#Grolier
36 messages in this thread
Here I am again with the same question: has anyone received the latest
Grolier update?? They did [finally] cash the check about a month ago but I
still haven't gotten a disk and they ignore correspondence about this.
Advice?
Cheryl
Cheryl, Here I am again, responding to your message, "Where's Grolier?"
Well, I too have been waiting for several months for the encyclopedia
upgrade. Surprisingly, I saw a vendor selling the new Groliers at a
Computer Fair in NJ, bundled together with the new Time Compact Almanac for
$95.00! It was the DOS version, though, not the MPC version which I
ordered. I called Grolier directly in Connecticut and they said that the
MPC version was the last to be released and that it would ship at the end
of September or beginning of October. Well, here we are. Hopefully we'll
see it any day now. -Dwight
I happen to own the Time Almanac. I thought they would upgrade periodically
but, if they do, they haven't told me. It isn't that great, only goes back
about 10 years and then sort of condenses everything before then. It's not
that great for research. I sort of thought I would be able to pull up major
information about, say, 1946.
I don't even know what I ordered but probably DOS as I have my CD-ROM
attached to a 5.5 year old 286 with a serious memory shortage. I do have
color and sound though. If MPC requires Windows I definitely didn't order
it. Regardless, the UPS man stops here almost every day and the Federal
Express woman is here at least once a week. I haven't seen anything yet.
Maybe I'll try to call them. I am reluctant because I tried in the summer
to the tune of about $8 to AT & T and never spoke to a human. You,
obviously, have better luck.
Thanks for the info.
Cheryl
Yes they do upgrade but at a very high price. Give them a call and see. If
you just want to buy a later edition, leave me an Email, since we stock
their products, (for resale not upgrade). Frank Harris Computron, Ltd.
Are we talking about Time here? Actually, I don't think it is a very good
CD. It could be but they didn't do it right. If we are talking about
something else let me know.
Do you have a catalog of CDs?
Cheryl
I am sure that I was not talking about TIME. I think I was discussing
Groliers Encyclopedia. As to a catalog, please leave email for a copy. Due
out on the 19th. Frank Harris Computron, Ltd.
Dwight,
I'm new to CD-ROM's so could I ask you a couple questions.
1. What is MPC?
2. I am thinking of purchasing a drive and Groliers. What is your
understanding of how one can get upgrades and how often to they come out.
This is assuming that Grolier actually upgrades as you were lead to
believe.
..Andrew
MPC = multi-media PC standard … just the minimum system requirements to
have a multimedia compatible pc.
Andrew, MPC stands for MultiMedia PC. It's a standard set by Microsoft and
several other hardware manufacturers and has certain minimum hardware and
software requirements, one of which is Windows 3.1. Many CDROM titles are
available in both DOS and MPC versions. Generally, I have found that the
MPC versions are enhanced so far as full motion video and sound are
concerned. That is not to say that there aren't some excellent DOS based
titles. Grolier first put their encyclopedia on CDROM 2 years ago and has
been widely accepted. They are just now coming out with an MPC version for
the first time which should contain much more full motion video than the
DOS version. It's sort of like watching a movie on your computer screen.
They send out upgrade notices each year about 6 months before the product
is actually available. One tends to get impatient waiting to receive the
upgrade but it has been worth it in the end- and the upgrade price is fair.
I am using the MediaVision-NEC Multimedia upgrade kit and am very
satisfied. I suggest you visit the Multiven forum for more info.
-Dwight
Dwight,
Thanks for the information. I think I have an old PC magazine with an
article on multimedia so maybe I should see if the requirements are listed
there. I'll also check out the multimedia forum.
I guess the writing is on the wall and some day I will be forced to use
Windows. I just hope Microsoft develops Windows to the point where the
keyboard can be used to navigate programs without having to look at the
screen, and with the same efficiency of keystrokes I can with most DOS
applications.
BTW, what is the upgrade price for Groliers Encyclopedia?
…Andrew
Andrew, The price of the Grolier's upgrade is around $100. You should
consider going to Windows MultiMedia because more and more of the better
CD's simply won't run without it.
-Dwight-
Dwight,
Thanks for the information about Groliers.
I'd love to get a full multi-media system but I have never been able to
afford being an early adapter. Too often the standards change and what
seems like the next generation is sometimes a dead-end road. I would just
like to see the standards settle in a little more before I go this route.
