#MediaEditor
32 messages in this thread
Hello world;
I'm using MediaPhile's MediaEditor to edit videos with and would like
to hear from people who are either using it or who have moved up to
something better.
Any pros or cons would be greatly appreciated.
GE "OB" O'Brien on autopilot from
ScubaCam Underwater Video Productions
GE,
I use it because it is cheap and has lots of possibilities.
I've owned it for a year and they are quite liberal about just sending you
upgrades without a charge.
The original version I had a year ago was quite buggy and would crash me
almost every time I exited the program. Now this and some other major bugs
seem to have been cured.
I'd still like to see some features I'd consider basic. Like the lack of a
software shuttle mode. I about wear out my F9 and F10 function keys going
frame by frame.
I use it with VISCA and Hi-8. It's good and versatile but takes a lot of
effort. My current 3.9.8 version I just got will have to be adjusted. The
device file for my Vdeck is missing edits by a mere " 15 " frames.
Something wrong somewhere here. At least you have the ability to go in and
play with the StartRecord / StopRecord parameters.
It does work pretty darned good with the toaster.
Rocky
All in all I'd say it's well worth the money I've invested in it though
the expensive stuff is probably better ( and a lot more expensive ).
I'm considering MediaPhile for performing A/B roll edits from two Hi8
LANCS camcorders (TR-700s) to SVHS (JVC HR-S6900). This will be in
conjuction with our Toaster 4000. The Mediaphile package to control all
of this will cost just over $400. Any thoughts?
-Chris
Chris,
I currently have a similar setup to yours. Though not using A/B roll right now
( I only have one TBC), I do use 2 Vdecks source and record and sometimes 1
vdeck source and 1 Sony R5 record.
I do all this through VISCA but with your TR-700 you should be able to use the
RCTC also through CTL-L and a V-box. I know nothing about the JVC deck but if
it has CTL-L you could also use the V-box I guess.
I have mixed emotions about the Mediaphile. It has all kinds of possibilities
but as someone else once said about it I think they try to make it do just a
little too much. It has good control of the toaster, through their own commands
I assume. I , however, use the T-REXX pro for controlling the toaster through
Mediaphile. It works really good.
They send you updates quite often. I bought the MediaEditor software last
summer and it has been updated about 4 times since then. The last few updates
have been significant. Before these the program used to crash on me quite
often. Now it doesn't seem to go bye-bye at all.
I still don't care a whole lot for the interface. The mode is 640 x 400
interlaced whether you like it or not. No options for low res. This is a
problem for me when using the toaster since I can't use a flicker device with
it. However, with the newer colors it isn't that bad.
Sometimes the screen seems a little cluttered with the Mediacontroller VCR
controls sitting on top of your Edit decision list . I found I was always
dragging them around getting them out of my way. Now, though, the program seems
to support higher resolutions and virtual screens so you can put them at the
bottom out of the way but they are hard to grab when they first come up on this
virtual screen.
There is no shuttle mode on the VCR control (MediaController). Just forward ,
rev, frame fwd, frame back, stop, pause and record. If you want to shuttle you
have to click forever on the mouse or use the F9 and F10 function keys ( bang ,
bang, bang, bang oops there's the frame.)
I would suggest gettting real familiar with the keyboard controls for the
program. It has helped me considerably. Also, the first thing I do now when I
start the program is either turn the Mediaphile keyboard off for one of the
VTR's or require it to use a qualifier key. If you don't do this you will be
issuing the same command to both (or all three) VTR's at the same time. Also it
will take some time to remember to diable the keyboard or while you are typing
in scripts you will be putting the decks in pause with the spacebar etc etc.
etc.
It gets about +/- 2 frames with my Vdecks and I am a little disappointed with
this. I used to use VideoDirector and I think I was more in the neighborhood of
+/- 1 frame most of the time.
Another thing , for me anyway, is that lately with the updates I've had to
reconfigure my Vdecks in their Device file setups. As this last version was
shipped, the driver for my Vdecks was putting my edits off by about 15 – 19
frames. It was easy enough to fix by changing the startrecord and stoprecord
frame offsets but just one thing that points to me that they really don't have
a good handle on this VISCA control. When talking to Jim in their Tech support
( he is the one you will want to talk to if you ever need help ), he said it
mattered how many Vdecks were in the system. He stated that the tests were for
just one deck. He also stated that someone else had called in with a 3 Vdeck
system and that his edits were off even more than mine with the shipped driver.
