#Newtek where are you?
93 messages in this thread
Does Newtek ever respond to any messages or problems discussed here? There
are plenty of questions that still remain unresolved, especially the ones
about the "flickering toasters". Many toaster owners have this problem. Can
someone please tell me why Newtek does not address this? Isn't this a
Newtek Forum?
If you need NewTek the best thing is to call them directly.
John Gross is the closest we've seen to NewTek on a regular basis for
awhile. Everyone should send JG at least Holiday E-Mail for all his
help.
Joe Maulucci >>> AP ENGAGED
Joe,
The information that is available here from users is great. In fact, it's
more than I've got from Newtek directly. I was just wondering why Newtek
doesn't respond to specific problems addressed in this forum. A public
response to some of these problems might help lighten the phone calls to
the tech dept. At least it would show that they care about their customers.
Art
When I asked about this, I was told that there is an official policy from
the highest levels NOT to do tech support online. I'm not sure why this
forum exists, but it makes a handy place for us all to share our knowledge.
Aki,
I agree, this is a good place to share knowledge. It is just unfortunate
that NewTek doesn't participate. Even when I deal with them on the phone
they always seem to have stock replies to specific problems.
Art
Art,
"Stock replies", yeah like that bad photo copy they stick in when they
return your board from repairs which reads that they found the problem you
discribed and fixed it. It would be nice to know what was actually done
to the board. I had one board returned to me with no screws! Yeap, she's
fixed alright.
I was not aware of this new policy of theirs. I was wondering why there
was not much talk here about Lightwave Professional, System 3.0, or that
new add-on board.
Joe Maulucci >>> AP ENGAGED
mmmhhh…what's Lightwave Professional got/cost?
what new add-on board??
When will release 3.0 arrive…
what's in it?
How much?
Thx. SK.
Because all the beta testers of LW Pro will be "terminated" if they even
mention that they have it, or so it says on the non-disclosure that they
signed… 🙂
Not being part of that elite group or knowing any of them, I am just
piecing rumors that have filtered through the DTV community. I guess if
this SIG was not associated with NewTek, we would be more likely to
explore the strengths, weekness, and future of the Video Toaster.
We all have the Toaster Tool Kit, for example, but we don't even explore
the sharing of custom wipes or scripts. A Toaster library, filled with
scripts, wipes, 3D objects…perhaps sja is right, we should move this to
the AmigaArts forum.
Joe Maulucci >>> AP ENGAGED
Joe,
There are a couple of great Toaster/Lightwave BBS's out there with alot
of what you request. Karl
"Only Amiga can make it happen…"
NewTek signed a contract with CompuServe to do end user technical support
in this section of AmigaVendor. If they now wish not to do so maybe it's
time for the contract to be cancelled and a generalized Toaster section
opened up in AmigaArts forum.
-sja
Hear, Hear.
It would be nice for SOMEONE to pick up the ball that NewTek (OldTek?) has
chosen to drop.
Still waiting . . .
Erik Flom
If you are having spacific problem, it's always best to contact us
directly…Don't you think? You might notice that when someone asks a
general operational question about the toaster, their questions get
answered. When someone has a spacific, or very unusual question, we ask
them to call. If you called me and asked a question about some really weird
thing that you had going on, I'd have to ask you hundreds of questions.
This might make a month long project out of what could be handled in a 10
minute phone call.
BobAnderson NewTek TechSupport
Yo, Bob.
Your msg must be directed at some other Toaster(er) out there.
(I've never had a problem with NewTek tech support, and have made it clear
on this very SIG. I think you guys have exemplary customer support!)
(BTW, are you the 'Bob' who handled my latest Toaster problems? If so,
then a hearty thank-you and 'job well done' should be sent your way! :^)
I HAVE NEVER (in the 2 times I have had Toaster problems) HAD PROBLEMS
WITH NEWTEK TECH SUPPORT. There are others who have claimed such problems,
but not me.
Try talking to Wayne Cole, he seems to be ONE disgruntled Toaster user.
Happy New Year, 7 KEep On Toastin',
Erik Flom
P.S. I assume there is no truth to the rumour that Kiki is carrying John
Sculley's love-child? :^)
(Just kidding guys!)
OOPS! that message was meant for the one and only wayne cole. Sorry. There
are two Bobs here in Tech. I think it was Bob Stratton,
our on staff broadcast eng. who helped you out, but thanks for the
compliment.When you get a LOUD minority like Mr. Cole it's good
to have folks like yourself out there. Thanks
As to the scully question… I heard that KIKI had been abducted
by UFO aliens, and that the "Love Child" she is carrying is actually
ELVIS"!!! But don't tell anyone…
I heard that Elvis and the Colonel were having a secret love affair and
Priscilla found out so the CIA had to have him killed.