This has worked for me with computer hardware/software and I'm assuming it
works for CD technology as well. OTOH, I am not completely ruling it out
because multi-media sure looks like fun.
..Andrew
Sorry to disappoint you but the Multimedia Marketing Council is who set the
specs for MPC. For the record Windows is not a prerequisited for
multimedia, and as a matter of fact the new Groliers 5.0 muultimedia
version is available DOS, MAC or Windows and is full Multimedia. We sell it
for $99 at our office. Frank Harris
Frank, excuse me for jumping in here. Could you give me more info on the
Grolier's 5.0 multimedia version? I write about CD-ROM and am supposed to
know about these things but getting info about Grolier's up here in Canada
isn't easy.
Also my personal edition of the encyclopedia was an OEM bundled with a
Magnavox so I've seen nothing of upgrade notices etc.
However I do know the difference between generic multimedia, MPC and MPG
etc. However any info you can give me on the disc you are describing would
be of assistance — for instance I assume you are talking about a newer
version with limited animation and not simply the text/graphics/audio
version of old.
I really would appreciate any assistance as I'm going to have to
button-hole the company at COMDEX and would like to be able to ask
reasonable questions (for a change <G>).
Be glad to if you can reask me around Wednesday… UNfortunately, I just
got it in, and really have not looked into it in it's entirety, but will on
Tuesday. Frank Harris Computron, Ltd.
->>
…the new Groliers 5.0 muultimedia version is available DOS, MAC or
Windows and is full Multimedia. We sell it for $99 at our office.
->>
Frank,
Did I read this right? I just bought the 1991 Mac version of the Grolier
Electronic Encyclopedia for $77, and I thought that was a very aggressive
price. You sell the brand new, just out, 1992 Mac MultiMedia version for
$99? The one that lists for $395?
Steve
Can you send me a catalog of the CDROM's you sell for DOS/Windows? My fax
number is 908-254-0235 or you can mail it to me at 36 Van Pelt Court East
Brunswick NJ 08816 Steve
"Can you send me a catalog of the CDROM's you sell for DOS/Windows? My fax
number is 908-254-0235 or you can mail it to me at 36 Van Pelt Court East
Brunswick NJ 08816 Steve"
Steve,
You sent this request to the wrong address– I don't sell CD-ROMs. -Steve
Yes that is the one. Just released and we don't rip people off. I make a
fair profit, not an exorbitant one. Put it on your credit card and as you
know your satisfaction will then be guaranteed, (or call one of the 600
schools that we sell to all the time.) Frank
Please send me a catalog of your CDROM titles. You can fax it to me at
908-254-0235, or mail to 36 Van Pelt Court, East Brunswick NJ 08816 Thanks,
Steve
I'd like your CD-ROM catalog also:
CHUCK EGLINTON ELECTRONIC TECHNOLOGIES 3985 S ROCHESTER RD STE H ROCHESTER
MI 48307
Frank, Who do you think comprised the MultiMedia Marketing Council? Also,
there certainly are differences (enhancements) in the MPC version over the
DOS version i.e. animations of the solar system, weather and the human
body. Why aren't these found in the DOS version if it is truly MultiMedia?
-Dwight
May I quickly jump in here, Dwight. Multimedia is something of a generic
term. In its simplest form it simply means more than one medium — ie: any
combination of text, graphics, audio, animation etc.
Games have been "multimedia" ever since the first that added bings and
bongs to whatever else was happening on the screen.
MPC is a registered trademark of the Multimedia PC Marketing Council Inc.
and was originally established by Microsoft -which obviously wanted Windows
to be an integral part of future "multimedia" products.
The cost of registering products with the Multimedia PC Marketing Council
is substantial, whether hardware or software. Some manufacturers don't wish
to spend their money that way, same with many disc publishers — especially
those with products that do not require Windows.
But their products still are "multimedia." Cheers!
There are over three hundred members of the MPC Marketing Council. I know
because we are one of them. For the record MOST of the title that we carry
are MULTIMEDIA DOS not MULTIMEDIA WINDOWS. That is out of over tfive
hundred titles. Frank
Frank, Thanks for clearing this MPC stuff up for me. But, I still don't
understand one thing. If a particular program is available in both a DOS
and a Windows MPC version, why is the Windows MPC version always more
elaborate with more animations and sounds?
