver for this printer????
[ continuation ]
–jp–seattle–
John:
Yeah, it helps a great deal, thanx.
I've never really thought about the point you made concerning dpi &
dithering. By that way of thinking, my Canon is really 42 dpi. Geez, and
y'know, it really doesn't look half bad.
So, how does black look on the DJc? More like muck than black? I agree, a
color driver for the new 'c will soon be soon in coming. But the question
is, which should I go for? My trusty ol' HP LJ II has certainly spoiled me
with 300 dpi clarity. What I need to do is get HP to send me sample
outputs of both.
Thanks again.
Roger
Roger:
Hewlett Packard just introduced a new DeskJet Color printer which should
sell for around $600.00. It prints 300 dpi in color or black and white.
They recommend it to a person who wants good color prints and good text as
well. I saw its output at Comdex. Very nice. However, they still felt
that the PaintJet was superior, even though its resolution wasn't as high..
this is as a color printer. I've seen some excellent buys on the paintjet,
since this new one was introduced. Now, if you are in San Diego area, you
can come look at the output. <g>
Susan Lazear
[CRAFTS]
Susan:
Isn't that funny. A local HP dealer told me the same thing – the painjet
looks better for color, even though it has 35% less resolution. That's how
important having true black is. Hmmm.
I really need to compare the output side by side. For b&w, I'm very happy
with my HP LJ II, so I really don't need a color printer for black and
white.
Roger
P.S. Thanks for the invitation, but I'm on the other coast.
There's more to the PJ 'quality' than 'true black'. The PJ requires a
special coated paper, that their ink really sets up well on. Very bold,
vivid.
The new DJ500-C (color) will output on 'plain papers' just like the DJ
does. So the ink and paper aren't made for each other, like the PJ.
But…. I'll tell you from experience that the type of paper you use in
your DJ makes a world of difference in the quality of the output (bleeding,
boldness, etc). Copier/laser paper is ok, but just ok. Personally I like
"Crane's Kid Finish 100% cotton fiber paper – pearl white" (I think 24lb)
for my really good corr and graphics printouts on the DJ. I wouldn't be
surprised if the quality of color printouts was also much better if you use
a good paper like this (but expensive, too = $9.00 for 50 sheets). You get
what you pay for.
–jp–seattle–
jp:
Thanks. My Canon prefers a special clay-coated paper, too. And it also
makes a great deal of difference in the quality of output. But, it's not
THAT expensive and it comes in rolls – more economical than single sheets,
but not as preferable.
I gotta check out what the DJc looks like on coated paper. Again, thanks.
Roger
Roger, is that the PJ1080A from Canon? If so, where do you buy you paper
and ink? I used to buy that stuff for my PJ from Radio Shack, but it seems
to be harder to come by and I am quickly running out of paper. Just
wondering where you get yours?
JH
– via Whap!
Jim:
Actually, I bought several cases of paper and ink carts directly from Canon
when I bought the printer. Let me know if you get desperate and I'll send
you off a box of three rolls. Otherwise, try Canon. They should have
plenty.
Make sure you get the clay-coated type – they made two types – for much
higher quality output.
Roger
Is the paper you bought from Canon a single roll (like fax paper only not
thermal paper) or is it perforated? What I had been using from Radio Shack
was their clay coated paper for the ink jet that Canon had made for them
(it was the PJ only with a Radio Shack name) but it wasn't perforated
paper. I would like to find the same paper, only perforated. Any ideas?
JH
– via Whap!
Jim:
Yeah, it's a continuous roll – no perfs. Sorry.
Roger
Jim:
The Radio Shack printer (the CGP-220) wasn't a PJ. a PJ is a HP PaintJet,
and the RS printer was their equivelent of the Canon 1080 printer, which is
also the same machine as the original IBM Color printer, the big difference
was that the 3 Canon, RS, IBM all had different ROMs in them. If you check
in the libs for printer drivers, you will find drivers for all three
versions of this printer.