— JG
<licensed to fly>
No,No No your wrong it was Priscilla that was having the affair with the
Colonel and the Colonel had Elvis killed. DH
My lips are sealed! <g>
(I, too, have seen Elvis!)
Keep On Toastin'
Erik Flom
You guys need to get out more often.
;}
Art,
In the past when NewTek reps were visiting here daily, unless you included
their account number, chances were that they would not respond.
(ie: To: NewTek 76004,3350)
Joe Maulucci >>> AP ENGAGED
thanks Joe. BobAnderson NewTek TechSupport
They've got an 800 number for tech support. Have you tried calling them
directly? You're right, their network support is spotty. I'll tell you
why… the upper management at NewTek doesn't have a high opinion of
network online support at this time. Their opinion is that it's nowhere as
good as what can be accomplished over the phone, and that there's a
tendency for people to get a bad impression of the company if there's a lot
of flaming and dirty laundry. So when we do get NewTek tech support people
here, they're probably doing it of their own motivation…
Absolutly correct BobAnderson NewTek TechSupport
Art,
They only replyto accustations of not being responsive. Lately their tech
support has gone into the Toilet. Profit drunk, I suspect. If you are
considering a device for professional use my advice would be to NOT
consider the Toaster. Their support is so bad that even if you take the
time to mail them a long letter and files on disk describing the problems
they do not respond.
I lost a very lucrative job because of thier lack of support. And it gets
worse by the day. Basically, they lack of support for the device puts it
into the 'neat toy' category – certainly not suitable for professional use
unless you have a backup for the inevitable day the NewTek tech support
effectively says, "screw you!"
wmc – via Autopilot!
Are they profit-drunk, or are they just working on a Toaster for other
platforms? Given their in-ability to work with C=, I get the impression
they may soon be ready to leap into more lucrative markets.
What is this rumor about them not shipping any more Toasters for 2
months?
(Sounds kinda' scary?!?)
Keep On Toastin'
Erik Flom
That's entirely ridiculous… Because I've got software in the Toaster
package am privy to sales figures, I can tell you that the last few months
have been some of the best sales months ever. It's a complete and utter
lie.
Well, I never said it was the truth.
I am glad you are privvy to more information than us lowly users get.
(Now, why don't you share some more with us peons.)
Since they offer little/no support, and they don't tell anyone anything,
what can we do but spread vile rumors?
"Keep On Toastin'" (But, for how long? :^(
Erik Flom
Oh, I think it would be much more fun if you made up new rumors. Not a
month goes by that I don't hear that NewTek is in financial trouble, "on
the rocks." Then I look at my royalty checks and smile. 🙂 Paul
Montgomery just bought a Testarossa. You think they're in trouble?
How do I know what to think, if they won't tell anyone.
Enjoy your royalty checks (while they last).
How about this:
'John Sculley is Kiki Stockhammer's LOVE SLAVE'
(read it in the National Toilet.)
No Longer Toastin'
Erik Flom
So I guess she dumped Steve Jobs? Or are they back in the triangle that
rocked the computer world a few years ago?
If the Toaster did truly fail as that (false) rumor suggested, what do you
think would happen to the Amiga market in general?
Erik,
I've been suspicious that they might be converting to other platforms and
voiced those suspicions before. However, MANY people essentially said I
was nuts and went into great detail about the technical issues of a
conversion. Essentially the argument was that it essentially involved
reinventing the Toaster.
I don't know if they have stopped shippin or not. (Mark Manes might be
abel to elaborate on that). But they have been might silent, they have
stopped supporting it and these things are all consistent with an eminent
new product release, or a company's dissolution. Optimists would say that
it is in preparation for the AA chipset version Toaster. Pessimists would
say that the Toaster saturated the Amia market to its maximum penetration
and MUST go to other platforms to feed the Ferrari/Jet Plane/Kikki
Wardrobe thingies. Time will tell.
Something is definitley up. They don't even respond to the cuts in this
formum like they used to after they gave up the tech support. As for it
being scary – it has gone beyond that. They HAVE ALREADY LEFT the Amiga
market. So it makes little difference if they develop for another
platform or not. Just hope that the VIVID24 and EditMaster board get
reasonable software support. That could be Amiga Video Professionals
fallback to cover the NewTek abandonment of them.
wmc – via Autopilot!
Oh well, since my Toaster just burned out last night, I hope I can
EVENTUALLY get thru to Tech Support and find out how much it will cost to
get it fixed.
(I can't find their warranty card/statement ANYWHERE in their manual.)
