CompuServe Thread

A1200 Hard Drives

39 messages in this thread
#84027From: Shane WestphalenJan 6, 1993 10:17 AM
What is the difference between the 2.5" & 3.5" IDE drives? Is it more than just physical dimensions? Do they have different power consumption rates or require different cabling? Always curious…. Shane – via Whap!
#84200From: Don Curtis/SYSOPJan 8, 1993 12:46 AM
Shane, The differences between 2.5" drives and 3.5" drives is similar to the differences between 5.25" drives and 3.5" drives. Everything about them is smaller. They are inherently faster (all else being equal) because things don't have to move as far to get from one point to another. They inherently use less power because there's not as much work to do…less mass for the motor to spin, etc. They generally have a higher recording density…that is…fit more data in the same physical area than bigger drives. And of course, they're more expensive…because they're the latest and greatest. As an example…sitting beside me is a 5.25" 150 Meg HD…one of the better ones. It probably weights about 8 pounds or so. In my NCR notebook computer, I've got a 2.5" 120 Meg drive. The whole computer…battery and all only weights about 6 pounds. The HD itself probably is probably less than a pound. The move to smaller drives is just a matter of technology moving forward, just as what used to fill a whole room, now can sit on your desktop…or your laptop for that matter. Don
#84484From: Shane WestphalenJan 9, 1993 10:54 PM
Thanks for the info. Don. Does this mean that a 3.5" IDE hard drive could be used in the new A1200 despite the increased size. Would it perhaps need to be externally mounted? Or, is there formatting, etc. differences that would cause the operating system to not recognize it or work properly with it? Thanks, Shane
#84513From: Don Curtis/SYSOPJan 10, 1993 1:10 AM
Shane, I would presume a 3.5" IDE drive would work in an A1200…but I also understand it would have to be externally mounted because there's not enough room for a 3.5" drive inside. However, I do not know for sure that it will work as I've not tried it nor have I heard of anyone else doing it. Don
#84575From: Denny Atkin [COMPUTE/AmiJan 10, 1993 1:16 PM
Don, I believe that there's a problem with long (More than a couple of inches) IDE cables that will prevent you from using external IDE hard drives with the A1200. About the only solution I can think of for using a 3.5" drive, if it's one of the really thin ones, would be to put it where the internal floppy normally goes. 3.0 will let you boot from DF1. …
#84732From: karl mitschkeJan 11, 1993 4:45 PM
Denny; We use foot long IDE cables in our Clone PC's…. Should be able to go at least that far in an A1200.. No? Or, is there a problem with Commodores IDE controller? I plan to put an A1200 on my desk soon, and plan to use an external IDE 3.5" drive…. Hope it works! Karl
#84745From: Denny Atkin [COMPUTE/AmiJan 11, 1993 9:06 PM
Karl, It has to do with the IDE implementation in the A1200. Sorry, I don't know the technical details, I've just heard the Commodore engineers say the cables need to be really short.
