#Amiga & Other Multimedia
34 messages in this thread
>> Send me some EMail if you care to talk any further.
We can keep this in public if you want to see if anyone else wishes
to contribute.
I was taking a course in MM development on the Mac which included
products like Photoshop, Illustrator, SoundEdit, Director, Premier,
CoSa AfterEffects and others. It was good to see how the other side
does it.
Although the products are more expensive than their Amiga Counterparts
I believe that in most of the cases the extra costs are justified. I
was impressed with the feature set, flexibility and professionalism
that they offered and I understood why the Amiga was not more widely
accepted as a professional platform.
Of course, the Amiga can still multitask circles around any other
mainstream system (for what it is worth).
I have done a few small projects on the Amiga (mainly AmigaVision) but
my biggest (and only paid one) was done on Windoze: a Kiosk
installation. What have you developed?
Andrew
ICAM — ActiveMedia Development / IICS "InforMedia" Newsletter Editor
Gliding in from Toronto on AutoPilot…
Andrew,
Glad you changed the topic – that was the main reason for my suggestion
about email, but I also figured not many would be interested.
Your exposure to the MAC prodcuts for MM development puts you in
the driver's seat in this discussion because I have no hands-on with
those products. Since you've stirred my interest, could you please
expand upon your comments that (usually) with the MAC products you
are more impressed with the feature set and flexibility? I have used
AVPro, SCALA, CanDo, and just started playing with HELM on the Amiga.
In my limited experience, flexibility has never been a problem (thank
you Bill for ARexx!) although feature sets among these packages vary.
Your professionalism observation goes unchallenged because I think
you are correct – probably a result of the size of the market
however.
Strangely enough, I strongly feel that good MM requires good
multitasking, unless of course one is happy to live within the constraints
on any one particular MM product/environment <grin>. Hummm, looks like
this is just a reflection of my comments on flexibility.
Our applied backgrounds are a lot more similar than I would have
expected! I have also done several small projects on the Amiga and then
on big kiosk system but all mine where done on the Amiga. The kiosk was a
lot of fun and a little challanging – had to use dual laser disc players.
Why is it that all paying clients want it yesterday?
EdV
Ed,
>> I also figured not many would be interested.
I'm sure there will be some others who might want to drop in…
Well, Amiga products are often very competitive on a feature for
feature comparison but I feel that _sometimes_ Amiga developers will
throw things in just to say that yes, it does that, even if it isn't
very useful (FinalWriter is an example of this). Scala is one
exception and there are others but many products seem just shy of the
finely tuned edge that is required in a pro setup. Amiga products
are flexible but I feel sometimes you have to go through contortions
inorder to make use of that flexibity. That isn't to say the Amiga
can't be used in a pro setup, just that you have to be willing to
make a few sacrifices, once in a while (don't you always???). I have
more than once pushed a product to the limit and found that it broke.
To clarify on the flexibility issue: the Amiga environment as a whole
is more flexible but the individual parts seem to be less so. For
example, I have been using PhotoShop on the Mac and OpalPaint and
ImageMaster R/t on the Amiga. IM R/t has lots of features but isn't
the easiest product to use and the interface often works against
productivity (too many menus to scroll though, IMO). OpalPaint is a
great program but there are some parts that could be enhanced (It
seems like a sampling of all the high end features in PhotoShop and
others). But both IM and OP (combined) are less than the cost of
PhotoShop.
PhotoShop has so many options that it's not so much HOW do you do
something but which way to do it (this can be both good and bad).
OTOH, the graphics that I created with OpalPaint would have been more
difficult on the Mac (and in fact I don't even know how I would have
done it in PhotoShop because they used colour stencils, a feature
which I don't thing is available in PhotoShop in that form.)
The bottom line, IMO, is that in a so-called 'pro' environment, it
isn't so much what it costs but if it does the job, right, the first
time. For me, if I want to actually make money in this business I
have to use the accepted tools (although I will keep Ami).
>> Strangely enough, I strongly feel that good
>> MM requires good multitasking
Agreed, I miss MT everytime I use a Mac or PC. In fact, I just bought
OS/2 for my PeeCee with the hope I can get away from Windoze. Aside from
MT the one area that the Amiga was a leader in was innovation.
The kiosk I did just used teeny-tiny AVI clips and static bitmap graphics.