No Longer Toastin'
Erik Flom
Eric,
I can' locate a warranty statement either. The card you mailed in was
just a registration card but there is no statement of warrantee anywhere
that I can find.
Unfortunatley I suspect if you get any help at all it will be to direct
you to a reseller of refurbished units. They have a real "*()& you"
attitude to Amiga users – probably a transference of their attitude toward
CBM. I believe they are abandoningg teh Amiga market to concentrate on
the mac software "ToasterLink".
I could tell you about my multiple contacts via phone, letter and diskette
with the problem files/procedures on it, the request for timely service
since more than $10,000 was riding on a solution/workaround. I got no
response except on here when I chastised them for lack of support after
one month into the problem. The messae was "we'll call you". They never
did. One problem I sent them files on is over a year old with no
response. The costly one is now 7 months old with no response.
Unfortunatly, due to thes circumstances I've been steering vidoe
professiojnal friends away from the Toaster. NewTek cannot be counted on
in a pinch. They are no longer a professional operation.
wmc – via Autopilot!
Ouch, sorry to hear that (tho' I have heard you say it before).
I had no problems about 6-9 months ago, but haven't talked to them since.
Here's hoping my luck is a little better.
Thanks,
Erik Flom
Erik,
You'll just have to keep calling them, and expect them to be busy. If
they want to call you back, get an estimate of when, you may have to call
them back anyway.
I have got them on the phone, about three weeks ago. I expect to try them
this week because I get a red screen on the second half of an autohue. I
don't now if this is a problem, does anyone?
Joe Maulucci >>> AP ENGAGED
I guess I got lucky. I called a 8:45AM PST and got right through. Was off
the phone within five minutes with my RMA #. (But of course, my problem
was a little more cut-and-dried. ie:Toaster caused system to not power
up.)
Oh well, here's hoping I'm as lucky with the repairs.
Thanks,
Erik Flom
Good luck 🙂
Joe Maulucci >>> AP ENGAGED
Erik,
I hope so, but the fact that you couldn't even et the girl who takes the
messages is not a good "customer service omen".
Wonder if Todd Rundgren, NBC, CBS and ABC users get a special telephone
dupport number or if NewTek blows them off too?
wmc – via Autopilot!
I should have made it clear that I was trying to get through to Customer
Support on a Saturday, and the lines were busy non-stop. (Maybe their
Christmas party was the Friday evening before? :^)
I got through the first time I called, and they gave me an RMA within
minutes. (Much to my surprise.)
Here's hoping this was not just a fluke.
Oh well, should be Toastin' within a week.
(I also ordered a beefier 300W PS for my A3000 also.)
Thanks,
Erik Flom
Wow – you really got lucky. My multiple calls and disks get either no
response or the "must be something wrong with your Amiga…"
wmc – via Autopilot!
It probably has to do with the fact my problems have always been fairly
dramatic.
Last June, I looked at the Composite output (for the first time in a month
– I really don't use the Toaster for much more than 24bit RGB graphics),
and it was all messed up. (Poor sync was causing 'flagginf' on the top of
the image, and I got a blue (or red?) screen during Toaster startup which
indicated a Toaster error. They fixed it w/o question in a few days (paid
for overnight shipping in both directions too!).
This time, the Toaster was preventing my system from powering up, and I
had isolated it to the Toaster board, so they couldn't really say 'must be
your Amiga'.
I have found that a pleasant tone of voice and courtesy will get me a lot
further with any of these phone jockeys. Could this be your problems?
(Though I could see as to how you might be a little annoyed with them by
now. :^)
Maybe your luck will change with the new year? (One can hope.)
Thanks,
Erik Flom
I know of no "special numbers" used by high-profile users. As for NewTek
giving those high-profile users extra special care? Geez, cut them some
slack! Now you're after them because they're milking some of the best P.R.
they've had yet? Trust me, every company milks their high-profile users
for P.R., and they do give them extra help.
I have to admit that was a sarcasatic remark that I don't for a minute
believe. I keep having the sense that NewTek is lurking and that maybe
they can be goaded into a comeback since they are insensitive to requests,
pleas and repeat request and pleas.
wmc – via Autopilot!
I think you're expecting too much from NewTek. The big dream in the
computer industry is to come up with a hot product, make lots of cash,
then get out of the business before the company dies.
NewTek has already done the first 2. You think they went to all the bother
of inventing the Toaster to make people happy. WRONG! They did it to make
money. As long as they're doing that what do they care what you thing of
them?????