Simple cut edits are just entered by pressing the return key at the desired in
and out points. ( Why they don't also have the option of just clicking the
mouse in the IN and OUT window I don't know). Anything more than that requires
Script writing.
Ex: of a toaster transition with a TREXX pro script..
Player A In
00:04:24:10
Amiga:Arexxscript(dh2:Trexx/trans1.rexx)
Player A
Out
00:05:00:13
Line by line the story goes.
I've really gotten winded hear. It certainly does a lot for the money. But I
wouldn't call it a professional program. And you are not really paying that
kind of money anyway. There is another fellow here who uses MediaEditor long
before I got it and it would be good to talk to him too. His name is Tom
Wheeler. Drop him a line. His user # is 73766,3644.
If you are serious about the MediaEditor program. I would be willing to sell
it to you for a lot less than $400. Drop me an E-mail. I doubt if there is
another program that gives you as much control for anywhere near the money.
But, you must learn to have patience. And they do try to improve it. When I
first bought it last summer it was version 3.8.2 now it is up to 3.9.8 All they
ask for the upgraded disks is to return your old ones. They don't even ask for
shipping. They really are a very generous company.
BTW, I am selling because it is a little too slow for me now that I have a
customer who expects results a little faster than I can churn them out with
MediaEditor. I would be selling the MediaEditor Utilities program and Manual
only, which I believe is all you need, except for a Serial cable maybe to a
Visca port. You shouldn't need any of their controllers.
Rocky (whew that was long)
"I do all this through VISCA but with your TR-700 you should be able to
use the RCTC also through CTL-L and a V-box. I know nothing about the JVC
deck but if it has CTL-L you could also use the V-box I guess."
I'd really like to avoid the extra expense of a VBox (besides, I heard
that Sony is dropping VISCA). I'll be using MP's CTRL-L adaptor plus 2
independant infrareds (their CTRL-L port only reads timecode- IR is needed
for control). The JVC will be controlled via its editing "swap" port.
The $400 expense that I anticipate is for MediaUtilities plus their CTRL-L
controller hardware ($150 ea.) plus two special IR controllers ($50 ea.).
"I still don't care a whole lot for the interface. The mode is 640 x 400
interlaced whether you like it or not. No options for low res."
When the Toaster is active, the whole Amiga system is forced into
interlace. So even if they used 640×200, it would still flicker.
"Sometimes the screen seems a little cluttered…"
Really? I would rather have it all on a super-scrollable workbench.
Perhaps I can substitute their VCR controls with my own CanDo program.
"If you want to shuttle you have to click forever on the mouse or use the
F9 and F10 function keys…"
Can't you use the deck's own shuttle? The Editor shouldn't mind bypassing
the program to shuttle if it is always monitoring the timecode.
Thanks for your long-winded reply. I'm looking for as many impressions as
people can provide. Thanks also for the reference to Tom. BTW- What are
you upgrading to?
-Chris
Chris ,
I've heard the rumor about Sony dropping Visca but never from anyone selling
it. The Vdeck I believe is still a pretty strong seller as the V-box. The V-box
could both send and receive your CTL-L commands. I would not want to mess with
an infrared device, even if just to keep the desktop clutter down. The V-box
goes mail order for $209 so it's right in the ball park for their CTl-L and
infrared receiver combo.
Yes the scrollable screen works out ok. I just don't see any need to have so
many lines of the EDL present on the screen at one time. One complete edit
shouldn't take more that 4 to 6 lines.
>> So even if they used 640×200, it would still flicker. <<
No, it doesn't and No it wouldn't.
Use -> Run >nil: laceset
I can't use the decks shuttle knob because it doesn't have one. The only thing
I dislike about the Vdeck. Besides it is supposed to be a computer controlled
editor.
As I say I don't dislike the program I probably want too much out of it for
the price it goes for.
I believe I'll be going all the way to VideoMedia's OZ program. Not sure yet.