It was a horror when we took it from the development system to the kiosk
system: the video stopped working. Turns out it was the video driver which
was incompatible with the AVI player in ToolBook. I wanted (and tried) to
do it on the Amiga but I was working for a PC house and old habits die
hard.
>> Why is it that all paying clients want it yesterday?
Not only that but the want it ALL, yesterday.
Your project sounds quite impressive. How long did it take you? What was
the product that you were selling. Did you use AVPro?
Andrew,
Interesting comments about your perceptions of software for the
Amiga and MAC. Can't help but wonder how much of your perception is
related to your first hand "training" on how to use those "power"
tools – like one can simply go to their local college and take a
course on ImageMaster R/T <grin>!
I typically hear folks rant and rave about PhotoShop's
ease-of-use, not that it has so many options! In fact when it comes
to features/options, I haven't run into anything that comes close to
IM – and you're right, that's good and bad. Deciding HOW to do
something can be harder than actually doing it. Don't know if I like
the idea of a "pro" environment as you descibe it, if I don't learn
something from the experience (like trying different options — can't
tell you the number of fascinating things I've learned this way
<grin>) then it's become a boring 9-5 job. I can, however, relate to
making money (someday I'll learn that too :-).
The kiosk system I did was for a manufacturer that wanted to show
his goods to the masses at a large trade show. Client already had a
lot of video of the individual products so it was a natural for laser
disc. The hardest part came when the client said he wanted to use as
many components as possible of an existing PC based training system
they already owned and assurances that it will look significantly
better than it! A LONG week later and the system had to be shipped. I
was still in the "it would look better if we slightly changed this
graphic/operation/response/etc" infinite loop process <grin>! I guess
I was the only one concerned about those itty-bitty things because
the client loved it and things went apparently extremely well at the
show (can you believe no budget for me to go). I used SCALA for this
particular system but sometimes think AVPro might have been better
suited especially with all the external control I was using, but heck
it worked.
Now if I could find more paying jobs. It's amazing how many free ones
there are <grin>!
EdV
Ed,
Yes, you are correct that the excellent training made me appretiate the
products all the more. And that training also assisted me when I went back
and worked with OpalPaint and IM.
Photo-Shop is pretty option rich (for what is basically a paint
package). It doesn't have heaps of effects or morphing (although you
can get more if you want) but it has lots of good image processing
tools such as multiple Alpha channels, selection tools, and, with the
new version, composite tools. I personally don't use filters all that
often and I have to admit that I have only looked at the morphing
part of IM.
One thing that I particulary liked that IM seems to lack was the
DuoTone feature which lets you apply colours to specific ranges in a
grayscale image (ie. you could have hilites white, midtones blue and
darks purple). This is something that could be done with IM and
OpalPaint (probably with stencils) but it would require a lot more
work (Does ADPro or ImageFX have that feature 'cause it's great for
spicing up a b&w image?)
I don't want a 9-5 job, just something that pays enough to let me buy my
toys and have something left over and which ideally would let me use those
toys in my work. I go by the motto in regards to work that if the
employer doesn't watch what time I come in I won't watch what time I go
home (with the implication that I will work until it is done and not
simply leave at 5.)
You did all that in a week???!!! Did you sleep at all? How did you get
Scala to control the video disk? ARexx?
>> Now if I could find more paying jobs. It's amazing how many
>> free ones there are <grin>!
I think the market is growing so there should be a good chance of paid
work in this field. Unfortunately, there are lots of people willing to
work for free…Luckily, working for free will eventually mean that you
can actually get paid for it.
My kiosk took 11 weeks from begining to end. That included learning
Multimedia Toolbook (which I had never seen before but is similar to
Helm), graphic and temporal design, scanning products, digitizing
some video and setting up h/w. For what I did it would have been
realistically about a month on the Amiga, or if for a deamon like
yourself perhaps a week or two. 8^) It would have run much faster
and looked much better on the Amiga but who was I to complain: I
learned a new set of products and got paid to do it!
I just had a disaster with my current Mac project: I discovered how
easy it is to format a Mac HDD. On the Amiga you get two chances to
cancel. The Mac is, shall I say, less forgiving. One chance and then
none of the recovery s/w seems to be able to get more than 25% of the
files back. In fact, the recovery s/w is really stupid: it only
looks for files that it knows (ie. excel files, or word files etc.
but not QT movies or Director films.) Luckily my design is pretty
simple and I have most of the graphics on my Amiga so I should be
able to build it up again before the Friday deadline.