James Hebert bought a Cessna Citation , I'm told. Being a pilot I KNOW
what the cost was (about 2.5 million) and what the per hour operting costs
are (about 8k figuring fuel, insurance and maint). So they NEED to keep
making monye to support the jet. How did they make it originally?
Providing a tool AND support.
I would almost be willing to bet that rather than hire needed resources to
do the mac thing andmaintain support, NewTek pulled all the tech support
people to do the Mac-link development and marketting figuring that
amigoids are not worth treating as professionals even if making a living
with Toasters. I suspect a transference of the animosity they feel toward
CBM to all Amiga Toaster users.
wmc – via Autopilot!
'Scuse me while I get out my soapbox…
It doesn't seem to me that speculation regarding a person's personal
finances are appropriate for this forum. If I want that kind of stuff, I'd
pick up the trash tabloid rag at the grocery store checkout.
'Sides, I've been to James's home — and (no offence, James) it isn't any
Silicon Valley – style mansion… don't know what your information source
was (in typical tabloid style, source was unidentified)…
Okay, enough soapbox for know…
Later, Luke Montgomery
Source – Lee Stranahan. Happy :^}
wmc – via Autopilot!
James Hebert is NewTek's writer of documentation – he was once part of tech
support, too. I doubt he bought the plane you described. And assuming you
simply mixed up someone's name – well, it's all speculation. All it takes
is for one person to say "we got a company plane" and another to repeat it
as "we bought a company plane" and so on… until we see the receipts, it's
all hype and speculation. It would make much more sense for it to be a
leased plane. NewTek most often flies commercial, as far as I know. Both
Tim Jenison and his wife are pilots, and enjoy flying.
I could have mixed up Tim and Jim (can't keep 'em straight). But they
offered to send the plane to pick up Lee Stranahan for an interview before
he went to work for them for that short period of time in '91 I believ it
was.
Regardless, I have no problem with people enjoying the fruits of their
success – I'd like to make the money then get my hands on an old P-40 so I
can retire the PA-28R. It was just more stuff to try to goad any NewTek
lurkers.
wmc – via Autopilot!
You've done a great job of demonstrating why NewTek says they don't like
the online services for tech support or "company presence." (Keep in mind
that I obviously feel different here, as an online junkie, but I'm trying
to explain what they've explained to me… I've tried to get them to
improve their online support, but it's an uphill battle.)
"It was just more stuff to try to goad any NewTek lurkers." Oh, I see –
make more and more inflammatory statements, just to get them to respond?
This childish approach to online communications chases away more people
than it attracts. This sort of "goading" had almost driven me away from
online support, too. No more than a few days ago, some Internet wanker,
obviously an English major, posted a message stating little more (and I
quote) than "InterChange Plus SUCKS." He's never called for tech support
to diagnose or repair his bugs. He suffered a bug from the first release
of ICP on some '040 systems. Yet he's ready to tell the world he's upset,
and that our product isn't any good…
Networks are a great equalizer – we don't get all those other real-world
clues that someone is less than sincere or less than adept.
Mr Cole: You would be well advised to confirm such outrageous statements as
"James Hebert just bought a Cessna Citation" with a reliable source prior
to contributing to the spread of such allegations. I do not now, nor have I
ever, owned an airplane. Despite your claim that Lee Stranahan was the
source, you should be aware that Lee separated from NewTek over 4 months
ago to pursue his own Toasterrelated career. Further, to clarify any
confusion surrounding my name, I do not go by "Jim," and find it difficult
to confuse "James" with "Tim." I would appreciate being contacted prior to
thch viral comments in the future. It's a consideration I would afford
anyone else, that of confirming the accuracy of statements before
presenting them as fact in a public forum.
James Hebert 12/28/92
Three cheers for your reply to Mr. Cole about the "Cessna" rumor.
I had already questioned his source for the "trash tabloid-style" posting
consisting of unattributed / unnamed sources… Further, when the "source"
was named, it turned out that the source is not what would be considered a
"qualified" source.
Ya know, I thought about calling you about this flame, but I figured either
you (a) wouldn't beleive that this could be a forum for that kind of
garbage or (b) you'd hear about it sooner or later even though it might
take a while (they say sludge (as in his rumor message) moves slowly <g>…
I certainly hope that folks will realize that this is a GREAT place for the
exchange of INTELLIGENT ideas — not personal rumors… Like I said
before, if I wanted to read THAT kind of innuendo (sp?), rumors, and
general crap, I'll buy a tabloid at the checkout stand… something which I
REFUSE to do!