It is expensive but if I'm going to upgrade at all I'm not going to just take
another little step.
Good luck,
Rocky
" >> So even if they used 640×200, it would still flicker. <<
No, it doesn't and No it wouldn't."
It looks like interlace flicker to me. Slightly less, but not enough to
justify the small screen. Setlace can't override the Toaster-imposed
interlace.
You may be right about the Vbox, if I can get it for that much. But only
as long as I could forgo the MP2.0S (LANCS) interface as well as the IR
interfaces. I don't quite understand what peoples' aversion to infrered is
for editing; I think it has a rep. for being inaccurate because it is
associated with "point and shoot" editing by hand, or with editors that
don't support timecode.
-Chris
Chris,
Ah, finally I get to help someone. :->
This was passed on to me by John Gross. You can also find it in his column
from the June/July 1993 issue of VTU. His column is reason enough alone to
subscribe.
Yes the Toaster does put the Amiga system into interlace. However, included
with the Toaster software is a program called "LaceSet". This is not the Amiga
Setlace program.
Either open a cli or include it in your startup sequence.
run >nil: {path}laceset
Believe me it does get rid of the Toaster interlace. No more flicker on lo-res
screens.
I have no aversion to infrared devices. They probably do work as well. I used
one long ago with VideoDirector before I got my Vbox to control my Sony R5UC
(Which incidentally is not a Visca device but has a control L port).
What I didn't like was having another cable and device in my way on the
desktop. It plugged into the mouseport and had to be pointed (and fixed in
place somehow) at the VTR. I just find the one cable going from the computer
serial port to my VISCA chain much less cumbersome.
Difference of opinion is all.
As to whether Sony drops the VISCA (who cares) . Maybe it didn't reach every
household with an editing VCR and so they'll scrap it.
These very well known edit controllers already support the interface.
Interactive Microsystems
TAO
RGB AMilink CIP
Future Video
ABBAte Video Toolkit
VISCA is control L with a little improvement. Why go back to just CTL-L.
I have a Sony TR-101 which is recently reported as out of production. I
believe it will serve me just fine for a few more years.
Incidenally I was off a little on the price of the V-box. It was from
Computability and was $219 delivered. The V-box is about 5" x 7" and weighs
about a pound. It's shortcoming to me is that it uses an electrical plug based
transformer/converter . Only problem here is that they usually block the
adjacent plug in a suppressor.
I assume then that your JVC VTR has CTL-L. That is all the V-box needs to send
and receive.
Lastly let me say that I do not mean to imply that the V-box would work better
than the other setup. I have never used the Mediaphile controllers so I cannot
do that. Ask them. They should be honest in telling you which works better or
if they're equal. But ask to talk to "Jim" . He is the real tech person there.
I got your note on Tom Wheeler. I did a search and I guess he no longer
belongs to Compuserve. He was going on a trip some time ago. Maybe he suspended
his membership until he returns.
Anyone else know of Tom's whereabouts.. ?
Take care Chris ,
Rocky
" Believe me it does get rid of the Toaster interlace. No more flicker on
lo-res screens."
Ah. Thanks for the tip. I wonder if it will also allow me to switch back
to DBLNTSC for those long LW Modeler sessions.
I was looking into the VBox and just came into a bit of info that it can
only handle one LANCS/CTRL-L device. Is this true?? I need to control two
TR-700s. The JVC will be the record deck and is not a CTRL-L device (it
will be controlled by IR or JVC edit port).
-Chris
Chris,
Yes that is true . You need one V-box for each device. The interface runs from
the serial port to the first V-box and then from that V-box to the next. You
can chain up to 7 in all.
I only use the one because I only have the one non-Visca port SonyR5.
The V-decks have the Visca port built in. The V-box adds the visca port to
Ctl-l devices.
Sorry, Thought you were familiar with that..
Don't know about the DBLNTSC I never tried it.
Rocky
What do you use to link the VBox to the Amiga? A standard 25pin serial
cable with a 25->9 pin adapter? Or is a special cable needed?
Here are my options so far:
Option 1 Option 2
VBox 1 200 MP2.0S 150
VBox 2 200 IR 50
IR 50
MP Util. 150 MP Util. 150
——— ———
550 400
Realistically, I wonder which setup would perform better?