Anyway, it's late and I have to get a rendering started to work
overnight (Aladdin doesn't MT when it renders).
Andrew,
PMFJI, Scala has EXes that can control most Philips, Sony and Pioneer serial
controllable laserdisc players. The MM300 product also includes EX modules for
the GVP G-Lock and Digital Creations SuperGen series of genlocks.
Regards,
John Chang
John,
Sorry for the delay, Christmas and all…
>> What's this you were not able to break MM300? ;-}
I don't rightly know. Unfortunately, I don't recall exactly what I
said but I suspect I ment that I have not used Scala although I have
seen it demostrated on numerous occasions (never got it because most
of my work requires distribution with a player).
I perhaps ment that AmigaVision and other products can be easy to
"break" when it is pushed to the limit, ie. Guru. I may have been
asking Ed if he found Scala to be stable. Anyway, nothing incideous
was ment by it (such as "breaking" the copy-protect dongle) I assure
you. 8^)
Thanks for the info on the external support in Scala. I guess Scala
doesn't support the OpalVision board, huh?
Andrew
ICAM — ActiveMedia Development / IICS "InforMedia" Newsletter Editor
Gliding in from Toronto on AutoPilot…
Andrew,
>Anyway, nothing incideous was ment by it (such as "breaking" the copy-protect
dongle) I assure you.
I wasn't thinking of that. ;-} However, there are some problems with
MM300, which we hope to address in a maintenance upgrade. We have
workaround solution for the most serious bug. See SCALAFIX.LHA in
the Amiga Arts/Multimedia library for details.
About a year ago, we had approximately 30% of the OpalVision EX
finished. However, OpalTech was making fundamental changes to their
software to accomodate the Video Suite stuff (i.e. Roaster Chip
support) that we halted development until it was completed. Well,
now its almost, almost finished. But, of course, we now we have this
Commodore problem. Sigh.
Well, if you can get the OV support I would have a reason to get Scala
but as I only have an ECS system it would be a bit of overkill for me
to get it now. It's unfortunate that the fate of the Amiga puts into
doubt all the other wonderful products that are or will be available.
Did you see the Amiga ads in January 1995 Amiga World? There were a
couple of custom Amigas shown. One was the A2200 and the other was
PAWS, a laptop Amiga. Both could help fill the void until this mess
with CBM assets is sorted out.
How's it going?
>> Did you see the Amiga ads in January 1995 Amiga World?
Yes, I did. The "A2200" is apparently a re-engineered CD32 and of the
two I find it most interesting. It indicates that there is at least
an anticipated demand for Amigas out there. I don't know if I would
buy one, however, because Computer Answers do not have the best
reputation out there.
Indeed it is unfortunate. A positive growth in the Amiga's
development and market will be necessary before we do new products
for the platform. We are keeping an open mind and hopeful wish that
the situation will turn out well. In the meantime, we must continue
to put our time and resources into developing for other platforms.
Regards,
John Chang
'Tis very unfortunate. I suppose the major thing making developers
wait and see is whether new machines will be effectively produced and
promoted. I just bought a used copy of SCALA. Wow! What a product!
It really is as good as the hype. Couldn't stop watching the demo
program. Only problem I could see is someone needs to learn how to
spell "continuous". I'm sure your product for other platforms will be
great but after messing around with this a little, I can see how the
Amiga is really the best platform for your product.
Andrew,
> (Duotones are) something that could be done with IM and OpalPaint
Actually, just ole Imagemaster will do. I'm more than happy to share this:
I consider it my best discovery yet.
Load an image into Imagemaster. Use Standard Adj/Luma to turn it into a
greyscale.
Go to the Paint/Palette screen. Unless you changed the palette, the screen
is set up for an instant greyscale palette: just click on Spread.
Change the color space to HSV. Now comes the fun part: pick a midtone,
like color 128, click and give it a saturation of, say, 64 and a hue of
16. Then spread from color 112 to 128, and 128 to 144. You've
progressively added color to the middle area of a greyscale, without
disturbing the brightness values.
Now add more tones to your palette: set color 64 to hue=0 and sat=64;
spread from color 48 to 64, and from 64 to 80. Then set color 192 to
hue=32 and sat=64, and spread from color 176 to 192, and 192 to 208.