Hmmm… guess this means you must be a "public figure" now, huh? <GRIN!!!>
Take care, hope you had a happy holiday (even if it WAS in T-town! <yuk,
yuk>)
Regards, Pat t t t t
I admitted to the possibility that I may have confused the names on my own
accord. So I gather that you are saying that Mr. Stanahan was lying when
he mentioned an offer to be picked up by the company jet to be flown to
the interview in Topeka about the time of the Long Beach AmeExpo? I was
surprised as I have freind in a similar situation as you and Tim and the
backers made him surrender his pilot license and sign a contract barring
flight in anything other than regular commercial flights as a protection
of thier interests in the company. That is one reason it stuck in my
mind. The other was that the cost of such a plane seemed to indicate that
more Toasters had been sold than I had ever immagined up to that time.
BTW, nice move to distract from the central issue of "profit drunkeness
leading to poor customer support". Touche.
wmc – via Autopilot!
This is Lee Stranahan speaking…
I haven't been on CIS for a while, and to come back and see it implying
that I am a liar is pretty disconcerting.
First, I was not AT the Long Beach AmiExpo…
Second, NewTek owns a jet – James Hebert does not. It's good that NewTek
has a jet, because they've earned it.
Since I wasn't at the show, what are you thinking about?
Wayne, you're wandering afield of the truth… NewTek is not really in any
other markets at this time. Yes, they just shipped out beta units of the
ToasterLink/Mac version, a SCSI link between an Amiga-equipped Toaster and
a Mac. When it ships for real – who knows. It's debatable whether we
should really call that an abandonment of the Amiga market. After all,
it's causing Mac owners to buy Amigas, isn't it? I think it's great news,
it broadens my market, it broadens everyone's market.
More than two years ago, I hacked together the "PC Toaster" – a simple
Visual BASIC program under Windows that sent ARexx commands to an
off-the-shelf Toaster over the serial port. At COMDEX, this won Windows
magazine's "Win" award. Indistinguishable from a rigged demo, indeed.
If I knew of NewTek making a board for another machine, I'd need to keep my
mouth shut. I know nothing about such a board. If they do have one in
development, I'm sure they're keeping it VERY quiet. There is competition
out there. From the tone of some of your messages, I think you're
recommending that NewTek give up and play dead because they haven't given
you the personal attention you want. I'm sure they won't roll over just
yet. I do hope they answer your questions.
There's a lot of reasons why I think NewTek won't abandon the Amiga as a
base platform: multitasking, graphics, sound, modularity, present customer
base, developer support, etc. It would take an insane amount of effort to
re-create what they've built for the Amiga. Testarossa and corporate
airship aside, I don't think they've got the manpower to gear up to that
task. Everyone there is very busy on the Amiga version. The
ToasterLink/Mac version was done by an out-of-house, non-Topeka programmer.
John,
I'm only suggesting (oops – I'm actually stating) that they have abandoned
the Amiga market as far as technical support is concerned. I am only
conjecturing why they would do that. Considering their accomplishments to
date, they are not stupid boys and girls. Thinking individuals who want
to keep repeat business as well as expand markets would realize that
quality after market support can make the differnce between a product that
has a long market run and one that has a short one. The only reason to
quit offering support in any particulare market is 'cause you plan to
leave it (witness the way the Amiga wordperfect online support dried up
and the phone support slowly withered thereafter. NewTek is just found a
way to wither it faster – but hey, thats progress right?)
Under what circumstances would your company issue "canned" solutions to
every problem on the phone (except for the cut-and-dried 'it died'
scenarios)? Like " you have a non-stnadard motherboard" or definitely
your accelerator – not our software…". Under what rational would you
advise your tech support not to answer hardcopy and electronic example
problem reports and/or promise to call abck then repeatedly fail to call
back to the point of forgetting the original problem report? I thik the
only answer can be, "when I want that segment of the market to go away as
it is coasting more than I can realize in profits from it."
BTW, I am not the only one who has had this difficulty with them
especially since about July. NewTek support just appears to have dried
up.
And again I ask the question, if, unlike you and Black Belt and ASDG etc,
they are not going to provide files and support here on CIS, why do they
still have a free bit and a forum? It leads to false expectations and
increased frustration to users. (SYSOPs feel free to chime in on this
point…)
wmc – via Autopilot!
The only thing I have to "chime in" about at this point is that you seem
to be on a one man campaign to convince people to stay away from NewTek.
If I were in your position, I would be upset as well. Is this really the
first company that wouldn't return your tech support calls? GVP and other
companies have done that to me a number of times, and to other people as
well (and I have had them call me back too)….but I don't go around
spreading rumors that those companies are abandoning tech support for the
Amiga. According to what you've said, they certainly dropped the ball in
your case, and probably in others as well. That does not mean they've
abandoned tech support the Amiga market. It simply means they've dropped
the ball in those cases. I'm not defending what they did or didn't do,
I'm just telling you what I've seen. Look at Erik's problem with the
Toaster. If they had abandoned the Amiga, they wouldn't have helped him.