-Dwight
Windows is a graphical environment and DOS is not. I also must take issue
wiht the word "all" even though in most instances it is the case. However
there are a large number of non windows MPC titles that feature animation
graohics etc. A great example would be Sherlock Holmes Consulting
Detective. Frank
Frank,
You have just cleared up an area of confusion for me about multi-media and
if you could clear up a couple more I would be grateful.
1. Does DOS (ie. non-windows) multi-media *require* special sound cards,
does it just sound better with them, or is it different from product to
product?
2. Does DOS multi-media that has animation require a fairly quick CD drive
to work right, is it like much of the game-software animation that seems to
be designed around the limiations of having to wait for drive accesses, or
does it differ from product to product?
..Andrew
Product to product differences do occur however MOST cases do require a
sound card. 2. MPC standards quote a minimum access of 1000 milliseconds
(one second) access time. They also require a minimum throughput of 100 kb
per second. A number of the slower drive manufacturers are using cache
similiar to HD cache and MB caching to achieve significant results greater
than the above. Far greater numbers of our customers purchase the MItsumi
600ms 155 kb drive than all others combined and we have yet to receive a
single complaint with over three hundred and seventy five already sold.
Frank
Slight correction: MPC specs require "…sustained 150k/sec transfer rate
without consuming more than 40 per cent of CPU bandwidth in the process,
and average seek time of 1 second or less."
Source: several MPC brochures and press releases. Cheers!
Thanks … That's what happens when you try to answer these questions at
3:30 AM. Frank
There are two good examples of DOS multimedia products which illustrate the
combination of text, graphics, animation, and sound- National Geographics
"Mammals: A Multimedia Encyclopedia" and "The Presidents: It All Started
With George." Both of these were developed using IBM LinkWay 2.01, using
IBM Photomotion for the movies.
Mammals uses "Red-book" audio. played directly from the CD through the
CD-ROM drive's sound outputs, Presidents uses digitized sound played
through a sound card. Both techniques are used on various products. The
digitized form has some advantages – for example, digital audio files can
be transmitted over a network. Redbook audio requires no sound card,
however.
The Photomotion movie format requires the transfer of between 80K-120K of
data per second typically. Some movies are more compressed than others,
but this is typical. Mammals has been on the market for over two years,
using an early version of Photomotion which did not allow synchronized
sound. Presidents uses sound with the movies. TIME Almanac, and the
Groliers MM Encyclopedia and several other products also use IBM
PhotoMotion for their movies.
I recently did a Photomotion movie of an airplane landing which lasted
about 12 seconds – the file size was 89K. This compression is achieved
because the frame contents did not change significantly over the 12 seconds
time. This would require a CD-ROM drive capable of about 8K/second. I
also recently did another movie of about 12 seconds of elk grazing near a
running river – taking about 940K to store the movie. With more action and
changes in the frame the storage goes up and the data transfer rate
required for the playback also goes up.
Animations with drawn graphics rather than captured video are typically
nuch smaller in file size and data transfer required, so animations such as
those done from drawn graphics using Autodesk Animator or other animations
are typically smaller in file size and work well of CD.
Larry
Larry:
Did you use IBM's tools to do the Photomotion processing/compression
yourself, or did you hire a service bureau. What was the experience like?
Ordered mine months ago as well…haven't seen or heard a thing.
I find Grolier's business practises to be, at best, questionable. I had
thought they were a reputable company but I may have been wrong.
The Postmaster did say I was solicitate by mail and ordered by mail so I
could file a complaint. I keep thinking if they have to spend time
responding to complaints they'll never get the update out!
Cheryl
Cheryl-
Having been involved with CD-Rom…MPC…for about a year I am finding it
to be a common practice of some CD producers to begin advertising for
products that are not ready for distribution for up to 6 to 8 months! I
don't like it either…but I am hooked on the media. What can we do. Use
the programs we have and wait. Happy computing. Have you tried World
Vista? I just bought it. Great Program…not too expensive – very
interesting. Keep in touch.
Ken, this is my third upgrade on Grolier and this is the first time they've
pulled this nonsense. I personally feel four months is a scam. When you
consider they called my house in June and said it would be shipping out
immediately and could they have a street address [I then lived in Illinois
and used a PO box for mail] it is even crazier.
What is World Vista? Most of my CDs are reference – great literature,
birds, mammals, Shakespeare, Monarch Notes [where was this when I was in
school??] – that sort of thing.
I am buying a new computer and will want to buy a new CD-ROM drive [faster,
etc.], leaving the old one to handle the reference. Any suggestions?
Cheryl