Exit back to the main menu, select the entire image, and select
Process/Special FX/Map to Palette. Presto! Your image has gained subdued
colors in certain ranges. The key is really to keep saturation levels low.
I normally use this technique with only one hue, placed at color 128 in
the palette; I then spread from color 0 to 128, and 128 to 255. The result
is a single-hue image, but saturation drops to zero at the ends of the
palette, so blacks are pure black and whites are pure white.
Blaq!
Charles,
Sorry for the delay, Christmas and all…
>> Actually, just ole Imagemaster will do. I'm more than happy to share
>> this: I consider it my best discovery yet.
Thanks for your suggestion. That is a great solution! I have to admit
that I have only used IM for format conversion and a few of the F/x
filters. I normally use OpalPaint for image manipulation but OP doesn't
have a palette map feature. I'll give your idea a try. Thanks.
The thing I love about powerful software is that you can always learn of
new ways to do things…
Andrew,
Sorry to hear about your formatted disk disaster! I've had my
fair share of "operator boo-boos" on just about all the platforms
I've played with. One of my more memorable ones was the "rm -f" I
typed into a shell on a SUN workstation — it opened up a lot of disk
space for me! Back to your situation, I am a little surprised you
don't have a quicker means of transferring data between the Amiga and
the MAC other than SneakerNET! Seems a little communication software
and a null modem cable could make things easier and speedier for you.
If you get some time, you might want to experiment with some of
the other capabilities in IM (check out asterize if you want to burn
up an interesting hour). That's one of the problems I have with IM
— so many parameters and options to tweak, I end up doing a lot of
experimentation. Don't know what you thought, but I liked the
morphing section. I was pleasantly surprised with the results I
generated doing a simple morph between my head and my wife's head
(guess I've seen one too many TV commercials). As for a DuoTone
feature, I don't have a method to do what sounds to me as palette
manipulation operation, however, you might want to try Charles method
(thanks Charles!). I don't know if ADPro or ImageFX has this feature
either, although I do own both of those packages as well. Can you
tell I don't do greyscale? Guess I've been lucky, have only had to
deal with color images (yea, I know greyscale can be viewed as x-bit
color image). Most of my challenges have been in reducing the number
of colors in an image without destroying the image beyond
recognition. The number of bit planes seems to have a big bearing on
the performance of playback <grin>. This gets even more fun in
animations.
That week for the kiosk project was one of the longer weeks I've
experienced — probably a lot like the one you are currently having
<grin>. Controlling the Laser Disc was one of the first things I had to
settle. Before I even selected the authoring software to use, I got the
manufacturer's info on the control command set for the player (RS232 –
serial based) and developed a simple but effective means of sending these
commands out the serial port via ARexx and AmigaDOS. Worked just fine for
my purposes, but then I found out both SCALA and AVPro had "Laser Disc
Drivers" integrated within these packages that I could use. Fortunately,
I spent only a few hours doing it my way, but it did give me the option to
consider other authoring software solutions.
Eleven weeks to deliver a product sounds fairly challenging to me if I
had to learn a new authoring program in addition to the challenges of a
new platform and it's method of "this is the way things are done here
lad." Your points about doing this on the Amiga are some of the major
reasons I "force" the Amiga solution for my multimedia endeavours and
believe SCALA has even capitalized on it!
>Your points about doing this on the Amiga are some of the major
>reasons I "force" the Amiga solution for my multimedia endeavours and
>believe SCALA has even capitalized on it!
Yes indeed we do, especially with users like you! ;-}
Happy New Year Ed!
Regards,
John Chang
Ed,
Sorry for the delay but Christmas and all…
>> Sorry to hear about your formatted disk disaster!
Yes, it was a big disappointment but luckily I only felt sorry for myself
for 12 hours or so (I resumed work at 4 AM the next morning). I was able
to get the application in a presentable form by the end of the week which
included a small anim and 8 screens. Enough to demonstrate intent and
ability. I was literally working right up to the last minute. The last
day I was a 28 hour day so I'm happy that at least I got something to show
for it. The CD will be cut in a few weeks time but as I don't have a Mac
I can't run it. 8(
>> I am a little surprised you don't have a quicker means of
>> transferring data between the Amiga and the MAC other than SneakerNET!