#84773From: karl mitschkeJan 12, 1993 1:13 AM
Great, Commodore blows another one! Seems like C= needs to do some serious work internally. A4000's that can't accept full size drives in internal drive bays… A1200's that can't drive an IDE signal furthar than a few inches,…. And, they fine folks in marketing bring the A1200 out WAY too late for Christmas. Typical Commodore job, it seems…. I guess I will stick with the A2000 till it dies, and then will toss it, and focus on IBM compatables. Now, before anyone starts telling me about how wonderfull Amigas are, or how technically surpior, let me jus say, I know! But, as the owner of an Edsel, I know that technical superiority, combined with mediocre quality controll (either because of lack of care, or because the product is built in someone else's factory), combined with non-existant marketing will kill products. I plan to be off the Amiga before Commodore sinks. <sigh> Karl
#84857From: Mark D. ManesJan 13, 1993 1:04 AM
Karl, At the risk of hearing someone tell me that I am just a Commodore cheerleader I am going to respond to your posting. I have seen several postings that say you can get a Syquest and CD ROM drive in the A4000. I have seen some that say they can't get their particular unit to fit. It may mean that Commodore has adhered to a standard drive bay that is not as standard as we would like. I do think that it would be nice to have had the A1200 out before Christmas. In fact, we did have several units before Christmas, but not enough to meet demand. I am sure Commodore wanted with all of their heart to have the A1200 in dealer hands before Christmas. Things take time, and wanting something to happen doesn't always make it possible. There are many factors out of the control of the US sales company. I can tell you this they honestly did try to make it before Christmas. I am not going to tell you how Amigas are superior — you know that. What I am going to tell you is that Commodore is not the pack of fools you think they are. The line 'typical Commodore job' is a tired cliche'. -mark=
#85026From: pat beaulieuJan 14, 1993 11:36 AM
Syquest drive does not fit correctly inside the A4000 it the 50 pins data connector is hooked to the drive it looks that C= went to close to the 5"1/4 specification in designing the A4000 bay and forgot that there is a 5 pins connector that goes in the back of the drive. At least I was able to make mine fit by removing the grid that protect the fan of the power supply and by bending a little bit the fron of the machine but it was not really nice to see!
#85144From: daniel wolfJan 15, 1993 2:56 AM
I'm always amazed by people running down Commodore as a company. I wish I could put together a $1 BILLION company! I find it difficult to criticize those who're doing much much more than I could dream to – anyone who can sell $1Billion worth of computers per year can't possibly be a pack of fools. Perhaps they could do better, but how they run the show is up to the stockholders. All you critics out there – put your money where your mouth is and buy a couple million CBU shares and then YOU can be charge of Commodore!. The A1200 is a delightful product and generating HUGE interest in my little community of 60,000 people.
#84927From: charlie badalatiJan 13, 1993 4:34 PM
Actually Karl, C= didn't have to have the A1200 out in time for Christmas. In Aachen, Germany the HORTONS department store sold out their supply of 40 in only 3 days. Other high-volume stores have a display model out but none left in stock. I would say the machine is a pretty hot seller over here. Then again maybe I'm too easily impressed :>). Charlie Badalati APing from Wurselen,Germany
#85107From: Edward SwatschekJan 14, 1993 10:32 PM
> A1200's that can't drive an IDE signal furthar than a few inches Remember that the 1200's IDE interface was designed strictly for internal use; that anyone wanting an external drive was expected to use the trapdoor slot. =Edjs- Edward_Swatschek@mindlink.bc.ca
#85114From: Dave CinegeJan 14, 1993 10:56 PM
We'll see this weekend……I doubt that it will have any problem driving a signal about 1 foot AS LONG AS the drive does not draw it's power from the cable…..if you forgot what you have just said is a rumor and has never been tested. Dave Elite MicroComputers – via Whap!
#84646From: Shane WestphalenJan 10, 1993 11:06 PM
Don, Perhaps some experimentation is in order here. I am very curious to know if it will work and I guess I'll just have to try it. Perhaps my dealer will be curious as well!! I'll let you know what I found out when I've had a chance to set up this test. Thanks for your help. Shane – via Whap!
#84988From: Tom JonesJan 14, 1993 1:04 AM
Please take this with a lick of salt, but a correspondant in England assured me they have put 3.5" LPS low profile drives into the 1200 "by trimming the casework a bit". I lost his message in a corruption of my harddisks this week, unhappily. It does sound plausible, since they are very thin and use a lot less power than the normal ones. I am looking at a Quantum-Pro 52mb LPS right now and it is very thin. Anyone want to trade me a 2000 deinterlacer for it? (major grin).
#85005From: Tony MoriJan 14, 1993 4:24 AM
where's they get the SCSI I/F for the A1200? LPS are SCSI, no? you want to trade your A2000 deinterlacer for a 52MB Hard Disk? Tony
#85035From: Dave CinegeJan 14, 1993 12:50 PM
LPS designates 1" heigth. Dave Elite MicroComputers – via Whap!
