#Motion Capture For 3DS
49 messages in this thread
Well Martin, in case you don't already know about this….. here it is straight
off the NET.
Ascension's Flock of Birds 6D Tracking system PRESS RELEASE – FOR IMMEDIATE
RELEASE TITLE: ASCENSION'S FLOCK OF BIRDS CHOSEN FOR MOTION CAPTURE IN MAJOR
EXHIBITS AT SIGGRAPH '94 SUBTITLE: ALIAS, WAVEFRONT, AND AUTODESK TO HIGHLIGHT
PERFORMANCE ANIMATION WITH FLOCK MOTION CAPTURE
Motion-capture for performance/animation will be prominently exhibited at this
year's annual SIGGRAPH Exposition in Orlando, starting on July 26, 1994. The
exposition runs through July 28th at the Orange County Convention Center.
Animation software leaders Alias, Autodesk, and WAVEFRONT will each feature
Ascension's Flock of BirdsTM motion-capture equipment in their booths.
Autodesk's latest 3D Studio release brings motion-capture down to the PC
platform. After evaluating alternative techniques for tracking motions, all
three — as well as Softimage — recommend the Flock as the preferred method of
capturing the motions of live actors in creating computer animations.
Performance animation integrates computer-generated characters with realistic,
fluid human motions. The process starts when an actor is typically hooked up
with 10-15 Flock receivers (sensors) to accurately record his movements in real
time. This information is then used to control a computer-generated character.
The resulting computer characters display natural, accurate movements that are
difficult and costly to produce with traditional keyframe techniques. The
process allows production companies to quickly produce large amounts of 3D
animations. Some recent prominent examples of animations created with the Flock
include: R/Greenberg's Shell Oil ad campaign, Lamb and Company's Donnie Domino
ads, Windlight's Weldon Pond pilot for CBS television, Mr. Film's Fantastic
Four feature film based on Marvel comics, and Universal Studio's Jurassic Park
tour. "Motion
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capture is the future," says Alias's product manager for entertainment, Gary
Mundell. Last year, Softimage and Alias led the pack in developing Flock
drivers for motion-capture equipment. This year at SIGGRAPH, they will be
joined by Wavefront and Autodesk. Wavefront's Kinemation and Autodesk's 3D
Studio software packages will be seen for the first time operating with the
Flock. An eleven-receiver Flock will also be exhibited in Ascension's booth (#
1552). Here a mime will be used to interact with visitors while demonstrating
the capability of the Flock to quickly capture full body motions. A wireframe
image of the mime's likeness will follow his motions in real time. "At the
Ascension booth, we will concentrate on helping people understand the hardware
requirements for motion capture, "said Ascension vice president, Jack Scully.
"Alias, Wavefront and Autodesk will emphasize the benefits of using their
animation software packages with the Flock," he continued. The Flock itself is
an easy-to-use motion-capture product, enabling a user to simultaneously track
up to 29 receivers (sensors) referenced to a transmitter emitting pulsed DC
magnetic fields. Magnetic fields are used because they overcome some of the
vexing problems of earlier optical and vide-based trackers — non-real time
tracking, blocking/occlusion and extremely high cost. The Flock transmitter
provides ample coverage for a person to move about a 16-foot diameter.
Receivers send their sensed signals back to a central bank of electronics for
processing and output to a host computer. For ease of movement, receiver cables
are often bundled and suspended via a bungee-type cord from an overhang on the
work stage. Ascension, based in South Burlington, VT, has extensive experience
in developing, manufacturing and marketing multi degrees-of-freedom tracking
devices for various markets. Give us a call, or email for more information. Or
come and see us at
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SIGGAPH.
🙂
It should prove interesting. It seems like a phenomenal amount of info to put
into 3DS but I just happen to have a heck of alot of motion capture data from
the Flock. Hopefully come August 1, I can simply click on a few buttons and
watch my models move. 🙂
Paul
Paul,
<< click on a few buttons and watch my models move. 🙂 >>
It's starting to sound, "oh.. so easy" :-)..
Jonas,
It sure is, hmmmmmmmm now I have to figure out how to get that Flock in house.
🙂
Paul
Something tells me you'll find a way, Paul.
Hey, you could be one of the first desktop-based motion-capture
service bureaus in the US! Folks could fly in, jump around in the
flock, and leave with their motion data in-hand!
I *really* think you should move your operation to SoCal, Paul<g>.
We are in the process of moving, but the only LA I'd move to is a
state. 🙂 I enjoy swamps, cajun food, and parties.
Plenty of Cajun food, swamps (During the wet season. Some folks call
'em floods<g>), and TONS of parties right here in good 'ole North San
Diego County. All the good parts of living in SoCal, with very
little of the LA-ness!
<< hmmmmmmmm now I have to figure out how to get that Flock in house. :-)>>
Yes! Get the flock in here! 🙂
Ok, I have to ask. What is the ":-)" that you guys keep putting in your
messages. I'm assuming it's supposed to be a little smiley face and has the
same meaning as "<g>". That it?