-Chris
Hi again, JVC decks do not suupport ControL. It's part of the big war that JVC
and Sony have going. Gary
Jerry,
I am still here on on CIS just about everynight. I still remain a serious
user of MediaEditor and find that for me as an amateur it meets my needs
quite well. I use it in an A/B roll setup now with two Sony EV-S7000 Hi-8
editing decks which are really great.
Unfortunately, my big problem right now is not MediaEditor but the fact
that my one year old Amiga 4000 has completely died. It will not boot up
and produces only a black screen although I can hear the fan running. My
dealer has had it over a week. He has called all over the country trying
to find someone who will even accept an Amiga 4000 for repairs. No one
has parts. SMG will not even accept the computer since they have no parts
available. I am very close to abandoning the Amiga platform entirely
because of this situation. It just seem to have no future. I regret this
very much because I have truly loved the computer and its capabilities,
but without parts or anyone willing to even accept it for repair it is
just a paper weight.
Tom
Tom;
I'd be interested to hear how you like the MediaPhile system.
How do you keep from losing all your configuration preferences when you
update with a new version??
thanks OB
Best regards;Fm "OB" O'Brien on autopilot
ScubaCam Underwater Video Productions
GE,
I used to worry about that too. However, now the only thing I do is go in and
save all my Scripts to another directory. I used to save my altered Config and
Device files but found that to be useless.
The changes in the software often bring changes to the way it handles your
device. That is the case for me anyway. I have seen the device file for my
Vdeck StartRecordOffset go from 43 to 20 to 36 frames. So now I just save my
scripts. Even those get affected some since this last change. Now old scripts
with script commands or statements end up having 00:00:00:00 put into all
adjacent In and OUT point windows. At least those can be edited out simple
enough with a text editor.
Rocky
GE,
I like the MediaPhile system very much in its present version. Actually I
am using version 3.9.3 which is not the latest version but is about 3-4
months old. This version of MediaEditor is very stable and works
beautifully with my two Sony EV-S7000's. Newer versions of the program
just offer new device files which I have no need for so I have not ordered
and installed them. I also like the ease with which A/B rolls integrating
Toaster transitions can be done with MediaEditor. I, too, use T-Rexx Pro
to write the scripts that control all Toaster functions. It is easy and
quick to both write the scripts and incorporate them into the EDL. In my
opinion, the MediaEditor program affords excellent dollar value as an
editing system *if you already have an Amiga*. Given the current state of
Commodore and my own complete inability to find any dealer who will even
accept an Amiga 4000 for repair at this time, I cannot recommend to anyone
that they purchase an Amiga (at least an A4000) for editing.
In terms of keeping your configuration preferences, I don't find this to
be a problem at all. I have learned the 4-5 files that I must save off to
a floppy before updating to a new version of MediaEditor. I just install
the new version, add these files to the appropriate directories, and begin
editing again. One word of warning. The MediaEditor program and the
MediaPhile utilities do have a learning curve. You will probably not be
able to install the software and begin editing with A/B rolls and Toaster
transitions all in one evening. The program has improved remarkably over
the three years I have been using it, but it requires studying the
manuals, having some patience, and thinking about what you are doing to
set it up and run it properly. Bottom line: in my opinion it represents
an excellent program for amateur editing with the Toaster. Low volume
business productions will also probably work well with MediaEditor. I
would not recommend it for high volume professional editing work.
Tom
"I use it in an A/B roll setup now with two Sony EV-S7000 Hi-8 editing
decks which are really great."
Hi Thomas,
You have almost EXACTLY the setup I need to hear about. Questions follow!
How are the 7000's being controlled? Via an MP2.0S (Control-L/LANCS) or
through a VISCA/Vbox setup? If you're using the MP interface for LANCS
(which can only read timecode and can't control the decks) how are the
decks controlled: Infrared or Control-S?
I'm sorry to hear about your 4000. I hope you did have have a Toaster in
it: Being cut off like that from my Toaster would really scare me. If you
are willing to sell your MediaPhile setup at some point, please let me
know because I'm in the market for one, which is why I'm asking so many
questions.