#85106From: Edward SwatschekJan 14, 1993 10:32 PM
The LPSs come in both SCSI and IDE versions. =Edjs-
#85154From: daniel wolfJan 15, 1993 3:00 AM
Quantum LPS refers only to the 1 inch low profile form factor. These drives are available from Quantum in both IDE and SCSI (IDE ones seem to sell for $10 – $20 less than SCSI). Most of the drive manufacturers (at least Connor, Maxtor, and Quantum) have identical drives in IDE and SCSI available. Freedom of choice is a wonderful thing. There are even 2.5 inch SCSIs as well as IDEs.
#85350From: Tony MoriJan 16, 1993 8:07 PM
yeah….I have 7 maxtors, and (now) 1 Q. all my maxtor's are LXTxxx series i don't have any of the LoProfile Maxtor's yet (i've installed some, but don't own any yet.) well, 6 LXT maxtor's. the 7th is a PS-17S 1.7GB SCSI (5 1/4", full ht., SCSI-II) Tony
#85034From: Dave CinegeJan 14, 1993 12:50 PM
I just (FINALLY) recieved my A1200 yesterday and it does appear a 3.5×1" drive could fit in there if the case was trimmed….however a 4 pin power cable would also have to be added since the 2.5" drives get their power from the 40 pin cable. Dave Elite MicroComputers – via Whap!
#85087From: Dave CinegeJan 14, 1993 6:36 PM
No good on the before mentioned….tried fitting 3.5" dirve in and the keyboard lays on top of it. Not enough clearence. NOTE…..EMC is currently working on a kit to fit an external 3.5 HD on the A1200…I will be testing this weekend and if al goes well will be annoucing RETAIL pricing and availiblity sometime next week. Dave Elite MicroComputers – via Whap!
#85104From: Tony MoriJan 14, 1993 10:22 PM
If anyone needs a 60MB 2.5" IDE HD, I have one that's just sitting here gather- ing dust. i got it 'cuz my sister said she needed one, then the deal fell thru (her buying the PC) so, I gotta dump it. It also has the kit to use it on NORMAL IDE cables(ie, adapter that brings out the 4-pin power, ans std. 40-pin cable) looking to sell it for $180, just to get it outta here. I don't need it at all. My A2000 has SCSI's in it. The drive was bought new in oct. 27,1992, so it still has like 9-10 mos. of warranty on it. has 20 minutes of use, for testing, as this is the first one i've used. works great. BTW, it's a Western Digital TidBit-60 60MB IDE Tony
#85044From: Shane WestphalenJan 14, 1993 1:05 PM
Tom, Thanks for that information. If you find out more, please let me know. Shane – via Whap!
#85496From: Tony MoriJan 17, 1993 11:40 PM
<grinning back> wanna trade your de-interlacer for a 2.5" 60MB IDE Western Digital Hard disk? Darn thing is gathering dust here. bought in oct. 27th, used 20 minutes to test it. Still has like 9-10 mos. warranty left. Any interest? and, gee! ya don't have to experiment, 'cuz it's a 2.5" IDE! and it's 8MB more than what you're looking for! BTW, for all the other readers, power rating is 3.5Watts (5VDC @ .7A) drive is 1024x7x17spt 62.3MB Tony
#85520From: Mike SchillerJan 18, 1993 2:32 AM
Tony: If Tom isn't interested in that drive, I might be, give me a call. // -Mike Schiller \X/ AMIGA! On AutoPilot in sunny Fort Lauderdale
#86256From: Tom JonesJan 23, 1993 9:15 PM
That is interesting Toni, really. What system did you test it on? I don't have a 1200 (yet) but if this crate will fly on the Amiga 1200 I am very interested. Why are you selling it by the way? I have a microway flickerfixer I could trade for it. I am sure you appreciate the difficulty involved in even trades through the mail, but let me know if the drive will do what I want to do with it, I will be checking in later. Thanks for offering.