David
Bingo 8-} (I wear glasses)
>>glasses….
<g> (or :-), take your pick)
David
>> smiley face
Yup! I've seen text files with hundreds of variants, too! !:-}
– Dave
<< Yup! I've seen text files with hundreds of variants, too!
!:-}>>
If you(anyone) has one handy, I'd like it uploaded into the Index and
Info section for the forum neophytes, please.
<< Smiley.txt>>
I'll dig around at home tonight. It goes WAY back to when I used to run a BBS.
– Dave
Thanks…
Paul,
that's FLOCKING brilliant! <G>. That's probably what the big flap is about. Or
at least one of the flaps surrounding Adesk and Siggraph.
I'd guess that a "Flock of Birds" or even a pair of birds is probably out of
reach of the average 3ds animator working out of his garden shed, though.
Probably more in the budget of the Pyros', Lind's, and Jamie Clay's of this
world, I'd guess 🙁
Actually, I'm looking at working for one of the big name game publishers on a
fighting game and the flock would kick for that one <g>.
Martin,
You know that if it works well, people will be aquiring them, and the next
thing you know, it's an asoft party with people standing in line to suit up and
dance around with sensors on. I can't wait! 🙂
Paul
I heard a magnetic system (like the "Flock of Ravens") was $10k to
$25k, and an optical system closer to $100k. Does that sound about
right?
Acutally the system is really competively priced. A 10 sensor unit is
~25K and a 12 sensor unit is ~28K. Extremely competively priced. 🙂
I just got off the phone with Jack Scully, he's the VP up there, and
they're going to put a quote together for us. <BG>
>> Acutally the system is really competively priced. A 10 sensor unit
is ~25K and a 12 sensor unit is ~28K. Extremely competively priced.
🙂 <<
Wow, is that ALL! I'll take a flocking dozen <G>. Actually, we'll need
DPS to get in on this and break the price/performance barrier before
I can get my own. More likely, I'll get to work for a company that
buys one.
Sorry about the misinterpretation. What I meant was that considering
an Extreme is 40K, a Beta deck 35K, a copy of Alias 45K, etc, etc,
etc, ….. 25K did not seem bad at all for the flock. I was also
comparing it to the optical sets which are generally 100K. So
rephrased….. Considering the high cost of equipment and the cost
of the average piece of equipment, or the average budget for projects
involving character animation, 25K seems pretty cheap.
>> they're going to put a quote together for us. <BG>
Can I come play at your house?!?
– Dave
Paul "Scoop" Lind, ace reporter!<g>
-Alan
Yep. Yep. Yep, yep, yep.
<g>
You have to quote more. <G> I don't know what you were agreeing with.
<BG>
I was babbling incredulously at the Flock of Birds news you quoted
from Internet.
Now it makes sense……. <BG>
I had a long conversation with them today. I think that I had
mentioned to you a couple of weeks ago that we were looking at motion
capture. It'll be interesting to see what Adesk has going on at
Siggraph.
Unfortunately, I don't know if I'm going to make it down there. I'm
going to try hard to fly in for a day, but it may be difficult with
our deadlines.
Paul, quit occillating… you KNOW you're gonna be there! <bg>. I
can sympathize with deadlines, though – I almost had to back out, but
I've found someone to lend me a color laptop so I can get a _little_
work done while I'm traveling.
If you've noticed my messgaes this week you can see that they're
posted virtually 24 hours a day. I'm averaging around 3 hours of
sleep a night. 🙁 It's now 10 til 5, I woke up at 9 a.m.
yesterday……. Soooooo…. I really may not make it. Although I'll
try hard.
Yuk! I certainly can sympathize, though I'm not in quite that bad
shape (today <g>).
>> I've found someone to lend me a color laptop
AHA!!!! So YOU are the one who will help relay Siggraph info to the
Asofters and ASOFT info to the attendees! <wishful thinking>
HI, is the 3DS release mentioned out yet? I am using R3 and I have not
seen any way to input motion-files. We are doing that in Wavefront on
our SGI but it would be great if we could use it in our 3D stations.
Thanks, Arturo
Although I can't speak from a position of authority on this………
my guess would be that someone has written a data translator that
allows motion capture files to be imported into 3DS as motion curves.
No-one will know until Siggraph…. but I'd say that more than likely
the solution consists of a data translator rather than a robust
interface to sample data and view it in real time. The major thing
that should be of interest is the solution for assigning the data to
objects in 3DS. In order for it to be effective it should be assigned
to some type of skeletal structure with specific joints.
Which means ……. that if one is going to utilize the flock, then
one has to be able to assign the data from those 12 sensors to 12
specific points on a model inside 3DS.
Now I don't know who is working on IK for 3DS but it will have to
constitute an intense program unto itself if it's not built into 3DS
directly. We'll see.