Yes, unfortunately, the PowerPCs at the school were not equiped with
Modems and I could not afford a Syquest drive. My Amiga and the Mac are
1/2 hour away from each other so it would have to be a really long
null-modem cable. 8^)
>> If you get some time, you might want to experiment with
>> some of the other capabilities in IM
Yes, I must experiment with IM some more. I use it a little bit more on
each project so I am learning. To bad there isn't a course in it…
>> Can you tell I don't do greyscale? Guess I've been lucky,
>> have only had to deal with color images
I for most of my photos I used a colour scanner but unfortunately I only
had B & W pictures.
>> I spent only a few hours doing it my way, but it did give me the option
>> to consider other authoring software solutions.
This brings us back to the flexibility of the Amiga platform, huh? You
could have used the built-in support or develop your own. Did you ever
use The Director? It controlled serial devices in the same way. How long
did you say the kiosk was in use? Did you have any problems when it was
actually being used?
>> Your points about doing this on the Amiga are some of the major
>> reasons I "force" the Amiga solution for my multimedia endeavours and
>> believe SCALA has even capitalized on it!
However, on the other hand, Asymetrix who publishes Toolbook provide
excellent tech support. I suspect that Scala is probably pretty good
but using AmigaVision means you have to solve all your problems by
your own ingenuity, something that isn't the best when you have
deadlines. (Heck, AV doesn't even come with a tech support number!)
I would love to force an Amiga solution but I've found people aren't
so much interested in pizzaz but if something is an industry
standard. I know for a fact that if I had initially chosen the Mac or
IBM I would probably be much more secure in my profession.
So, do you have any projects on the horizion?
Andrew,
>I suspect that Scala is probably pretty good [Tech Support]
I think we do a fairly good job. ;-}
Regards,
John Chang
John,
>>> I suspect that Scala is probably pretty good [Tech Support]
>> I think we do a fairly good job. ;-}
That is worth the price of admission in itself! There is nothing like
an approaching deadline to make you appretiate good tech support.
Thanks for the compliments. Let me know if you have questions. I
have all the answers. Well, most of them at least.
Greetings Andrew,
Glad to hear your project came off OK. I think you've just stole
my "speed demon" title away — anyone that can cram 28 hours into one
day has my upmost respect <grin>!
Shoot, by my calculations (on a Pentium – hehe, it's a joke) you
were only 10 minutes farther away between the MAC and the Amiga for a
null modem cable to actually work! If I had a similar situation, I
would have seriously considered physically taking my machine to the
other and then performing a null modem transfer on the spot, but it
would depend on how many floppies the transfer really amounted to —
something you probably already factored.
Somehow, I don't think there is enough of a market to support an
IM course, which is unfortunate, because it is one of those products
that almost requires that level of instruction to get the most out of
it. I understand there is a video tape available that is suppose to
do IM some justice, but that is only on hearsay since I don't have
the tape myself.
I'm not following you on your statements about flexibility and
using "built-in support or develop your own." Develop my own is a
gross overstatement for using AmigaDOS and ARexx commands, especially
when compared to whipping out the C compiler. The Amiga offered me an
incredibly easy solution to controlling the serial port connected
laser players outside of any authoring program. Certainly built-in
support is easier as long as all the capabilites of the player can be
accessed, but what do you do if the built-in support isn't there?
Will tech support whip up a special driver/program just for you,
especially if the player you are using is an old obsolete model
(which was my case)?
I own the Director version 2, but must shamefully admit I haven't
really used it 🙁 I have heard nothing but praise for the Director, but
when Keith Doyle stopped development on it, it became yet another symbol
for my bookshelf of what could have been. If I remember correctly, the
Director was the program credited by lots of folks that used it to make
those impressive entries for demo contests. Don't know if controlling
laser disc players was high on the list of things to do back then <grin>.
I can certainly relate to wanting tech support solutions when under
a dealine, however, I rather enjoy problem solving. I also like to
believe people like to pay for ingenuity, especially when it makes
them look good. Forcing an Amiga solution is pretty easy with this
philosophy — show them a well done animation while complex sounds
are emitting and have them make a selection for more information (all
running from an A1200) at the same time is usually enough to get tham
asking if you can do this or that or even this-that <grin>. To be
honest, I must admit that I had one person watch the "show" and tell
me that his 486SX laptop could easily do that! Being the pig I am, I
matter-of-factly asked him what software he was using that could do
this and things went down hill pretty rapidly… What was really
scary about this incident was that this person was on a "multimedia"
council of a local college.