-Chris
Christopher,
I use a MediaPhile 2.0 controller purchased about three years ago with
MediaEditor. This is an infrared controller that works great with my two
EV-S7000 source decks and my Panasonic AG-1960 recording deck since all
three operate on different IR command frequencies. This is essential in
an A/B roll setup where infrared control is used. My accuracy with these
source decks is about 3-5 frames using RC time code. I have checked this
accuracy a number of times using a window dubbed tape in my two source
machines and comparing the actual edit in and out points on the recorded
tape with the time code edit in and out points entered into the Edit
Decision List. This accuracy is probably more a reflection of the
consumer VCR equipment being used than a reflection of any error in the
MediaPhile editing software/hardware and is quite sufficient for my
purposes which do not ivolve lip sychronization. Time code is brought into
the controller via the Ctrl-L ports on both source decks. Time code is of
course not used or required with the recording deck, the Panasonic
AG-1960. Don't have any fears about IR control of your source decks. I
find that it works *very* reliably and has never been a problem as long as
all three decks are on different IR command modes.
Yes, the sudden demise of my less than one year old A4000 is a serious
blow. My dealer has called over 20 repair centers and has not been able to
find even one that will take the A4000 for repair. None have any parts
available and most have no expectation of getting parts in the foreseeable
future. Fortunately my A2000 is still working. If I am not able to get
the A4000 repaired I will continue to do editing with MediaEditor on the
A2000, sell the A4000 and Toaster 4000 for any price I can get, and
eventually build up an editing/animation system that is PC based. My love
of the Amiga is deep, but I think I have finally discovered the reality of
the real situation the Amiga platform is in, i.e. Amigas are great as long
as they work but God help you if a hardware problem develops.
Tom
Tom,
Hi. I was wondering where you were . I had referred Chris to you for some
points on MediaEditor.
Do you believe they're up to 3.9.8 now. It sure hasn't crashed on me in a
while anyway.
Did you change your ID #. I had a different suffix than your current one.
How was the vacation.
Rocky
Rocky,
Good to chat with you again. I tried to answer Chris' questions on
MediaEditor (see my message to Chris). I am still using version 3.9.3 of
MediaEditor simply because I have found it to be rock stable and the only
new additions in latter versions that I am aware of are simply the
addition of device files that I have no need for. I found that my device
files for my Sony 801 and Sony EV-S3000 decks work fine with my EV-S7000
source decks and I have not even bothered to change them or optimize their
accuracy. I get an accuracy of about 3-5 frames on edit in and out points
and this is quite sufficient for my purposes.
No I have not changed my I.D. number. I am not sure why you would have a
different suffix.
Our one week vacation in Colorado was just great. Due to the sudden
demise of my A4000 where my Toaster 4000 and TBC's were installed I have
not been able to finish my Alaska video much less get on to editing the 4
hours of video shot in the Colorado Rockies on this last vacation. The
Commodore situation and the collapse of my Amiga 4000 has caused me to
cancel my order for a Flyer and to begin the process of converting to a PC
based system. This is not a prospect that I relish, but no matter how
much I like the Amiga, I cannot wish away the present problems the
platform has. I'll continue working for a while on my A2000 and probably
sell my A4000/Toaster 4000 system for whatever I can get for it.
How about letting me hear about your latest video adventures.
Tom
Tom,
I suppose your dealer thought of this, but I'll mention it just in
case. I used to be an Amiga service tech, and I've seen a fair number of
4000's that were prone to flakiness due to connection problems. You should
try reseating all of the cards & socketed chips in the machine. Especially
the CPU card and expansion slot daughterboard. You don't need to pull them
completely out, just make sure they're seated completely. It might be
worth a shot….
Jim
Jim,
Thanks very much for the suggestion. I'll try your suggestion. I don't
know whether my dealer has tried reseating the cards and chips or not. He
has had the computer for almost two weeks. Today I called him three times
just trying to find out if he had ever been able to find anywhere to get
the computer repaired. He never returned my phone calls. Such a
different case from when I was buying all this equipment from him only a
year ago. Then my phone was ringing off the hook. That's the way it
goes. Again thanks for the help.