P.S. – On the other hand I know of two different groups who have
written motion capture translator files for 3DS, so the Siggraph
showing may be highlighting one of those.
>>We'll see.
Only if you come to Siggraph!
WHy can't I see after Siggraph?
I pay my ACM and IEEE dues every year, don't torture me if I can't
make it to the show. 🙂
I'm going to try hard to make it down. I have a full conference
registration with papers/panels/etc, but I've already told them to
ship it all here.
If I'm really lucky, I'll fly in Tuesday night, spend Wednesday there
and fly out late Wednesday night or first thing Thursday morning.
Whatever!
>> I'd say that more than likely the solution consists of a data
translator rather than a robust interface to sample data and view it
in real time. <<
For what its worth it will read raw data and capture in real-time off
a serial device. "Flock of Birds" sound familiar? <g> Wavefront
motion data files are supported as well.
The skeletal structure is supported by nodes, links and joints with
constraints but the primary emphasis at this point is going to be
motion capture and editing. The software is evolving very rapidly and
addresses all the issues you've raised. The first generation will
give you motion capture and the ability to import and export motion
files as well as edit them, at least. You are able to play back the
motion just as in the Keyframer. Its going to be robust in the sense
that its utilizes its own module like other IPAS 3 modules. As far
as I know there is no translator as it reads the file structure of
the motion data files directly.
I'm only sorry I won't be at Siggraph to show it to you in person.
<g>
Wow, that's alot of info. I found out who's producing the software but
I didn't know anywhere near that amount about it. I take it they have
a 12 sensor Flock in-house.
Are they going to establish an in-house service to offer 3DS based
companies the ability to use motion capture at their facilities?
I was "REALLY" surprised when I heard about it. No-one has tried it
before because of the unbelievably intense amount of data delivered
by a device like the Flock. About a year ago when we talked to them
about the possibility of using the unit with a PC, they laughed and
said we would do better to stick with the workstations. We've played
with the hardware before and have a number of motion files here,
(Running/Walking/Karate/etc.) but I can't wait to see the software.
I'm extremely interested in how one can deform and control meshes in
3DS through IPAS. IK is intense.
IS it ready to be released?
Paul
P.S. – Why aren't you going to Siggraph?
>> I was "REALLY" surprised when I heard about it. No-one has tried it
before because of the unbelievably intense amount of data delivered
by a device like the Flock. <<
Amen. To me it is an intense hurculean effort especially after
watching the approach taken with and the development of Kinemation.
Its is also apparent that like Kinemation there will be several
future iterations of the software, but as I said motion capture is
the primary focus with editing and linking functionality.
>> I'm extremely interested in how one can deform and control meshes
in 3DS through IPAS. <<
Well as I said, its a self contained module which will allow you to do
this, then once done the data can be translated into the keyframer
much as you would add any mesh with keyframe data. And it works much
the way that you have similar functions in 3D build and the
Keyframer, you'll have more explicit controls for controlling the
keyframing of motion data.
>> IS it ready to be released? <<
Its debut will be Siggraph, but then you knew that. <g>
>> Are they going to establish an in-house service to offer 3DS based
companies the ability to use motion capture at their facilities. <<
There are two groups that are closely cooperating in the development.
Of the two, one will provide this service. But the real beauty of
this approach is that it will accept the raw data from FOB as well as
the Wavefront Data files, so independents will not be constrained by
a single source. I imagine that with your intense interest you will
be inclined to have your own in-house. And it will be far more cost
effective IMO for you to do so. The software is being priced at a
level to allow access to virtually anyone with a serious interest in
IK, less than say Adobe Photoshop.
>> Why aren't you going to Siggraph. <<
Because for some reason there is a convegence of production and
everyone has decided this is the time to do it; unlike last year. I
may get a break in September but I doubt it. And I'm like a camel, I
never turn down an opportunity to indulge at an oasis. 🙂
Thanks for the info…. sounds like it's definately worth
investigating. I'm still trying to make it down to Siggraph so maybe
I'll see it running. All I'm really interested in is the software
and how it puts the data into 3DS.
>> I'm interested in how software puts the data into 3DS. <<
For capture you have two choices. Flock of Birds or Motion Analysis.
To apply the motion data you create a skeletal "puppet" which you can
then attach the motion data to. This will allow you to apply say
human motion to a dinosaur, or a leopard's motion data to a human.
A 9600 baud rate gives you a frame capture rate of 10-12 fps. 30 fps
is easily obtainable. Baud rates at 115k overload the PC hardware
buffer and a patch is being created to use two serial ports to
overcome this limitation.
Now with a couple of small reflectors attached to a dragonfly… well
you get the idea… <g>
Sounds great….. I was wondering how they were going to get a PC to
capture data as fast as a workstation. Multiple serial ports would
probably work. I'm really excited about seeing the software. Should
be enlightening. Sorry you can't make it to Siggraph.
Thanks, me too.
-JE