Just my two cents.
Steve
Steve,
Tech support means more than just responding ro warranty replacement
issues. Now I'll get off the goading provocatuer soapbox and onto the
straiht talk box. I have worked problems with DEC, Intel Motorola,
Microsoft, PerSoft, JPI, Borland, Pacpage, et. al. In all instances when
I had a problem that was beyond the run of the mill, the ones that
required sending files, being talked through diagnostics or tests, written
procedures for problem recreation, these companies worked with me to
determine the source of the problem. If the problem was theirs, they
fixed it. Sometimes they provided workaround patches/fixes even when the
problem was not with their product. NewTek no longer does this (if they
ever did). Their tech support is similar or a little worse than say, Gold
Disk. If a problem isn't in the pre-ordained list, they aren't interested
in helping. Now, they protest to the contrary, saying that they handle
every call etc. but then on the calls when they say to send stuff in, they
never deal with the stuff it may take you 4 hours or a day or whatever to
put together. They don't follow through and as a professional user of
their product they do not support you when the problem is not a pre-solved
one. Therefore, when dealing with people who MUST have reliability, that
type of support must be considered. So I have no choice but to tell these
pople when I am being paid to advise them that the Toaster may be a reat
tool – when everything is working O.K. – but when it is not, if they
expect or need quick efficient and attentive service, NewTek, for whatever
reason will not/cannot provide that level of service.
One Interactive TV company I did some work for relegated the Toaster to a
proof of concept demo machine after finding what they termed "Serious
technical and software flaws". They spend many manhours detailing all the
problems, and never got return calls from NewTek. They eventually quit
using thedevice altogether as there were "more hours spent debugging
<continued>
Mr. Cole, Give your vendetta a rest. At least on CIS.
I pay good money to retrieve massive information which includes tricks,
tips, good contacts, etc. That does not include page-long paragraphs
within multiple page letters from a disgruntled user on ONE, single,
bloody topic! And that, occuring over the course of WEEKS!
I have nearly become blind and numbed from your open war with NewTek.
One letter on your dissatisfaction was sufficient. More, should be
considered abuse of not only this system, but its patrons. You have
succeeded, not in portraying yourself as a professional in any fashion,
but a verbal rumour and war monger. You, sir, are a bitter and obsessed
man, and I would understand anyones reluctance to interact with you in any
fashion, including NewTek.
It was made clear, long ago, by NewTek that they would not have direct
technical support in this Forum. It was also made clear by many of its
patrons that all are fed up with your obsessive deluges.
We know your opinions. They've been hammered into us with your
aforementioned letters.
Leave your mail to NewTek in E-MAIL. You'll find just as much interest
from us in your letters there, as in here.
Vance – Fed up and not interested in your multi-paged response.
Vance,
"You, sir, are a bitter and obsessed man, and I would understand anyones
reluctance to interact with you in any fashion, including NewTek."
NOOOTTT! ;^}
I was never anythig but nice on the phone, followed NewTek's instructions
to the letter about what to send them, and they flat ignored the material,
my requests for an answer. Plain and simple. Repeating the fact does
nomake one bitter. It is a service to those professionals who may need
quick efficient support of Toaster problem other than the dreaded green
screen "Toaster Not Responiding".
You apparently are the one with the chip on your shoulder. I responded
toow someone who was asking if they were the only one who had not received
support form NewTek. Several other people also reported the problem. I
was merely one of those. Continued attempts to defend NewTek were
accorded my reponse. (It is impolite not to reply when someone is talking
to you). Yes I poked fun and was sarcastic about them, and I admitted it.
I did not get personal, and was quite calm, and mostly tongue in cheek in
my mood. So your ESP and assessment of me are very wrong.
Hope your blood pressure goes down before serious damage is done. It was
not my intent to rile you, but to get NewTek to re-evalutate their tech
support operation and perhaps take it to the next level. Their number of
units sold seem to inidicate that at least a revamping of procedures for
handling problem reports is needed at least if not also tech support staff
increases. My contention, if it was not obvious to you, is that not
enough resource is devoted to the non-run-of-the-mill problem contacts.
This is not to say the tech supporters are not qualified, but more likely
overworked/overloaded and not organized in such a way as to see that all
requests get at least a response even if not a solution.
As for wasting your time on non-tips and tricks stuff – what are you
expecting from a "NewTek where are you?" thread (which I didn't start,
<continued>
AutoPilot cannot differentiate between threads, so all of your mail is
received.