The kiosk system I worked on was used at a trade show for 5 days
straight. Was told it worked extremely well — no problems. This
client came back for the kiosk about a month later for another show
which lasted about 3 days. Of course I had to go in and "fix" those
minor nits that bothered me but nobody else complained about. In the
process I tried to optimise response times even further but didn't
have enough time to check things out thoroughly. This time I heard
the kiosk had to be "rebooted" after the second day — oopppssss.
I don't buy your "industry standard" line <grin>! About the only
thing I've seen that's even close to an industry standard in this
multimedia madness is MPEG, but that's just my opinion. You do have a
point about the Amiga solution now-a-days – it's getting darn hard to
locate machines if you do sell it (certainly can't call that a
standard!).
There looks like there are a few nibbles for some future projects
for me, but I'm not betting anything on them. One looks like a lot of
fun – a computer based training system. Other than these nibbles, I'm
basically unemployed.
Ed,
>> anyone that can cram 28 hours into one day has my upmost respect
Yes, it was difficult but luckily with the latest advances in time travel
I was able to achieve it.
>> Shoot, by my calculations (on a Pentium – hehe, it's a joke) you were
>> only 10 minutes farther away between the MAC and the Amiga for a null
<G> The sneakernet only involved about 20 diskettes so it wasn't worth
lugging the 3000T around to set up a network. Luckily I invested in a HD
drive so I was able to at least use 1.44 Meg disks.
>> Somehow, I don't think there is enough of a market to support an I
>> course, which is unfortunate…
What! I'm sure there are "virtually" millions of IM users out there
who would be willing to spend big bucks and take a course! In fact, I
think I'll start a school based on it and I will have students from
all over.
>> I'm not following you on your statements about flexibility and >>
using built-in support or develop your own."
It was in regards to our earlier discussion about the Amiga's
flexibility: you had a choice of how to do something without having
to resort to compiling C source code. This is a GOOD thing. That
choice may not have been as easy on Macs or PCs (where there isn't a
commonly used interprocess communcation macro language such as
ARexx).
My story is similar to yours regarding Director2. I purchased it
just before Doyle officially dropped out. I never used it to develop
MM but I built (most of) a batch image scaling utility and some
libraries to create automatic script based buttons. I stopped
working with it when the AGA incompatibilities where made public. Now
it sits on my bookshelf gathering dust.
Dir2 had support for laserdisc in the same manner that you solved your
problem: it had a serial port module which you could use to send messages
to the port.
>> I can certainly relate to wanting tech support solutions when under a
>> line, however, I rather enjoy problem solving.
It's fun to workout problems but sometimes there isn't time to have fun.
>> people like to pay for ingenuity
I disagree: people want ingenuity but usually don't want to pay for it.
>> Being the pig I am, I matter-of-factly asked him what software he was
>> using that could do this and things went down hill pretty rapidly…
Did he tell you what he was using? I know that my 486SX laptop will not
do all that although it can do some things pretty well (and it has 256
colours instead of my Amiga's 16).
>> Of course I had to go in and "fix" those minor nits…This time I
>> heard the kiosk had to be "rebooted" after the second day — oopppssss.
Yikes. One of the things that was drummed into me when I worked on my
project is that if the client has approved it, don't do anything else.
ie. if it ain't broke, don't fix it. It's a hard habit to break, however.
>> I don't buy your "industry standard" line
Well, there are no "industry standards" per se but there are standards
that are more standard than other standards. ie, Director is an emerging
standard for cross-platform development, just as PCs tend to be a
"standard" for corporate based presentations (Yuck). IMHO.
>> Other than these nibbles, I'm basically unemployed.
It's hard being on the leading edge, huh? <BG> Same goes for me. BTW,
whereabout are you located?
Have you done CBT before?
Having "virtually" millions of IM users would be a good thing and
your school could then become fiscally sound <grin>. I've heard more
than once that if an Amiga product sold over 100,000 copies it is
considered a major hit 🙁 Of course since Black Belt Systems has
a CLONE version called WinImages you may actually have a pretty good
idea about that school!