Tom
Hi Rocky, I've been using the V-Deck for about a year, and like it very much. I
discovered that it will resond to commands from a Sony VCR remote control (set
to deviice two). I have one witha jog shuttle and it works fine on the
V-deck.(not to mention all the other missing controls, like counter reset,
etc.) Gary
Gary,
That little tidbit of advice you just passed along has eluded me for the last
18 months. I almost considered sending you more money for our last transaction,
though that thought quickly faded.
Yes I now have shuttle control of my Vdeck. Using the Sony R5 set to device 2.
I had forgotten all about the different command modes of the R5. Of course I
don't use it outside of my small time edit suite.
Gosh this has really made my day.
Thank you , and Thank you and Thank you….
Twas easily worth a few months subscription here to me. !!!
How do you use your V-deck. What editing software if any.
I currently use 2 with MediaEditor but am slowly losing the accuracy I know
they are capable of with their program.
Rocky
Gary;
Please tell me how long you have been using MediaEditor, what version
you have , how accurate it is and how you like it.
I have ver 3.8.8, edit from HI-8 to Hi-8, use SMPTE with No Stops and
am not happy with its accuracy. I don't think its very user friendly
and am looking for something better. Would appreciate any inputs on this.
Best regards;Fm "OB" O'Brien on autopilot
ScubaCam Underwater Video Productions
"I have ver 3.8.8, edit from HI-8 to Hi-8, use SMPTE with No Stops…"
SMPTE is a little odd for Hi8, isn't it? You've made me curious: What
decks and MediaPhile-interface hardware are you using? You're not putting
SMPTE on the audio tracks, are you? I didn't think that should be done
with helical-scan audio, only linear audio such as the VHS mono track.
-Chris
Chris;
Im using a sony EVS-3000 as a source deck. Most of the Sony 8mm and
Hi-8 decks have two tracks of standard Hi-Fi audio and two tracks of PCM
audio. The Hardware is a MediaPhile MP2.0S with the SMPTE upgrade. The
controller uses the hard wire Control-S protocol to control most
everything in my set-up.
The way it is used is you fire up the Time code program that comes with
MediaEditor and stripe the SMPTE onto the PCM Audio track with audio dub.
After that, you rewind the tape, select no-stops (the VCR never goes into
a stop, it runs in pause, they say it keeps the tape from streching very
much as you jog back and forth) and build your SMPTE corrected EDL.
Then when you run the final edit, the program switches over to the PCM
track, reads the recorded SMPTE frame location during the pre-roll,finds
thedesired frame location, then switches back to the Hi-Fi tracks and
makes the edit buy bringing the record VCR out of Pause/Record, into
record.
There is also a company in Calif (Carlson-Strand)that provides a kit to
modify prosumer decks to play PCM audio while in jog mode. It adds two
more inputs and outputs to the decks. Neat huh!
Hope this helps.
Best regards;Fm "OB" O'Brien on autopilot
ScubaCam Underwater Video Productions
GE, I am not using the Media editor. I got the V-Deck for Hi-8 playback, and I
have been developing VISCA software for the Amiga, though it's coming along
quite slowly. Gary
Rocky, Yeah, I just discovered that mysekf about a month ago.. quite by
accident of course……glad to make your day. (try not to second guess any
generous impuses in the future <g> ) Gary
Lucky I didn't forward that extra $$. Though it still was a welcome
surprise, my joy was dampened when I realized that under the VISCA
control on the VDeck (the little VISCA lite shining brightly on the
front) all other control is locked out.
So while editing I still cannot use the remote or even the decks
standard front buttons. Sigh.
Strange my R5 when controlled via Visca and a V-box doesn't behave
like this. I can use the jog/shuttle on it.
So you're developing VISCA software huh ? I'd be interested in
hearing about it. I've seen these roomers that Sony is dropping it
but I wouldn't know why. It seems like a cheap solution to give
great results with inexpensive (relatively) decks like the CVD1000.
Rocky, Where have you seen these rumors about SONY droppind VISCA. I am a
registered VISCA developer, and have not heard about this. Gary
Jerry; A while back you mentioned you were looking for another editing
system. Me too. Let me know what you have found out and which one your
heading towards… OK
Thanks
"OB" O'Brien
ScubaCam Underwater Video Productions