#86339From: Tony MoriJan 24, 1993 6:05 PM
What monitor does the MicroWay allow you to use? will it work with a superVGA monitor? Tony
#86388From: Mike SchillerJan 25, 1993 2:27 AM
Tony: Yes, the Flickerfixer should work with a SVGA monitor. It will definately work with one of your NEC multisync monitors. If you're gonna hookup a multisync monitor to it, another thing you could do is to hook one of them directly to the 23pin connector on your 2000 (C= has a 23 to 15 pin VGA adapter available), and use the productivity mode. It will let you have a 4 color WB that is flicker free. The only problem with that route would be that programs that open their own screen would still flicker, and if your multisync couldn't go down to 15.75khz then you'd be SOL. // -Mike Schiller \X/ AMIGA! On AutoPilot in sunny Fort Lauderdale
#86419From: Tom JonesJan 25, 1993 1:04 PM
It deinterlaces Amiga video and outputs interlaced 31.5khz VGA. I have not tried a SVGA monitor, whatever that is, but I assume they display VGA too?
#86450From: Tony MoriJan 25, 1993 9:08 PM
yup…they just have MORE, also….15-pin connector on the FF ? Tony
#85143From: daniel wolfJan 15, 1993 2:51 AM
Very important – the 2.5 inch drives are extremely low power (as little as 2-3 watts power usage) and 3.5 inchers are substantially higher. My A1200 power supply looks to be rated only about 20 watts so please, folks, be cautious about trying to ad a 3.5 incher IDE to a A1200 – you could be really limiting other expansion capabilities or even 'poof' the power supply.
#85142From: daniel wolfJan 15, 1993 2:49 AM
Hey, Don – Happy New Year – and GOOD NEWS! 2.5 inch HDs for A600/1200 ARE NOT more expensive than 3.5! I've got 'em priced either same or lower. I'm offering my A1200 customers to buy a A1200 sans HD and I'll put in a 85mB IDE 2.5 for $300. That gives the customer about double the drive for only a few bucks more than CBM is charging (i.e. the price difference between the A1200 empty and the A1200 with 40Mb HD). And I just put a 120mB in my A1200. This isn't meant to be commercial, just good news that prices on the 2.5 inch drives aren't necessarily higher than 3.5 SCSI. Also 250Mb 2.5 inchers are ON THE WAY! Love that 1200.
#85169From: Jonathan SchmidtJan 15, 1993 9:27 AM
Don, Toshiba already has a 2.5" 213MB drive. I ordered one and am waiting patiently. The specs are incredible! 12ms access. 6.5 MB transfer rate. 128k cache. Part number MK-2224FC. All I can say is WOW! I am salivating… / /_ /_/onathan __/chmidt – On AutoPilot from CompuServe Land
#85214From: Dave CinegeJan 15, 1993 8:05 PM
How much do you sell the 120MB for? Elite MicroComputers – via Whap!
#85494From: Christopher LapriseJan 17, 1993 11:08 PM
" I'm offering my A1200 customers to buy a A1200 sans HD and I'll put in a 85mB IDE 2.5 for $300." I wish our local dealer was as on the ball as you are. They had a 4000 for over 2 weeks, and didn't know about the 5.25" bay until we started asking about putting the CD-ROM in our 4000 (which we bought from them). -Chris
#84448From: Gary NushJan 9, 1993 7:44 PM
2.5" IDE drives also do not require a seperate power cable, the ribbon cable that connects the drive to the host also supplies power. I noticed the subject line in your message, and the 2.5" drives are also important for the A1200 since there is only enough room inside for a 2.5" drive' a 3.5" drive would not fit. -=*) Gary Nush (*=-
#84485From: Shane WestphalenJan 9, 1993 10:56 PM
Thanks Gary. Does this mean that a 3.5" drive could not be mounted externally then? Shane