The question of "NewTek – Where Are You?" was answered by NewTek. I access
this forum because of the important information which users want to share
about using the Toaster.
You had made your opinion long ago and everyone has noted it. Since NewTek
hasn't reacted here, take that hint and go back to telephoning and writing
to them.
The situation here is, the majority of Toaster users claim they were
treated well by NewTek. But because, for one reason or another you were
not, you have claimed NewTek support is failing everyone.
When I saw all of your mail, it did not read as
humourous/tongue-in-cheek/sarcasm. If I have misunderstood your situation,
I apologize. I only hope that you will put in some form of pointer, when
you are using some of that barbed wit.
I have expressed myself on this matter for a second and last time.
Continue to write your letters. I only hope that you will throw in some
"how-to's" as well, from time-to-time.
Vance
BTW)?
wmc – via Autopilot!
Personally, I find it interesting that such scathing letters go unanswered.
I am currently deciding whether to invest money(and company time) in a
toaster setup, so I am very interested in people reactions with New-Tek.
Currently, New-Tek has not been responding to complaints brought to this
surface in this forum. If this is truely a vendor support forum, then I
think New-Tek needs to re-think their involvement here and *provide*
technical support or rename the area to New-Tek User Forum. Investing in
quality equipment is not cheap and I would not like to have it end up a
doorstop.
K. Welty
Hear hear.
According to what I've heard, this is not a tech support area. Just a
general inquiries area.
Vance
When someone asks an intelegent question about the Toaster, their questions
get answered. When the forum is filled with gossip and
Tabloid type psudo-factoids, we choose to ignore it…. Any questions???
BobAnderson NewTek TechSupport
Toaster problems then producing useable work". If anyone has received
help working out a sticky problem with NewTek, I'd like to know them as
I've onlybeen able to find two types of supported people: those who had
"it died" type problems and got prompt board replacements (even if a week
of phone calling was required to convince them that green screen Toater
Not responding was not from hooking it up wrong) and those with more
subtle problems who cannot get any help from NewTek other than, " must be
a bad motherboard" or "youraccelerator is bad".
wmc – via Autopilot!
I'm not going to second-guess why NewTek didn't answer your questions.
You're jumping to all sorts of conclusions that I don't see: they didn't
answer your question, therefore they're cutting support, therefore they're
leaving the Amiga behind, therefore they're hunting for a way to murder
Irving Gould… When I visited NewTek a few weeks ago, I know I saw the
tech support room with three-four guys in it, all on the phone, working up
until closing time on a Friday before the company party. They're still
there.
As for the complications of motherboard revisions and accelerator troubles;
all I can say is, I'm glad I don't make a hardware product in the Amiga
market. Three yahoos in a garage can make an add-on board, hype it to
three dozen people on the networks who buy it assuming it's the Next Big
Thing, and then suddenly six dozen Amiga software and hardware companies
are faced with incompatibility reports, all ready to blame their product
and not the hardware from Three Guys Inc.
Those motherboard and accelerator problems exist. I've fought them for
years. I'm still fighting them – I've got a $1900 GVP '040 board sitting
on the shelf going to waste because it wouldn't work with my 6.2 A2000 and
assorted SCSI peripherals – with or without the Toaster in the system.
Your all missing Waynes point and *judging* him for making it.
The simple point is that when you make a significant investment in high end
hardware, you *expect* a certain level of support. That is not to say that
you can expect an all knowing tech support group, merely a helpful and
positive one that *tries* to work out your problems.
I have had several mmmmh run-ins with Tech Support at Newtek..sometimes
I've been handled nicely (whether the problem was resolved or not) and
other times I've been treated as a pariah.
This forum IS the place to yell and scream about your problems. It IS the
Newtek forum. For those of us who depend on high quality support being
available for this product..balancing the feedback on this forum is
important. I think it wrong to belittle a pleasant users scream for help.
He is NOT trashing the product (a la your example on Internet) merely
stating that in HIS opinion tech sup sucks. That he has floated trial
balloons to try and figure out WHY he has received a poor level of support
is perfectly reasonable. That others (Eric) have suggested that he was
unlucky is also reasonable.
Lastly, most successful Hardware and Software companies have learned that
to make it *in the long run* the two areas to spend a lot of
money/resources on are : R&D and User-Support. NewTek have produced a great
product..but competition is rearing its head – The Fast electronics
switcher/A/B roll/Twin TBC/DVE/Twin Frame Buffers/Multi-platform product at
$4,000 is very enticing at the low end…the Matrox product equally
enticing at the high end. I knew of these products 18 months before their
release. As just a little Joe Schmo…I know zippo about NewTeks future
direction. Given the amount of money and time I've sunk into this product,
that concerns me. SK.