Humm, the more I think about it, the more I think you are on the
right track – people don't want to pay for ANYTHING! Even more so in
a commodity market: lowest price wins. So how does one compete in
such a commodity market?
The "board member of the multimedia council" sort-of-admitted he
could remember the name of the package that gave his 486SX laptop
Amiga 1200 capabilites. I started rattling off some of the major
programs I've seen in the CLONE world and his eyes lit up when I
mentioned PowerPoint – of course my eyes rolled back up into my
head…
Trying to fix something that isn't broken isn't a habit, its a law
of nature <grin>!
I guess if one believes that as long as MACs and CLONEs are the
only machines out there, the Director may be just the solution. This
is the reason I see MPEG more of a "standard," I've seen players for
MPEG for all sorts of machines to include the rapidly fading Amiga.
I'm personally a strong proponet of open standards/specifications
that are not platform unique because that encourages cross-platform
interoperability. Unfortunately, if one has the size of market the
CLONEs current have, you probably couldn't care less about
cross-platform interoperability. Humm, I guess when everybody owns a
CLONE then there won't be a problem at all…
Didn't you mean `bleeding edge' <grin>? Don't know how much longer
I'm going to continue messing around with this stuff, especially if
the Amiga doesn't resurface soon. Doing MM on the Amiga has been more
like playing and I get the impression that MM on those other
creatures are more like work. If I have to work, then I should
seriously consider going back to the engineering world.
I've done a real small scale version of CBT for my previous
employer (US Air Force). I was trying to talk one of my superiors
into doing something worth while with those 286 machines we had all
over the place (this was several years ago). Worked on a simple
question-answer training system which worked well for the limited
scope application it was designed for. Even though my boss liked it
so much he directed it's use for several units under his command, I
could not convince him to do the same thing with "more important"
daily job oriented applications. I look back at that adventure and
chuckle about how easy and much more sophisticated project I could do
now with my 2 year old Amiga technology <sigh>.
I'm currently living in Dayton, Ohio. The birthplace of aviation – at
least that is what all the signs around here tell me <grin>!
EdV
Hi Ed,
>> So how does one compete in such a commodity market?
I dunno, good question though. I think there is still a sense of you get
what you pay for and that some people realize that it's cheaper (in the
long run) to pay more. As service providers we have to be convinced of
that and convince our clients. Both are difficult.
As an example, just look at the number of high-end DTP companies that are
still in operation (not many but they are surviving). If lowest price was
all that mattered then every Joe & Jane with a computer who was willing to
undercut themselves would have a successful home based DTP company.
However, home based DTP, in the majority of cases, doesn't work because
people would rather pay $60/hr for the assurance that they are susposedly
getting the best service.
This trend of spending more isn't just because the value is perceived as
being better (although that is a factor). It's also the impression that
by having higher prices you have more staying power and will be able to
provide service (in upgrades and support) over the long haul. A company
that undercuts market values has to keep up the volume in order to stay
liquid. This high volume results in two possible problems: Service is not
as good & there isn't the fat to survive a market downturn. I have heard
opinions that this was one of the problems with C=, they didn't charge
enough.
Here's another of my inane examples: If Scala (who are already
undercutting the market) sold Scala300 for $100 and InfoChannel for, say,
$300 the market would say "hey, there's something wrong here, Scala must
be junk". They might not buy it because it is cheap. (Perhaps John Chang
might want to comment on Scala Inc. pricing policy). Then Scala may only
be used by hobbists and individuals like yourself who see the value in the
product. Corporations, who are afraid of being left with orphaned
products, would only look at the bottom line and think it suspicious, IMO.
So this brings me back to my argument that PCs and Macs are more accepted
because they have the impression of having more value because they were
more expensive. And now they are the defacto standards.
>> his eyes lit up when I mentioned PowerPoint
Oh boy. Such amazing animation, huh? One of the interesting things that I
noticed about the PowerMacs that I worked on was that the animation was
very poor in comparison to the Amiga. I think this is because they don't
have double-buffering. If you have large areas moving you can see the
redraw blanking out the previous frame.
>> I guess if one believes that as long as MACs and CLONEs
>> machines out there, the Director may be just the solution.
Director can be used to create CDi applications and will apparently
support other players such as 3DO. In fact, I believe it is going to be
used by QVC or some company for interactive TV.