-Mike Schiller
In sunny Fort Lauderdale
Mike,
There's some confusion here… The Canon WAS a PJ. The actual name of the
printer is the Canon PJ-1080.
…Denny Atkin
Denny:
I stand corrected. Thanks.
-Mike Schiller
In sunny Fort Lauderdale
Mike,
Understandably there is some confusion here. Reference your previous
message as follows: << The Radio Shack printer (the CGP-220) wasn't a PJ.
a PJ is a HP PaintJet, >> The PJ that you are talking about is obviously
the HP PainJet. The PJ I am talking about is the Canon PJ1080A. The
CGP-220 WAS the PJ1080A only private labeled with Radio Shack's name on it.
I'm sorry for any confusion.
JH
– via Whap!
Now that we are talking about the "cheap" color printer. Is there a
Preferences or otherwise driver for this new Deskjet C color/black and
white printer?????
No problem, somebody else also pointed this out to me! BTW, while the
CGP-220 and the PJ1080A are the same printer, they did have different ROMs
in them, and so need different printer drivers. IBM also sold the same
printer, and of course it had a different ROM in it too. I do believe that
there are printer drivers for all three printers here in the libs.
Jim, are you using non-HP paper in your PJ? If you are, I'd strongly
suggest that you try the HP 'official' PJ paper. When I had a PJ I tried a
couple different types of 'ink-jet' paper, but the HP paper was MUCH
better. They mean it when they say to use it for best output. Just a
thought….
–jp–seattle–
Ever try the "generic" clay coated paper. I've seen it around in PC mail
order stuff.
I did try two types of 'generic' ink-jet (ie. clay coated) paper when I
first got my PJ. Neither had near the color brilliance of the HP paper,
IMHO. So I just stuck with regular HP paper from then on.
I sold my PJ a while ago, and haven't tried any 'new' papers; are you
saying that they are just as good? Would be nice to know for PJ owners,
since HP paper is rather pricey.
–jp–seattle–
No never tried the generic paper either. Just saw it for sale. I was loaned
a Paintjet for a few months. I bought $150.00 in paper and ink and went on
a marathon printing session to get a portfolio of textile designs. I
figured that ink and paper was about .33 a page at the best. Unfortunately
the Paintjet (not the wide platen one XL?) puts all of ink colors in one
cartridge, so I'd end up running out. Then to max out the cartridge, I'd
change my designs to eliminate the missing color. I used Palette Printer to
calibrate the printer, worked very well. If I ever get a color printer
again, *I'LL* write the Arexx macro to change the colors automatically in
IP or Regpaint.
Yeah, I used to run out of one of the ink colors too… with the other two
going strong. But the alternative would be to have four cartridges (rather
than just two) and that would have raised the cost. I suppose they took
the most 'normal' way out and just put all the color in one cartridge.
Hey, at least the PJ has a seperate black cartridge. With the DJ500C
printer you need to switch ink cartridges just to go from Black to color…
a pain IMHO. But cheaper they told me, so I suppose we can all live with
it.
–jp–seattle–
I am using the paper that Radio Shack sold for its ink-jet printer (they
don't sell the printer any more and I don't recall the model, but it was
made for them by Canon). It worked fine and gave some really nice graphics
printouts but as I explained in another message, the paper wasn't
perforated. Another problem was how it rolled up after output instead of
staying flat. When you say HP do you mean Hewlett Packard, or what?
JH
– via Whap!
John,
So do you own a DJ500-C TOO? Is there any neat Amiga stuff you DON'T
own? 😉
A friend at work was interested in this deal. But he also heard of some
possibility of an upgrade from his present DeskJet. I came in late here; do
you know of such a deal?