So you're saying you get better tech support after spending $2,000 on Sony
equipment, as compared to NewTek hardware? I doubt it. As I've said
several times, I'm not here to defend NewTek's support, whatever it might
be.
When Wayne himself admitted he was making inflammatory statements just to
"flush out" NewTek, he lost a lot of credibility, I think.
As for FAST – well, we'll be able to compare it when it really ships. They
certainly emulate the Toaster when it comes to demos and announcements well
in advance of shipment. 🙂 I saw it at COMDEX, it looked very nice. I
doubt they'll bundle as much software with it as the Toaster, and that
could again double your price on the Mac or PC. NewTek's been good at
that, too. DigiView was the same story: very inexpensive hardware bundled
with lots of cool software.
>>When Wayne himself admitted he was making inflammatory statements >>just
to "flush out" NewTek, he lost a lot of credibility, I think.
But you have to admit, it did work !
I agree w/ you about the FAST! product, its specs are great and they *say*
its shipping but I don't know how stable it is. Having A/B roll s/w is a
real big plus though. Especially at this price level.
No, it DIDN'T WORK. He "succeeded" in proving *exactly* why some companies
(NewTek included, apparently) don't like to deal with flaming weasels on
the networks. At least people tend to be polite on the phone, even when
stressed!
Until I see a product (hw or sw), it's vapourware to me. I remember an ad
in a video mag about a year ago, boasting a Mac Toaster killer. Fizzled.
It was half-hearted effort.
Vance
I agree that Wayne lost credibility, but it also interesting to see that
NewTek responded mostly to Wayne's statements and nothing about the title
of this thread.
I still would like to know if they wish to still participate here as a
vendor or if, as suggested by Steve, it is time to move to the ARTS forum
and open a *toaster* section there. Either way we'll continue to toast
through '93, and lend our support.
Happy Holidays,
Joe Maulucci >>> AP ENGAGED
John,
It wasn't one question. It was multiple. On tow occasions THEY requested
I send the stuff to them. I wasted my valuable time fulfilling THEIR
request for files, written material, examples etc, and when I comply I get
NO response except a terse 'we'll call you' a month after the second
reminder, then nothing at all. Even after explaining that a job was
riding on a fix/workaround. A simple "we can't solve it" would even have
been an exceptable professional response. But silence bespeaks a "____
you" attitude that comes from thinking you are better than your customers
and that they are not deserving of your support.
wmc – via Autopilot!
I'd love to chime in here but I can see just outside my window that my car
is about ready to be twoed off.
Must be a wrong-side-of-the-street day in NYC?
wmc – via Autopilot!
Jim,
Clever– but I think it went ofar some heads.
— JG
<licensed to fly>
Could'a been. Thanks for watching!
You're assuming what their attitude is – maybe they can't fix your problem.
Maybe they can't reproduce it. Of course, they should tell you so…
John,
I would have been completely satisfied with "can't reproduce/solve it".
(Not happy, but…) I would have even been satisfied and tolerant of,
"we'd like to have you send us the files but if you did we probaly won't
be able to look at them." A little more accuracy in what to expect would
be nice.
I know the individual tech supports try, but the sensation I get when
having talked to them, especially after 2.0 is that they are overloaded
and approaching "customer burn-out". That is not the techies problem but
a management one. I'm hoping thier management will see the wisdom of
reviewing and prehaps improving the tech support operation. (My hunch is
that it would require additional people).
wmc – via Autopilot!
This happens to companies that make popular products, and not only in the
tech support departments. I do think NewTek will need to make some quantum
jumps in their in-house support and consideration for tech support. One
thing that will help to force improvement, actually, will be the release of
the ToasterLink/Mac. they've had to take a fresh look at many tech support
problems because of it.
Newtek is worried because Brown Wagh is about to release Studio Magic for
$499 retail. It is just like Toaster but without all the software. You
don't even need TBC's.
It's gonna kick the slats out of Newtek, which is OK because Brown Wagh
will port the thing for the 4000 and AGA.
Their precious little Toaster won't be the heart throb of the DTV crowd.
Unlike Newtek and C=, BW and the hardware cloners are working together.
I hope yer joking their dude.$499 for a device capable of doing the same
things as a Toaster?Seems a bit Far Fetched or will be lousy quality
Video.
Yes, it would be nice if NewTek would work more closely with third party
developers.
It would help EVERYONE.
No Longer Toastin' :^(
Erik Flom
Paul,
I don't think NewTek is worried at all. Maybe you were joking?
— JG
<licensed to fly>