>> I see MPEG more of a "standard"
Yes it is but it is a standard for linear video. Director is for
interactive applications (although you could use an authoring program to
create non-linear MPEG video).
>> I'm personally a strong proponet of open standards/specifications
>> that are not platform unique because that encourages cross-platform
>> interoperability.
Perhaps X-Script will solve that although I have heard it will be very
expensive.
>> Didn't you mean `bleeding edge'
Uh, yes. It was a typo.
>> Doing MM on the Amiga has been more like playing and I get the
>> impression that MM on those other creatures are more like
>> work. If I have to work, then I should seriously consider going
>> back to engineering world.
I know what you mean. Everyday I ask myself if I want to work in this
field and everyday I come up with the same answer: a definite maybe.
It sorta preferred it when I was a hobbiest but then it is hard to
justify the constant spending.
>> I'm currently living in Dayton, Ohio. The birthplace of aviation – at
>> least that is what all the signs around here tell me <grin>!
<BG>
Ed,
Glad that you used Scala MultiMedia for the production. What EX modules were
you missing? Which version of MM were you using for the project?
Regards,
John Chang
Ended up using MM300 since I didn't need the time scheduling or
remote updating capabilities of IC400 (guess I need to find a bigger
project <grin>!). I didn't have an EX for the touchscreen but
fortunately, my AVPro had an appropriate driver.
Got a lot of respect for SCALA MMxxx when it comes to text
handling/magic. In fact, the more text I see in a project, the more it
pushes me to use SCALA as the authoring software. After all, "why make it
harder?" Hehehe…
EdV
Ed,
Glad you like the software. Bare in mind that despite its somewhat "magical"
capabilities, it is not a full-fledged authoring program. Well, at least not
yet. ;-}
We've heard of problems using the AmigaVision drivers with certain
touchscreens. CEI is an authorized Microtouch reseller and has an excellent
driver for their hardware. I suggest looking into it when you have time.
Regards,
John Chang
John,
You hit the nail on the head! When it comes to presentations with lots
of text, SCALA can't be beat. The computer geek in me always hunts for
the "authoring program" aspects, so if SCALA is headed even more into that
direction, all the better 🙂
The AVPro touchscreen driver I used was for the Elographics. Worked
like a dream! Do you know which specific touchscreens/drivers that have
problems – I would like to avoid the learn-the-hard-way lesson <grin>.
Here's hoping your Holidays are joyous and prosperous!
EdV
As to authoring programs, itsa coming, itsa coming! Especially as we
gain experience in our Interactive Television authoring and playback
tool developments.
I believe some people were having problems with the MicroTouch driver
used on AGA based machines. CEI sells a complete MicroTouch
touchscreen kit with monitor (CEI 1962).
FYI, recently, Microtouch purchased the technology for the Visage
touchscreen system. Instead of using a capacitive or resistive
sensor, which is installed in the front bezel of the picture tube,
the Visage uses "force vector" technology. The monitor sits on top
of the Visage unit and using highly sensitive pressure sensors, it
triangulates the coordinates. Unlike capacitive or resistive
methods, there is no drift and therefore no periodic recalibration to
be done.
The benefit of the Visage, it is non-invasive, meaning that you
don't have to tear apart a monitor to put in the touchscreen sensor.
You can use any monitor, even a TV, up to 80 lbs. If the monitor
breaks down, no problem, just add the new monitor, recalibrate and
voila! You're back in business with minimum down time. From what I
understand, they are going to re-introduce the product at the next
COMDEX. We'll see.
Just read the new products announcement in the Feb 95 AmigaWorld,
and it looks like you've been holding out on us! Are you going to
give us some DETAILS about `Backbone', `ITV', and `MD100' or do we
have to turn DJ and rubber chickens loose (hope I got that chicken
story right!). Sounds like some pretty interesting stuff.
That Visage touchscreen system sounds great, especially if one can
use any size monitor with it! Do you have any ideas on ball park
prices? I ended up using a 14" monitor because I couldn't talk the
client into spending the extra money for a 20" (big price
difference!).
Ed,
I do talk about MMOS and Scala MultiMedia MM100 for the PC in a forum message
that I posted yesterday. Check out the message I left for John Bennett. If
you have any additional questions, I'll tell you what I can.
Regards,
John Chang
Thank you for the compliments. What's this you were not able to break
MM300? ;-}
Regards,
John Chang