Nope, don't own the DJ500C (yet) 🙂
Yeah, there is an upgrade from any of the DJ series. I called HP and they
sent me a coupon to do the upgrade. Basically I send the old printer back
to one of their designated service centers, with a check, and a few days
later a *NEW* DJ500C is mailed out to me. (the warranty will be either 90
days, or the time left on your orig printers warranty, whichever is longer)
Cost is: $450 if you're upgrading a DJ500.
$550 for any other DJ.
You need to send the printer back to them fully insured, so mailing costs
will likely be $25 or so?
There's even an 'express' service, where they will get you the new printer
in next-day delivery, if you pay an extra $65. Normal turnaround time is
3-4 days, they say.
The DJ500C is the same as the DJ500, with a few notable exceptions: 1) it
has color, of course; 2) It no longer supports the IBM ProPrinter or Epson
FX-80 emulation cartridges.
It comes down to whether I think $450 is ok to upgrade to get ONE printer
(the DJ500C), or whether I'd rather just pay $690 and buy another printer.
Then I'd have two. Doubt if I could sell the old DJ500 for the $250
difference (since they only cost 300 new these days); I'll likely just go
for the 2nd printer given the relatively small $$ difference.
Oh, the HP number to call re upgrade info is: 208-323-2551.
Do you think we could convice Perry at ASDG to write a custom driver for
the DJ500C for ADPro 2.0? That would convince me to get it in a minute! 🙂
–jp–seattle–
John,
Thanks for the reply; I'll pass it along to the guy at work who
requested it.
How would direct support from ADPro benefit you?
(Fearing the answer as it may lead to $$$ spent)
Karl
– via Whap!
Well, according to the ADPro 2.0 flyer, it will output to 'preferences
supported printers' as well.
I've just thought that if someone wrote a REALLY high quality driver
specifically for a good printer that it would perform much better (in
quality) than an 'all purpose' prefs driver. I just wonder what ASDG could
do if they decided to write their own graphics driver for the 500C? Tht's
what I meant 🙂 (I don't expect it though)
–jp–seattle–
John, we've done both. As you know, we've had output to prefs printers
using 24 bit techniques for some time now; and as part of that development
effort, we did write a "direct" driver for a couple of printers. The
results were much better than the indirect method via prefs – as you might
expect.
However, the correct solution to this problem is NOT for the various Amiga
s/w developers to write printer specifc drivers; it's for CBM to implement
24 bit printer drivers.
In this – as in many other things – they are far behind the times.
Ben
Well Ben this is a market opportunity for "Bundle 'O Drivers".
No thanks. :^)
Ben
I think Commodore really needs to look at their drivers in Preferences. I
called them ,which was a stupid idea, and they basically said it was not
going to happen – drivers that address the highest capabilities of color
printers. Now we have a changed color space and I bet the Paintjet etc.
could do a better job then it does. The Paintjet manual implies it anyway.
I guess for the number of people that own a color printer at this point,
Commodore can just float by on what they have. Don't really expect a 3rd
party to come to the rescue anytime soon.
I agree. I had the HP Paintjet, and now have the Deskjet. There is a 3rd
party driver avail for the Deskjet that is much superior to the prefs
supplied driver. Graphics actually come out clean, not muddy.
(SuperDJDriver, which is part of a package called 'DJHelper') Sure would
be nice to have better control over some of the color printers too.
I think we could ALL own color printers, and the results would be the same.
More and more software is using custom drivers. (So much for the advantage
of preference based drivers.) The smartest thing Commodore did was to buy
Amiga. The dumbest was to take over development and marketing.
I started with a 1000, then bought a 2000, and now a 3000. I bought these
machines in spite of Commodore, not because of them.
– via Whap!
Karl,
and of course, if you buy a new printer you get a 3-year warranty,
compared to 90 days with the trade-in. Guess which way I'm going. <g>
Blaq! – via Whap!
Roger… the Deskwriter edges were kind of 'feathered', but it really was a
good image. A friend of mine on east coast bought a PaintJet for $600-650.
Good hunting.
Susan Lazear
[Crafts]